VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 08:52
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - pat76

Hello

This is my first post on these forums, although I have scoured through them regularly and find them to be the best non-biased forums I could find!

My predicament. My Passat 2.0 FSI 55 plate is nearing the 100k mile mark, and we are looking for a change of car. Potentially we may increase our family to 3 children so this has to be taken into account. MPVs are out of the question though, so it is a family saloon/hatch or estate that is required. £6-8,000 is the budget

I have toyed with the idea of going diesel - I do 15000 approx per year, 50/50 A roads and city centres. For our money we can only find relatively high mileage diesels (50-60,000) and I am very wary of the potential costs of the diesel engine - DMF (£800), Injectors, Turbo (£1500) etc...

My head on the other hand is thinking about cash outlay and risk - I'm now thinking just to go down the naturally aspirated petrol engine route, where the engines are simpler and less to go wrong from a used perspective (i.e. with no warranty). I can get a Mazda 6 hatchback or estate for example that does 39mpg, not bad for a petrol engine.

On the other hand I could theoretically get a used diesel engine that will do 50mpg and will never go wrong, but something tells me to steer clear of modern diesels unless there is a significant warranty attached, or they are nearly-new low mileage models.

I don't expect any magic answers from anyone, but just your experiences. For what it's worth, I get more of the 'excited' feel when looking at petrols, rather than the 'what could go wrong' feel when looking at diesels.

Thanks for your input!

Paul

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 14:54
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - SteveLee

A mazda 6 or Mondeo petrol estate will be the most dependable and practical car, if you have been lucky enough to find a reliable 55 reg Passat then I'd keep that - surely it's a pretty big car? If the engine has lasted 100K miles then there's no reason why it shouldn't last 200k miles. These engines have a handful of known issues - I would have expected it to go bang by now if it was a dodgy one.

There's always a chance of buyinhg a lemon regardless or type/brand of car which is why I'd be inclined to stick with the devil I know unless there's a compelling reason to change.

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 20:48
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - pat76

Thanks for that - the current Passat is the petrol version which, unlike the diesels, was never really affected by anything serious in terms of engine failure, simply because it doesn't have a) a turbo, b) injectors and c) a high pressure oil pump. All of these were at fault in the PD 2.0 TDIs and is why I wouldn't touch one with a bargepole, even with a years warranty.

You are right in thinking the Passat will go on for much longer as I'm sure it would. It feels solid even to this day, however as with everything else as it gets older, so does other somewhat 'unnecessary' toys. Such as the steering column lock fault. I have had this three times this year when the car will refuse to start. This is a £350 fix from VW and not part of any recal. Then there is a rare intermittent fault I've had with the throttle body which causes an engine fault and puts the car in limp mode. Finally there are the completely unnecessary electronic parking brakes. Although these have been faultless so far, I am expecting with age to have another circa £500 bill when these go wrong. Finally, I don't mind saying that I like a change every 4 years or so, and there is no better reason than that!

I'll have to see over the weekend how the Mazda 6/Mondeo petrols drive and which one I am happier with - Mondeo probably more solid, Mazda probably more fun with more toys.

We'll see!

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 21:09
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - pinkpanther_75

I have run both new and second hand petrols and diesels over that last few years.

I currently have a Yeti 2.0 CR 110 BHP. This is under manufacturers warranty and comes fully equipped with all sorts of costly items, such a DPF, DMF, Turbo etc. Not sure how confident I'd be running it out of warranty. My Fuelly account tells me I average 46mpg and it costs me 13.9p for every mile I cover.

My other car is an 11 year old petrol Octavia. This is turbocharged and 4x4. Fuelly tells me this averages 29 mpg and costs me 22p per mile covered.

My understanding of diesels are that the last of the VAG 1.9 PD TDi's are about as reliable as they come. They are mainly pre DPF, although are a bit "agricultural" ? I ran a Roomster 1.9 TDi for a year and found this great fun with a Revo remap.

I also ran one of the newer low capacity turbocharged petrol units (1.2 TSi 105 BHP) in a Yeti for 10K miles. This was a sweet little engine, but a bit overawed in the Yeti. The fuel economy was closer to my 1.8T 20V than the 2.0 CR TDi.

How about a 1.4 TSi in a new shape Passat? A colleague runs one of these in a Golf and beats my diesel Yeti for fuel economy.

Another work colleague currently runs a 2005 2.0 TDi Passat and has recently suffered oil pump drive failure, which wrecked the engine.

