Baby killed in hit and run.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 13:36
Baby killed in hit and run. - brum

Article here

How can a car not have a registered driver? Obviously also not insured etc. Evos must attract the attention of polise so how did this one get away with it?

Hope they catch the scumbags, lock em up and throw away the keys.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 14:23
Baby killed in hit and run. - Collos25
Absolutely tragic,its a result of lax policing and regulations you can drive a horse and cart through.The UK is becoming a lawless place where people buy super fast cars have no insurance and drive round causing mayhem.
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Sun 28 Nov 2010 15:09
Baby killed in hit and run. - Westpig

Absolutely tragic,its a result of lax policing and regulations you can drive a horse and cart through.The UK is becoming a lawless place where people buy super fast cars have no insurance and drive round causing mayhem.

I'm not aware of a lack of legislation being a problem. There's a distinct lack of traffic related policing nowadays though, i'd agree that.

Edited by Westpig on 28/11/2010 at 15:12

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 15:31
Baby killed in hit and run. - Collos25

If you read the article in yesterdays DT where the fine for uninsured drivers is only 50ukp when stopped in vehicle checks,17% of insurance customers cancelling there standing order as soon as they have the insurance certificate,cheaper to pay an occassional fine than insure a car.Yes the legislation in the UK is riddled with loopholes to help lawbreaker.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 17:55
Baby killed in hit and run. - Dutchie

The trouble is Andy our prisons are full with people who haven't payed their tv licence or are mentally ill.

Being uninsured in a car in the UK is a minor offence hence insurance premiums are sky high .Not the police fault its the lawmakers who couldt care less.

And if you drive a car whats worth a couple of hundred pounds so what if the car is crushed.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 18:31
Baby killed in hit and run. - Collos25

Think you are about spot on there.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 22:09
Baby killed in hit and run. - Westpig

The laws themselves are fine, there's no need for more. Enforcement for traffic related issues has become noticeably problematic...but more importantly (as stated) it's the punishment dished out when caught, that's the real problem area.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 22:12
Baby killed in hit and run. - Westpig

The Telegraph article hasn't got a lot of detail in it. I wonder if the baby was secured properly in a baby seat?

That's the trouble with these often brief Press articles, you don't often have enough of the story to make an informed opinion.

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Sun 28 Nov 2010 22:50
Baby killed in hit and run. - brum

Sorry Westpig, but you sound as if you're defending the EVO driver. To fail to stop at an accident in which there is fatality (and another critically injured) is not only CRIMINAL but tantamount to admission of total blame. Let the courts decide.

The cherished number plate on the EVO is published on the BBC website BTW - lets see how those APNR cameras do.

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Mon 29 Nov 2010 07:29
Baby killed in hit and run. - jc2

Sorry Westpig, but you sound as if you're defending the EVO driver. To fail to stop at an accident in which there is fatality (and another critically injured) is not only CRIMINAL but tantamount to admission of total blame. Let the courts decide.

The cherished number plate on the EVO is published on the BBC website BTW - lets see how those APNR cameras do.

  1. Why just ANPR? All of us should keep our eyes open! R54 RMW Silver Evo

Edited by jc2 on 29/11/2010 at 07:30

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Mon 29 Nov 2010 10:26
Baby killed in hit and run. - Collos25

In Germany when you buy a car it comes with no plates you then take your mot,Insurance certificate to the ministry who gives you the plates date stamped to say the when the tax and mot runs out.You cannot stop the insurance without deregistering the car ie giving the plates back, you then receive a certificate to take to your insurance who will then cancel it for you. The process is logged on the police computer and they check to make sure the car is off the road or sold(to buy and sell a car it has to be conducted on a special form which you must keep) .Running a car with no plates or forged plates would get you into jail very very quickly the penalties are so severe that I have never heard of this happening I don´t say it doesn´t happen but it must be very rare.

Whereas in the UK you can buy a car no insurance no tax or cancel the insurance the moment you have the certificate no needto register it nobody checks and if by chance you are caught you just give the car up and buy another the next day 50ukp fine.I think the legislation is wanting and so is the enforcement of it.

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Mon 29 Nov 2010 11:53
Baby killed in hit and run. - Westpig

Sorry Westpig, but you sound as if you're defending the EVO driver.

Where on earth do you get that idea from? Are you of the opinion that anything said challenging any aspect of the accident that does not support the occs of the vehicle with the baby in it automatically supports the occs of the other vehicle? If so, why? That is almost tantamount to the stifling of free speech, in the similar fashion political correctness is.

What i'd like is a balanced view, more facts perhaps to enable me to know more.

There is never usually 100% one persons blame and 0% for the other party. If the EVO driver has had a fatal accident, killed a baby and run off..then he's an out and out 'low life' of the highest order and needs to hand himslef in sharpish if he has an ounce of decency (i'm presuming it's a 'he')...however...IF the child wasn't properly secured, (because although it's legislated for and really ought to be common sense, a surprising number of people still risk it) then the result could well have been different.

