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Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - joegrundy

I am very grateful for the advice I have received here from those who know far more about cars than I do.

I run a 2004 x-type, 157k miles. I trust it to my local indy, always with the instruction 'do what do what needs doing, call me if the bill will be more than the car is worth'.

About 6 weeks ago, I had it serviced and MoTd, asked for tracking etc. to be done, they switched wheels front to back, re-balanced them, etc. (£300)

And I set off for a trip to France, did 1150 miles, including motorway at 80+ mph. 50 miles from home, overhesating, rescued. My indy changed thermostat (£90) but this didn't fix it. Then he changed water pump (£140), seems to have done the job.

Last Friday, I took the car into ATS - I had a slow puncture. The guy put it up on the ramp and showed me the tyres (Pirelli PZero I bought very cheap on these wheels 6 months ago). Rubber cracked, weak points, etc.

Declining ATS quotes, I had new tyres fitted yesterday at a well-trusted local fitter (cheapest tyres via Asda website but with 5%discount) and a brief roadtest shows good ride, grip, and economy. £164 fitted, balanced etc. for 4, 225 x 17 x 45.

The guy who runs the fitter firm (i've known him for 25 years) is a good guy. No pretence, no fancy premises, just does the job.

They also have the latest computer wheel alighnment kit. No charge if no adjustment is needed, £30 for adjustment. So I had the car done. Showed that it was way out, so adjusted. Needed a blowtorch on track rod ends - obviously they hadn't been touched for quite a while.

Job done, took the car for a drive. Steering whell wasn't centered, took it back. Back on to the computer set-up, alighnment way out. Re-sat (no charge) and have gone for a 200 mile roadtest today. Handling, road noise, ride comfort fine. (Fitter's firm says bring car back for a re-balance, re-alighnment check, etc., for free, next week).

So here's the point. My 'trusted' indy does tyres, exhausts, Mot. He/they obviously hadn't done the tracking as requested. When they balanced/tracked/switched the wheels back to front they hadn't seen that (although there was plenty of tread) the tyres were so old (14 years) there were so many cracks between the treads, and weak/bulging bits (I dread to think what may have happened at 130kmh+). What else did they miss?

I'm sad, beacuse I know this guy, and I've been happy that he's made a go of his business. But, I think, he's got too big too soon, and has lost the trust he once had.

I am tempted to have a chat with him to explain why things are going wrong. But I'm not sure how that would go. Any thoughts?

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - gordonbennet

There's another way to look at this, you sound like the ideal customer, you'll allow them a free reign and pay the bill at the end, now in an ideal world people like you should be well looked after, but in practice loyal regular customers who always pay up get taken for granted whilst they bend over backwards to please insufferable here today gone tomorrow twerps who can't be pleased and might well be the type to query or welch on the bill....i know this happens cos i'm like you Joe Grundy, but they lose out because if we've been taken for chumps they never have to worry about us darkening their doorsteps again eh?

It could be that the new garage are overegging the pudding a bit about the state of the TRE's needing heat etc, but i wasn't there so don't know if you actually witnessed heat being needed.

I would go with what your gut tells you about the people at both places you are dealing with.

There, thats about as much help as a slap round the back of the head with a wet fish innit..:-)

Edited by gordonbennet on 05/04/2016 at 19:08

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - joegrundy

Thanks for your view, gordon. I try not be cynical, but I was an old bill for 30 years and here in my local environment those who matter know that.

I have known the guy who owns my local indy for quite some time. He's a good guy. But ... he's got very busy, taken on new staff, expanded, etc. Nowadays, I'm not so confident that I can discuss the car with him, and so on. And I'm not so confident about what I'm told.

As to the tyre place - I was in school with this guy. His business is almost exclusively built on word of mouth and his missis rules the place with a rod of iron. There's no glass palace reception, plenty of signs saying 'no customers beyond here', etc.

I watched the guy as he did my car (as close as he was) and passed stuff as necessary. Yes, we did need a blowtorch. I like this sort of place because you can actually see what's going on. It was very clear that the TREs hadn't been moved for quite a while.

What p***es me off is this. I try to live my life trusting people (although I'm ex old bill). I am happy to pay the going rate for work to be done on my car, but I expect to be treated as honestly as I treat the people I deal with. Is that too much to expect?

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - gordonbennet
What p***es me off is this. I try to live my life trusting people (although I'm ex old bill). I am happy to pay the going rate for work to be done on my car, but I expect to be treated as honestly as I treat the people I deal with. Is that too much to expect?

Yes, it is.

I've spent my life assuming other people have decency and honour, from the days when a man's word and handshake meant something, almost without fail over the last 30 years in particular they've proved me wrong time after another and i've finally come to accept that this is how it really is.

The fish has rotted from the head down, we are led and have been for decades from the very top, and with honourable exceptions most of whom are now dead, by liars cheats con men spivs and wide boys/girls lining their own pockets, with various accolytes hanging onto their skirts for the droppings from the head table, its permeated down in a monkey see monkey do way these things will, withga good bit of celeb culture innit thrown in to keep the masses entertained/controlled...yes i have become extremely cynical, wasn't always like this but learned the lessons of truth along the way.

