Well, since the Subaru is a very left-field choice, that presumably is the one you really want an your using the S-Max as a device by which to measure its sensibilities as not many people come up with those two on a shortlist!
So id say Subaru, but do be aware that driving any 4x4, no matter how obscure, comes with certain hassles from the anti lobby.
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Of the 2 I would chose the S-Max, subject to the wise words above. They are genuinely good to drive, but perhaps less so to own.
Personally I class the Tribeca in with the Ssang Yong Rodius when it comes to styling - i.e. hideous.
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A guy I work with has an S Max - loads of agro.
The Tribeca is soooo ugly, would you ever be able to sell it again?
Boring, but good and cheap is the Zafira
MVP
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We have a 2.0 diesel S-max and have had no trouble at all with it.
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gmac
The TDCi engines in the S-max are dreadful, I wouldn't reccomend any of them to anyone, not even the PSA powerplants. They use most of the parts from delphi, even the entire injection system is delphi. It would be better to fork out on the more expensive servicing on the T5 engine. Get a TDCi - you will only regret it, It seems to be like a ticking time bomb for a huge dent in your wallet for engine re-pairs/re-placements that Ford will often try to avoid covering under their warranty. Ive heard too much about the TDCi S-Max's DMF's literally falling apart on people, injector seals leaking, engines shaking/rattling themselves to pieces, Dodgey mapped PCM's doing nasty things to the engine performance, clutches burning out after 1-week of commuting.
If I was buying an S-Max it would have to be a petrol engine model or not at all.
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How about a Mercedes R-Class? Far more luxurious than both of the two mentioned above, and a little more exclusive too...............
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How about a Mercedes R-Class? Far more luxurious than both of the two mentioned above and a little more exclusive too...............
And surely one of the few vehicles on the road which is uglier than the Tribeca
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And also far better value as a long term investment (in terms of residuals etc).
I quite like them :-) All the benfits of an SUV, packaged as an estate. Thats just me though, I dont find the Tribeca that offensive either, IMO it's not that ugly, it's just not conventional looking; a bonus in my book.
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www.specksavers.com
Quite right, save the delicious Italian sausage and sensible family cars be damned!
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How about a Mercedes R-Class? Far more luxurious than both of the two mentioned above and a little more exclusive too...............
And 4x4, like a Tribeca. NOT ugly, now cheap to buy if not to run.
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Peter Piper. There are only so many ways you can say you hate fords. You can stop now you are starting to repeat yourself. Your prejuice is fairly evident.
Edited by Altea Ego on 19/01/2010 at 15:25
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We are not allowed to be predudiced against the makes & models of cars now? Since when was disliking Fords politically incorrect. We are allowed an opinion weather we like something or not.
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That is some challenge, find a car manufacturer who uses nothing from Delphi. With all the tie-ins and joint ventures between manufacturers it would be difficult to find one who has no link back.
Why do you recommend a petrol S-Max if Ford are as bad as you have heard ?
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My choice would be the S-Max (probably a 2.2 TDCi TBH), I've nearly leased one twice - once in late 2006 when the forums were full of disgruntled owners, the badge fell off the rear and the seat jammed on the test car from Ford so I decided that the rumours regarding reliability were probably true.... Then again in late 2008, this time it was a mid life crisis which stopped me. I think that it handles and rides superbly, no MPV has a 'right' to handle that well, better than most cars.
Since then 3 colleagues have had them (all 2.0 TDCi Titaniums) and all are pleased, IIRC the oldest is a 57 though.
So my advice is if it's an 08 or later then get the S-Max, anything earlier be wary of build/reliability issues.
Alternatives might be a Mazda 5 or what about a Mitsubishi Outlander (I think they're 7 seater) ? I won't have a Vauxhall but the Zafira (especially the turbo) might be OK ?
Edited by idle_chatterer on 19/01/2010 at 17:14
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Another vote for the S-Max, a GREAT family car. I had one for about 15 months and 55,000 miles (it was a diesel though). No problems apart from a loose armrest at delivery that was fixed at the 1500 mile service. S-Maxes do eat front tyres though and the 18" tyres on my one were not cheap. Lasted about 12k if I remember rightly. Backs lasted forever though.
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Its only GM & Ford that use Delphi, its not that hard to find a manufacturer that doesn't rifle frankensteins parts from Michigan (a.k.a Delphi)
S-maxes are appaling for quality/reliability no matter what one you get, the petrol is probably the lesser of the evils though.