I am in no way whatsoever seeking sympathy for someone who may well have committed a serious criminal act..but, further to the above, we do not know who caused the accident either, do we?

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Mon 29 Nov 2010 20:16
Baby killed in hit and run. - brum

I think you'll find its a surprisingly small number of people that dont use child seats etc. and not the other way round. I'm sure it would have been publisied by the police if the baby was not secured as this would be a powerful road safety message.

A picture of the baby and the abandonded EVO is here. Its a full frontal on the EVO and it occurred at a junction so I guess that it hit the Toyota side on, probably where the baby was strapped in.

As the scum legged it and got away, I fear they'll not be caught and will do the same again in the future.

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Mon 29 Nov 2010 20:49
Baby killed in hit and run. - dieseldogg

Most people do use child seats, how well they are secured is another matter, plus the mother? may have been nursing the child? who knows. I have seen unrestrained toddlers in moving cars in the local community.

Anyway and more crucially, why does the death of a baby make the accident any worse?

Better news storey yes, but how does it affect the guilt of or the sentence applicable to the accused?

A dear old doddery old OAP could have killed this baby just as easily? and presumably just as unintentionally?

Cheers

M

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Mon 29 Nov 2010 22:08
Baby killed in hit and run. - Dutchie

I suppose It affects us all when children or in this case a baby was killed.

The babys live was snuffed out before he or she had a change to live.

Vey sad and my condolences to the familie who are affected by this tragedy.

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Tue 30 Nov 2010 07:46
Baby killed in hit and run. - Westpig

I think you'll find its a surprisingly small number of people that dont use child seats etc. and not the other way round.

I beg to differ. It depends on where you are. I'd agree that if you took the stats for the country as a whole your viewpoint would probably stand, however if you narrowed it down to some specific areas, then some people have a surprisingly relaxed approach to the subject matter.

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Tue 30 Nov 2010 11:01
Baby killed in hit and run. - Collos25

I have to agree with Westpig when I visit my mother in the the UK a certain section of the community are oblivious to any child seat laws and its seems to be completely ignored by the police.

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Wed 1 Dec 2010 16:54
Baby killed in hit and run. - Roly93

Absolutely tragic,its a result of lax policing and regulations you can drive a horse and cart through.The UK is becoming a lawless place where people buy super fast cars have no insurance and drive round causing mayhem.

I'm not aware of a lack of legislation being a problem. There's a distinct lack of traffic related policing nowadays though, i'd agree that.

I think it is neither of these to be honest, it is a new breed of citizen who doesn't seem to care about getting caught and imprisoned, which I a concept I just can't grasp. There are many things I would have liked to have done (not involving the death of innocent bystanders) but were held back by a inbred and subliminal fear of the consequences.

Our jails are overflowing with sub-human scum who just do stuff, get locked up and worry about it later if they ever in fact do.

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Wed 1 Dec 2010 19:59
Baby killed in hit and run. - bonzo dog

Absolutely tragic,its a result of lax policing and regulations you can drive a horse and cart through.The UK is becoming a lawless place where people buy super fast cars have no insurance and drive round causing mayhem.

I'm not aware of a lack of legislation being a problem. There's a distinct lack of traffic related policing nowadays though, i'd agree that.

I think it is neither of these to be honest, it is a new breed of citizen who doesn't seem to care about getting caught and imprisoned

Almost, but not quite, IMO. People will do what they want to do unless there is good reason IN THEIR EYES not to do so. In many cases this means not believing they will be caught, in others that they will not be prosecuted, in others that the chances of being found guilty is small & in others that the sentances will be trivial or simply an occupational hazzard.

For example as we know, the cost of insurance for many drivers is far greater than the fines imposed if caught; so why buy insurance. Want to smoke dope? ..... you'll invariably get (let off with?) a caution. Get caught for 3 offences? .... you'll get concurrent sentances. In all but the most serious of cases the chances of being caught are minimal.

Most people in this country want to obey the laws THEY CHOOSE TO, hence the pages & pages written in these & HJ's Telegraph column complaining about speed cameras.

Obviously we will never get rid of anti-social behaviour but we as a society appear to have decided that most of it is acceptable otherwise we would take measures to reduce it, starting with massively increased sentences, "3 strikes & you're out" & a complete overhaul of the TV portrayal of anti-social behaviour as the norm.

None of this will happen of course, so get used to reading of more & more babies being killed in hit & runs.

Edited by bonzo dog on 01/12/2010 at 20:02

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Thu 2 Dec 2010 17:59
Baby killed in hit and run. - OG

For those that may have missed it:-

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-black-country-118856...0

It'd be interesting to know if he had an attack of conscience and handed himself in or if somebody tipped off the police.

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