Sorry didn't mean to post such a rant, it just sort of flowed by itself, don't need to preach to you, as old bill you'll have seen and heard it all.

Edited by gordonbennet on 05/04/2016 at 20:05

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - joegrundy

So I'm thinking, is now the time to give up my Jag (and it's a wonderful car for soaking up motorway miles) and go for a PCP deal on a Dacia (Logan 1.2 ambience is the one I fancy).

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - gordonbennet

I suggest, and i mean this most sincerely folks...you have to be a certain age, answers on a postcard....that you should try a selection of modern cars out before even thinking of such a plan, the reality of modern cars doesn't hold up to the hype in my opinion.

I'm sticking firmly with my older stuff and will be staying Japanese too for the reliability and general ease of repair when needed.

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - joegrundy

My son has a Dacia 1.2 Ambience on PCP. £109 a month including service, breakdown, etc. (Deposit funded by the Bank of Dad, partly because the Bank of Dad got p***ed off by necessary payments for heaps of s*** which had no future expectations).

My concerns are that whilst I love my car, there will come a time when it is unecomical to maintain.

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - joegrundy

Blimey, Gordon - I didn;t mean to set you off! Try a glass of dark rum (works wonders here).

There's no doubt in my mind that the local indy garages tend to get more popular and grow beyond what they started as.

I'd still be interested in your opinions - should I take the proprietor of my local indy (a friend) out for a beer and explain what's going wrong? Or just ignore it and try and find someone else?

The tyre fitter firm boss I referred to earlier is much more down to earth, and is much more amenable to a bit of fing and blinding.

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - Avant

Joe - maybe a polite letter to your indy - not too long but succinctly setting out the problems, and suggesting you have a friendly chat as a supporter of family businesses like his - might be a start. How he replies - if indeed he does - could govern whether you find another or stick with him.

It can so easily happen that small businesses grow and the founder forgets the customer service that helped him/her to grow in the first place. Plumbers are a classic example of this.

As to the Jaguar, is it perhaps at the 'one more major problem and that's it' stage? What's happened isn't catastrophic or unusual for a car with 157k on the clock, so if you're still enjoying it you could carry on for a bit and see how it goes. Mondeos can last a lot longer than that, and the oily bits of yours are much the same I think.

When the time does come, then you've got to think what you really want - a newer 'quality' car, say seven years old with 70,000 up, or a new / nearly-new runabout.

Edited by Avant on 06/04/2016 at 00:24

Jaguar X-Type 2.0d 157k - Random thoughts on driving an old car - and 'trust - joegrundy

Avant - thanks for your comments, appreciated.

I had a long chat with my son about this - he is a contemporary and friend of my Indy. My son ran a succession of cheapo 'bangers' and in the past the Indy was very good - finding the cheapest 'fixes' and even being happy to fit a cheap clutch pack bought via the internet (with the usual caveats, of c0urse).

(As a side thought, you actually need a fair bit of capital to run a 'cheapo', to pay for unexpected stuff or scrap and buy another, especially if you can't be without a car. That's why my son bought a Dacia on PCP and I don't think he's alone.)

He's raised these issues with the Indy as best as he can - it's almost always been a case of 'not really time for a good talk now, very busy, we'll meet up for a beer'. Doesn't happen of course.

He employs a couple of older guys who seem to know what they're doing but increasingly some younger ones who can change tyres, exhausts, etc. but don't give you confidence. And I note that if there's a problem there's very little time/interest in discussing symptoms. Sometimes there seems to ba an arrogance - 'you don't know what you're talking about, we'll plug the computer in'.

There have been some very good experiences. For example, I had a duff battery. He sent two guys in a van, jump started it, took it and fitted a new battery, brought it back, and only charged a very reasonable price for the battery. I had problems changing a headlight bulb, took it in, bulb changed, no charge (not even for bulb).

It's a confidence thing, I think. For example, as described, the thermostat and waterpump have been changed and all seems fine now. But, I've noticed a 'whispering' noise (a bit like driving along with a window slightly open) when the engine's running.Something to do with the heater/vent or something, it wasn't there before. Nothing to worry about, I'm sure, but in idle moments you wonder whether some hose wasn't reconnected properly/ a clip wasn't tightened. Turn the radio up and you don't notice it. When I used to fix my own cars I'd have spent hours locating and sorting it. (When I first had my M1000 I managed to locate a minor rattle from the engine. The oil filler cap was 1/8 turn loose!).

As to the Jag, I know that the X type is viewed as an abomination by purists. (I noted that the thermostat is shared with Transits). But of all the cars I've had and driven I think it's the one I'm most pleased with. Cost me £2700 three years ago and was a 'risky' purchase but has performed well. One day I'll sit down and do a spreadsheet of all I've spent - I suspect that the cost per mile will be very reasonable, especially as depreciation is not a factor. My annual trips to Andorra (hopefully to be repeated this year if I'm invited) involve 2500+ miles, so far without incident, in considerable comfort and quite economically (50+ mpg).

I suspect heart will rule head for a while to come yet.

Thanks again for the comments.

Edited by joegrundy on 09/04/2016 at 10:45