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Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - tougher than the rest

Hi can anyone help me with this. 2 policeman pulled me over last night for being on my mobile phone. I had the mobile in my hand resting on the steering wheel (it does have a speaker phone) but I was 100% not on the phone, my phone records would easily prove this. I was so adamant that I was not on the phone that the police decided to issue me with offence code 291 driver not in a position to have proper control. I cannot find this code on the DVLA website. Anyway, they argued that I should always have 2 hands on the wheel at all times. They said that I should have a fitted phone. Having thought about this, even if you have a fitted phone, you have to take a hand off the wheel to dial your call? Any ideas on this one, it seems to be a very weak prosecution, mainly based on the police hitting their quotas..the police are very keen for me to take the fixed penalty!

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Dwight Van Driver

Hi can anyone help me with this. 2 policeman pulled me over last night for being on my mobile phone. I had the mobile in my hand resting on the steering wheel (it does have a speaker phone) but I was 100% not on the phone, my phone records would easily prove this. I was so adamant that I was not on the phone that the police decided to issue me with offence code 291 driver not in a position to have proper control. I cannot find this code on the DVLA website. Anyway, they argued that I should always have 2 hands on the wheel at all times. They said that I should have a fitted phone. Having thought about this, even if you have a fitted phone, you have to take a hand off the wheel to dial your call? Any ideas on this one, it seems to be a very weak prosecution, mainly based on the police hitting their quotas..the police are very keen for me to take the fixed penalty!

Using a phone whilst driving used to be covered by Reg 104 MV Con and Use) Regs 1986

No person shall drive or cause or permit a person to drive a vehicle on a roadif he is in such a position that he cannot have proper control of the vehicle or have a full view of the road and traffic ahead. Max fine £1000.

The escalation of such use and accidents they caused made HMG to make it a specific offence to use a hand–held phone or similar device, when driving.

From 1 December 2003 it became a specific offence to use a hand-held mobile phone in a moving vehicle. The penalty was a £30 fixed penalty or up to £1,000 on conviction in court (£2,500 for drivers of goods vehicles, buses or coaches), but no points.

However from 27 February 2007 the fixed penalty is now 3 points on your licence and a minimum fine of £60.

In your case it looks as if they cannot prove the specific phone offence and on seeing your hands off the wheel have opted for the Con and use offence which has been used against people even for eating at the wheel etc.

You have the option of paying the Fixed penalty and the matter all over and done with

OR

Not accepting the FPN and electing a Not Guilty Court appearance where you will have to convince the Magistrates you had proper control. If after hearing the evidence from the Police and accepting your verbal evidence on oath from the witness box they canl dismiss the case. If they don't accept and bring in a verdict of Guilty then in addition to the fine they impose there will be additional prosecution costs anywhere between £30 -60 plud a Victim Support Supplement of £15 which will put you in exceees of the FPN fine.

Only you know the strength of your argument against so its up to you to decide the course of action to take.

dvd

apologise Mods in repeating posters comment but this is the only way I can get the site to accept my comments......

Edited by Dwight Van Driver on 09/02/2012 at 15:22

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Armitage Shanks {p}

Hands on the wheel all the time? How does one operate lights, wipers, mirrors, tune radio, change gear, blow nose, scratch man vegetables etc?

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Dwight Van Driver

....but we are not privy to just what Plod saw AS are we?

dvd

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Armitage Shanks {p}

No but it seems that plod accepted they wouldn't be able to prove that he was using the phone so tried something else. On that basis they could cruise around stopping and charging people for adjusting their sunvisors or rear view mirrors (activities which can be observed from outside the car). This seems to me to be falling into the Hhaven't they got anything better to do" pigeonhole!

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Cris_on_the_gas

By your own admission you were holding a mobile phone whilst driving.

Take the offence, learn from it and next time drive with the phone in the boot.

That way you will be a safer driver both for your self and other road users

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Armitage Shanks {p}

In what way is the "holding" of a mobile phone breaking the law and, if so, what law/statute?

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - daveyjp
As the OP is finding out, the offence is "not deemed to be in control of the vehicle" and can apply to holding a phone, eating, drinking, looking at paperwork etc etc. No point us arguing, the OP has a ticket. They can take the hit or go to Court and argue their case.

I do wonder why anyone needs to hold a phone if they have no intention of using it whilst driving. You are setting youself up for a charge. Handsfree kit and keep the phone in the boot. No need to touch phone to call.

It looks like the OPs luck ran out and they should consider how often they have used the phone whilst driving and got away with it.

Edited by daveyjp on 11/02/2012 at 09:07

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - Bloders

I agree. If your not on the phone, then there is no need to be holding it.

However, several references have been made regarding the similarity between this case and easting and drinking, which is, in my opinion, a valid compromise. I am somewhat surprised though, that nobody has made the comparison to smoking, because as far as I can see, lighting a cigarette must be AT LEAST as dsitracting as eating an apple?

Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - daveyjp
Smoking can fall into the same category. I would have pulled a driver his afternoon who was scrabbling in a bag in the passenger seat at 40 while I was at the side of her and she came very close to hitting me. At the next lights she lit her fag.
Renault Laguna - offence code 291 driver not in a position to have - TeeCee

> you have to take a hand off the wheel to dial your call?

Dab button with thumb/finger, say; "Call <so and so> on mobile/work/home", wait for readback, say; "Yes". That's how it works for me.

Parott Bluetooth system gates through to the phone's voice dialling system.....