I have also run 2 cars with the VAG 1.8 TSi engine (160 BHP). This effectively replaced your 2.0 FSi and is a great engine. Cam chain and reasonably economical, given its performance potential (0-60 <8 seonds / >40 mpg in an Octavia).

I too find the electric parking brake a bit of a liability and am pleased Skoda have yet to release a model equipped with one of these.

Edited by Seant on 09/11/2012 at 21:14

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 21:59
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - pat76
Very interesting post, thanks. I've seen a few if the 1.8tsi Passats around, however it is just out of reach with my budget for this particular car, plus the estate version would be even more expensive!

However you strike a chord with me in that out of any warranty I am wary of running an engine with a dmf, DPF and a turbo. Only today at work I listened to a colleagues recent problems which was that they had to scrap a car worth £2,500 because all 4 injectors and a turbo needed replacing. Rare situation I know, but just makes you think. I'm using that same value in my car to help purchase another!!

At the end of the day once I've made my decision I know I'll be happy, it's just getting there first!!!
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Fri 9 Nov 2012 22:13
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - pinkpanther_75
Only today at work I listened to a colleagues recent problems which was that they had to scrap a car worth £2,500 because all 4 injectors and a turbo needed replacing. Rare situation I know, but just makes you think.

Interesting comment that regarding colleagues cars.

Amongst my work colleagues I can recall the following (all within the last 6 months):

2005 55 plate Renault Megane scrapped as the engine blew up on the motorway (ran on it's own oil until it seized).

2005 Peugeot 807 2.2 TDi - Snapped cambelt, resulting in a destroyed engine and the car being scrapped.

2009 59 Plate Corsa CDTi - replacement Turbo and EGR at 60K miles (2 weeks out of warranty). The car has now been "off the road" with a Vauxhall main dealer for 2 months with problems thought to relate to the DPF. Main dealer / Vauxhall seemingly unable to fix.

2005 05 Plate VW Passat 2.0 TDi - failed oil pump drive - VW main dealer quoted a minimum of £6K to fix. Repaired at a "back street" garage for <£2K.

2004 54 Plate RX8 - perhaps not unsurprisingly a new cat (>£2K from Mazda), x3 ignition coils / plugs (>£750) and <20mpg for less than 200 BHP. Does drive well though.

Scary isn't it!!

Edited by Seant on 09/11/2012 at 22:14

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 22:21
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - Bobbin Threadbare

2004 54 Plate RX8 - perhaps not unsurprisingly a new cat (>£2K from Mazda), x3 ignition coils / plugs (>£750) and <20mpg for less than 200 BHP. Does drive well though.

Scary isn't it!!

Bear in mind the rotary engine, special coolant etc that the RX8 has; it's a fussy so-and-so. Not the same kind of Mazda as a 6, to be sure. I have just sold my petrol Mazda 6 (Pre-2007 model though) and it was genuinely faultless. I was getting 38-39mpg and the car never needed anything asides from the usual consumables e.g wipers, bulbs, pads etc.

Edited by Bobbin Threadbare on 09/11/2012 at 22:22

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Fri 9 Nov 2012 22:14
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - gordonbennet

I've already decided that unless the Diesel bargain of the century deposits itself on my drive, then when one of the current cars gets sold i shall be without a Diesel of some sort for the first time since the early 80's.

Got too blinking complicated and expensive to fix for me, i like Diesel for its simplicity, you can put up with the stink and the sound of a tractor engine when its cheap to run and never goes wrong.

If you don't mind an electric handbrake you could do worse than consider an Avensis estate, HJ sings their praises in his Reviews section (above), i delivered hundreds of the things in my previous job and was well impressed, unfortunately i am not having an electric handbrake (my line in the sand if you like) otherwise it would be a perfect replacement for one of ours....reliable and pleasant CVT auto box too if desired.

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Sat 10 Nov 2012 00:50
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - Avant

I agree - in view of those annoying faults the Passat needs to go. Assuming you want a change rather than another Passat, your shortlist could be a petrol version of any of these:

Ford Mondeo, Skoda Octavia or Superb (depending on the size of car you need and of course also on whether you think a Skoda is enough of a change from a VW), Mazda 6 or Toyota Avensis. If you decide you really need a diesel, avoid the Mazda and the 2.0 PD Skoda (the 1.9 PD and the 2.0 common rail are OK).

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Sat 10 Nov 2012 04:20
VW Passat/Ford Mondeo/Mazda 6 - Buying Used: Heart says diesel, head says petrol - 1litregolfeater

None of the mpg's related above seem to be so wonderful, which after all is what a diesel is supposed to be for.

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