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Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - red01

Hi,

In the last 2 months I have had none stop problems with the DPF filter, I hae taken it to the Volkswagon servicing, now the third time the filter is blocked and Volkswagon are saying it's not covered on the warranty. I have gone through the light system properly and when the 2nd flashing light has come on I have taken it in.

Any help/ advice will be appreciated.

Thanks

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - ChannelZ

Go to your local remapping company, pay them £3-400 and they'll remove the guts from the DPF and map out the DPF functions from the ECU. No more DPF problems, ever.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - daveyjp

What mileage are you doing? What is a typical day to day trip?

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - red01

Hi,

Im doing 20 miles to and from work

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

This is one area where a bootful of throttle works wonders. Mimserish driving and DPFs do not get on!

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - ChannelZ

1.6TDI Polos are really long geared, so you need to be doing 95mph on the motorway, or driving in 3rd at 70 for half an hour to regenerate the DPF properly.

'Get her ripped out te f***' as they say in Antrim.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - skidpan

Hi,

In the last 2 months I have had none stop problems with the DPF filter, I hae taken it to the Volkswagon servicing, now the third time the filter is blocked and Volkswagon are saying it's not covered on the warranty. I have gone through the light system properly and when the 2nd flashing light has come on I have taken it in.

Any help/ advice will be appreciated.

Thanks

We have 2 cars with DPF's fitted, a BMW and a Kia, not had a problem with either, they both regen when necessary with no songa and dance but I would not buy a VW group car fitted with one simply because VW group will not honour any problems you have with one. They say this in the brochures and will repaeat it in the showroom if you ask.

Removing the DPF should not be considered, it there to reduce emmissions and renoving it should be made illegal, don't know if its checked on the MOT, surely should be.

Driving at over 2500 rpm for 30 minutes should clear the flashing light but if it doesn't its dealer time for a forced regen.

The urban myth about hard driving keeping your DPF clean is total nonsense, your driving style will not trigger a regen, the ECU does that when certain conditions are met. For a regen to take place the temp in the DPF needs to be at approx 600 C, that is achieved by injecting diesel in either late or in greater quantity so that it burns in the DPF, hard driving will not get the DPF to 600 C. Some Peugeots/Citroens and cars that use their engines automatically add a liquid known as Eolys to the diesel to raise combustion temps but its no good to your VW.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - red01

My main concern is that my car has been in the VW garage for a week, they say they are trying to help me get it through on the warranty but nothing has happened. They are saying if I don't pay £1,250 pounds they can't fix it.

Can anyone give me advice on where to go from here.

Thanks

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - sandy56

Suggest you contact VW UK and COMPLAIN.

There is a lot of info on here re VW and their DPF problems.

ALso go on the VW owners site and search for DPF problems, that should also help.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

Sorry to be contrarian but this 'keeping the revs above 2500 RPM or whatever is total nonsense-and counter productive. Elevated engine speeds do little to raise Exhaust Gas temperatures in diesel engines if there's no load on the engine. loading the engine even slightly does raise EGTs markedly.

You'll get higher EGTs at lugging the engine at 1500 RPM than you will buzzing away at 3000 RPM with no torque demand.

The following is from a PSA 2.0 Hdi engine, the same 25 hp, but at different engine speeds. The temperature is the temperature of the exhaust gas entering the DPF post turbine.

1800 RPM=433C

2200 RPM=415C

3000 RPM=373C

So revving the engine means more DPF regen problems not fewer!

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - skidpan

Sorry to be contrarian but this 'keeping the revs above 2500 RPM or whatever is total nonsense-and counter productive.

Apologies, now I have the handbook in front of me its keep the engine rev's to 2000 not 2500. Totally agree that all this "Italian Tune Up" stiff is nonsense.

When a regen is necessary the ECU adjusts the injection timing that allows unburnt diesel into the cat/dpf which raises the temp to 600 C. Its obvious when a regen is occuring because as well as slightly uneven running the instant fuel consumption drops like a stone while it gets the DPF upto 600C.

Thankfully neither of ours cars use Eolys.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

My mother runs a 1.9 TDI DPF and was worried about regens because she does a lot of shorter journeys. I wondered how the PD engin would cope with regens. Very well, it seems. I just told her to cruise at low engine speeds to keep the EGTs up, so the trap would largely undergo passive regeneration. I've given the same advice to other people-none have experienced problems with DPFs. I don't know why the handbook would ask for 2000+ RPM. It's a waste of time!

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - dieselnut

I purchased a Passat 140 CR a couple of months ago with high miles on it. Was a bit concerned how the DPF would fair as I try to drive fairly economically most times. The engine rarely goes above 2k & I'm usually dodging between lane 1 & 2 at a steady 65 on the motorway. On other roads I drive to the speed limit where possible.

I generally do quite a lot of short journeys interspersed with a few long ones.

I connected up Vagcom to it earlier this week to see how the DPF was.

Measuring blocks showed the following stats since the last requested regen, 688 miles , 10.34 gallons used, average speed 41.4mph. With my dodgy maths that works out to about 66mpg average.

So it seems that the old DPF has been happilly passively regerating itself during very light driving, and on a car with 157k miles on it. Probably need to give it the odd boot to keep the VV turbo excercised a bit.

So have to agree totally with unthrottled & provided you can do the odd long journey everything should be ok.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

that works out to about 66mpg average

Wow! The reason you don't have any DPF problems is that you're not burning any fuel!

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - dieselnut

' you're not burning any fuel!'

LOL, wish you were right with diesel at almost £6.50 a gallon.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - skidpan

I don't know why the handbook would ask for 2000+ RPM. It's a waste of time!

