OK let`s set some parameters.
Assuming bought new (under £10,000) and considered over a 15yr life-span.
Defining `best`
1) Servicing costs - to 150,000 miles and 15yrs
2) Known issues and likely repair costs
3) DIY - difficult, or easy.
Basically, this is trying to define the best little engine found in bread and butter motors - that typically run around the City and get passed through several owners.
Considering servicing costs + ease of servicing and known weaknesses, as the only parameters for the sake of this thread.
Thoughts?
Regards
oilrag
Edited by oilrag on 20/01/2010 at 07:30
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The 1.0 3 pot fitted in our Aygo.
Working on it is really easy, it has a chain cam which should be good for over 100,000 miles. Service at some main dealers is less than £100.
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Toyota 1.0 3-cyl as in Yaris, Aygo, Daihatsu Sirion, Pug 107, Citroen C1 etc is a possibility.
Or VAG 1.2 3-pot chain cam as in Skoda Fabia, VW Polo & Fox, SEAT Ibiza? Comes in 6v or 12v versions.
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Id definately say the 1.0 3-cyl from my Charade, not sure if it is related to the unit in the Sirion, but Daihatsu have been selling sub 1000cc 3-cyl engines for many years - back in 1986 my mum had a Daihatsu Domino from new which had I think an 848cc 3 cyl - very much the forerunner to my current car.
It doesnt seem to go wrong, mine runs great, it sips fuel, has decent power and low emissions, so there is a longevity to its design. It also has character.
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The 1.3 4-cyl VVT DOHC chain cam engine that used in Suzuki Swift, Jimny & Ignis.
Reasonable service cost and plenty of space inside engine bay - just in case you prefer DIY.
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ANy of the little jap engines are OK. I think the units you are mentioning is Daihatsu are actually toyota engines. Suzuki engines are also good.
Problem with all of these is that IF they do fall out of bed they are expensive to fix.
The little Matiz engine is also good. Its a Suzuki design. Plastic inlet manifolds can leak and we get the odd coil failure, but other than that its a trouble fee unit. Belt cam, but an absolute doddle to change, any DIYer could do it.
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Toyota 1.0 and 1.3 VVTI engines are good:
150k miles if well serviced..
Weaknesses: timing chain tensioner: an easy fix....
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The skoda fabia has a good bread n butter engine as seen in their ad.
Or was it more of a sponge cake?
I'll get me coat...
Edited by Mick Snutz on 20/01/2010 at 13:30
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Rather surprised to see that Nissan Micra 998cc not getting a mention here, know of a few 10yr old examples now up to 110,ooo to 120,ooo milesw with no problems at all. In my opinion these little engines are bullet proof providing they have an annual full service and oil change in between at six months.
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Fiat's 1.2, bullet proof, sweet revver, very economical.
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Was going to mention the 1.2 Fiat engine. Its been around for a while and seems to be plenty of high mileage previous shape Punto's around.
Does anyone know if it is the same FIRE engine that our own honestjohn used to speak highly of?
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1.2 TCE Renault, 100 bhp.
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i would rate the fire engine too
proper thing
gee even ford fit it now
as for 3 pots evil things work of the devil,might as well go on the bus,hate them,you cant beat cubes and 3 into 4 will never go
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as for 3 pots evil things work of the devil might as well go on the bus hate them you cant beat cubes and 3 into 4 will never go
Not always, Sgt Major Zero (Windsor Davies) and the Terrahawk droids always beat the cubes...
You have to be a certain age/mentality and possess a sense of humour.;)
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Actually on some episodes the cubes won the noughts-and-crosses in the final credits ;-)
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Actually on some episodes the cubes won the noughts-and-crosses in the final credits ;-)
Ah but when the battles commenced Dix Huit could be relied upon to do his duty complete with moustaches, don't you just love stereotypes..;)
well remembered, i doubted anyone else would....dare i admit i've got the whole lot on dvd?
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Got a DVD for my daughter when she was about 2 and a half - she fair enjoyed it.
Cheese factor 100.
Now what about the remastered Star Fleet that was mentioned last year.... :-)
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Got a DVD for my daughter when she was about 2 and a half -
Love it...thats nearly as good an excuse as blokes rushing out to buy their baby boys a train set for their 1st birthday.
The later ones have some quite cracking humour in them, way over the heads of youngsters..he added trying to regain some self respect.
There's 9 or 12 dvd's in all...motoring link..the overlander's off road suspension worked brilliantly, and i think that was about 18 x 18 (that'll upset the anti 4x4 mafia)
..;)
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"as for 3 pots evil things work of the devil"
Yet most Porsches have two of them! :-)
Funny how 3-cyl engines are sniffed at in cars, but considered pretty ideal in a bike. The Triumph triples are a fine example (even the 2.3 litre Rocket 3!) and there were some very nice 2-stroke threes a few years* back...
*alright - decades!
Edited by J Bonington Jagworth on 21/01/2010 at 16:54
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Does anyone know if it is the same FIRE engine that our own honestjohn used to speak highly of?
Yes it is, one of the most proven engines out there, a motoring classic and still up there with the best as it's been tweaked over the years.
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The Fiat FIRE 16v twin cam 1.2 85hp is unburstable.
Edited by BigJohnD on 21/01/2010 at 16:57
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Well, that's most of them isn't it!
Just shows that modern small petrol engines are highly efficient, and will probably result in the phasing out of the small diesel.
The mind boggles at the thought of one of these engines pulling a fire engine....oh sorry, Bellboy - you mean the FIRE engine as in Fiats.
Edit - efficient, yes, but how long-lasting will the 3-cyl engines be? Only time will tell.
Edited by Avant on 20/01/2010 at 23:10
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Hyundai 1.2 Kappa unit may turn out to be a beauty - chain cam 4cyl 1.2, 77 PS, and <120g/km CO2 in the i10, and 124g/km in the larger i20.
Too early to tell re. longterm reliability of course ;-)
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bit hard to say to your mates in the pub you have a kappa under the hood though
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>>bit hard to say to your mates in the pub you have a kappa under the hood though<<
Bit hard to say you have a FIRE under your bonnet either, then again, if its a Fiat, people may believe it :-)
Found 4 Matizs with over 100k and two Smarts with over 100k on AT, both have 3 cyls. If I resist the temptation to sell my Charade, in about 3 years it will hit 100k too...watch this space - at nearly 50k its spot on mechanically.
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No mention of the small petrol engines that power small Renault`s - such as the Twingo.
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IMO Nissan Micra 1.0. Know someone who had N plate one, he's a a full time Pizza delivery driver. The last time I looked at that car, it had 217k miles on it and still going strong. The only problem with it now is the cam belt pulley/tensioner is on its way!
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Aye the little Nissan engine is a peach. If the rot is kept under control these cars run almost indefinitely -- even the older box-shaped Micras were still rattling along waaaayyy past their sell-by date.
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Now if you'd said 'bread and Butter' PUDDING, i'd've had no hesitation in saying that Skoda one off the telly ad.
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