If you read my last post I confirmed the handbook said to run the car at 2000 rpm not over 2000 rpm when the dash light flashes.

I would think thre reason for this is simple, the manufacturer has this rpm setting in the ECU to clear the DPF when the dash light flashes, I think the car handbook takes priority over chatroom advice, the manufacturer knows how it is programmed. This will be different for alternative manufacturers.

The other week the car did a normal regen on the bypass around town on the way home from Tesco's, took about 5 miles and 10 minutes to complete, never went above 50 mph. Proves you don't need high speed runs, the ECU has the ability to regen the DPF under normal conditions.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

I think the car handbook takes priority over chatroom advice, the manufacturer knows how it is programmed. This will be different for alternative manufacturers.

Well, all the friends that have followed my advice about cruising at low revs have never had to clear a DPF warning light-because it never occured in the first place.

The low revs mantra is backed by sound theory and empirical evidence. Every diesel truck equipped with an exhaust pyrometer shows the same results regardless of manufacturer.

For a constant power requirement, changing up a gear causes the EGTs to go up, changing down a gear causes the EGTs to go down.

Low EGTs are the root cause of DPF problems.

Edited by unthrottled on 01/03/2012 at 14:20

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - thunderbird

I think the car handbook takes priority over chatroom advice, the manufacturer knows how it is programmed. This will be different for alternative manufacturers.

Surely Skidpan is correct on this one. If the handboook says 30 minutes at 2000 rpm to clear a warning light that must be correct. They do 1,000's of hours of testing and they write the ECU programmes after all. This info is likely to be far more reliable than a load of pub talk.

Just imagine the scenario, your DPF warning light starts to flash and you ignore the handbook. After the car finally goes into limp mode and is towed to the dealer who asks "did you follow the routine in the handbook for a flashing DPF light", you say no, I followed the advice on Honest John, a bloke on there says the handbook advice is nonsense. Think any chance of a warranty fix has just disappered.

Then again, if people read their handbooks there would be no need for sites like this in a lot of cases.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

If the warning light comes on, you should follow the advice in the handbook. No one disputes this.

The advice for the 1.9 PD engine is drive for at least 15 minutes at a speed of 60km/hr or more in 4th or 5th gear with engine speed between 1800 and 2500RPM.

The key point to this is the 60km/hr. The speed provides the power requirement and that is what is necessary. You can get the RPMs just sittig on the drive at home.

During active regen, the engine can apply heavy inlet throttling and post injections to keep the EGTs high. But it is hopelessly inefficient. The warning light shouldn't be coming on at all if the car is driven in an intelligent fashion.

The pub talk is that revving the engine will get the DPF hot enough to burn off the soot because this sounds intuitively correct. That is the chatroom myth. All the theory and empirical evidence demonstrates that the opposite is true.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - thunderbird

Our handbook says "When the malfunction indicator light blinks, it may stop blinking by driving the vehicle at more than 60km/h (37mph) or at more than 2nd gear with 1500 - 2000 engine rpm for a certain time (for about 25 minutes).

This is pretty much what Skidpan says, the 60km/h is exactly what it says above.

Our car uses a bit of extra diesel during a regen, the instant readout on the fuel confuser says so at anyrate but it soon returns to normal levels.

On every website I have visited there are the usual "I drive mine for 1/2 an hour at 4000 rpm every week" crowd, on one website a contributor said he never ever used 5th and 6th gears, he was convinced it was better for the car driving at 3000 rpm everywhere.

I once tried touching the tailpipe after I thought the car had done a regen, nearly lost my finger ends. Normally the tailpipe is quite cool even after a motorway run.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

We're comparing apples with oranges. Skidpan and Thunderbird are talking about what to do if the trap saturates-I'm talking about what to do to prevent the trap saturating in the first place.

Heavy duty engines never see 2000 RPM. They do see heavy load. This is what allows trucks to use DPFs without any active regeneration (although it is easy to programme common rail engines to have the facility with little additional effort). If the average exhaust gas temperature is above a critical temperature (about 350C), the trap will regenerate itself.

In contrast, I was discussing the problem with the powertrain engineers at JCB. They do have problems with DPFs-and their engines will run to 3000 RPM or more. But excavator engines see a lot of idling time-and active regen is needed and is a big problem.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - thunderbird

We're comparing apples with oranges. Skidpan and Thunderbird are talking about what to do if the trap saturates-I'm talking about what to do to prevent the trap saturating in the first place.

Heavy duty engines never see 2000 RPM. They do see heavy load. This is what allows trucks to use DPFs without any active regeneration (although it is easy to programme common rail engines to have the facility with little additional effort). If the average exhaust gas temperature is above a critical temperature (about 350C), the trap will regenerate itself.

In contrast, I was discussing the problem with the powertrain engineers at JCB. They do have problems with DPFs-and their engines will run to 3000 RPM or more. But excavator engines see a lot of idling time-and active regen is needed and is a big problem.

Of course I am talking about passenger vehicles and not HGV's, that is what the OP asked about and its is what I expect most people who come on here find relevant.

And I am fully aware that the proceedure I described on my last post is what you do when the DPF becomes saturated to a pre-determined level above that which a normal regen will sort, that is what the flashing light indicates and I pesume exactly the same thing is happeneing continually on the OPs Polo.

We have had cars with DPF's for over 4 years now and using them in a manner that includes a mix of driving we have yet to see a light on the dash. It seems to me that some manufacturers are less capable of producing a car that can cope with this technology.

Volkswagon polo 1.6 tdi - Problems with the DPF - unthrottled

If VW can get DPF to work with a PD engine -and it does work, then the CR engine should have no problems.

I used the illustration of truck engines to show that there's nothing magic about X RPM engine speed.

I still think it's operator error in most cases.