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Its only GM & Ford that use Delphi its not that hard to find a manufacturer that doesn't rifle frankensteins parts from Michigan (a.k.a Delphi)
Really ? Two seconds on Delphi's own website turns out seven other manufacturers who are customers/clients. Just type a manufacturers name and Delphi into a search engine.
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The TDCi engines in the S-max are dreadful I wouldn't reccomend any of them to anyone not even the PSA powerplants. >>
Your prejudice is evident, surely to the extent that your comments will be ignored, one hopes so anyway.
:-(
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I actually considered the Tribeca before I got our S-max which we've had 3 months now. We have a 2.2 diesel. If you're considering one I would recommend the excellent forum at smaxownersclub.co.uk where I got a lot of useful advice.
I fancied the Tribeca due to the reasonable prices, and the 4x4 for towing our caravan, but in the end I was concerned about the long term maintenance (parts issues) and ease of servicing locally, and the overall running costs coming from a diesel Octavia. Our 2.2 diesel does 35mpg day to day which I think considering its 175PS and nearly 2 tonnes is impressive. I would definitely have gone for the petrol if my mileage was lower (like yours) although they don't seem to be that much cheaper used than the diesels.
You are comparing two v different cars though. Neither has 7 big seats (do you need them?), we v rarely use the back seats in ours but they are really 5+2, the middle row accommodation is great (I can sit behind myself comfortably - I'm 6'2") but the back row is for adults for short trips only. I've been in the back row of a Tribeca and it's a similar story.
I actually have a patient who recently bought a Tribeca to replace an aging Scenic. He "knows" a Subaru salesman and reckons he got a deal....a 56 plate with 10k miles cost him 14K, I wasn't sure it was quite such a deal but he seems very pleased with it....22mpg on a run so he says. Does your current Subaru ownership not sway you in that direction?
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Your prejudice is evident, surely to the extent that your comments will be ignored, one hopes so anyway.
The poster seemed to make some interesting points - have you got any contrary knowledge/experience then - if so I'd like to hear it. Simple gainsaying doesn't really enlighten does it?
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>>Simple gainsaying doesn't really enlighten does it?
Woodbines, you only have to read it, AE made the same point as me, I stand by views of that poster's comment and have nothing to add.
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Mentioning about how bad a Ford S-max can be is like writing negative articles about the government in a communist state! I might get banished to a coal mine for 3 weeks just for making a point about the reliability.
Edited by Peterexhaustpiper on 22/01/2010 at 02:12
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I might get banished to a coal mine for 3 weeks >>
Yep and you might learn what not to do when in a hole ... ... ... ;-)
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Its not about arguing me into a hole over a 2.5T Box-Max, defending it doesn't stop it being one of the most unreliable MPV's in Britain. The only person who is going to be in a deep hole is the person silly enough to buy one, & a financial one at that.
I've listed some of the known & typical problems the S-max TDCi's have. These are backed up by consumer facts & reports also reviews made by the owners of the vehicles who got rid of them because of it.
PS: The boot issue... I just thought I would mention something very awful on the S-max, the boot catches are made from an awful cost-cutting plastic, they are well-known to break easily causing the boot to lock shut permanently. So much for "feel the difference"
True story...
Me & my dad (2 years ago) were going to get a car on motability because my mum is disabled. We went into Ford 1st & looked at small-mid MPV's. We were shown the Focus C-max & Ford S-max which were within our range for a motability grant, they didn't have a Galaxy in the showroom to show us so we were guided to the C-max & S-max. If we chose a C-max we wouldn't need a grant to pay back over 3 years. If we chose an S-max we would have to apply for a low grant which we owe back over 3 years. If we chose a Galaxy we would have to apply for a high grant which we couldn't afford over 3 years. My dad wanted the S-max as the grant was low & we could do with 7 seats plus the boot space was a lot more than the C-max. He was really impressed with it & wanted to get a black titanium 2.2 TDCi.
That was until the salesman opened the door for me, I sat in the driver seat, adjusted the seat to a lower height & the damn seat lever actually broke off in my hands. I ran my fingers over the controls to get the feel of it but I can't honestly see why these have got a huge price tag on them. I found the S-max to be rather cheap when I sat in it for real. The centre-dash buttons feel like flimsy mobile-phone keypads. I can't see any real lasting quality in an S-max.
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what did you end up getting? the c-max?
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No we dropped the idea of motability in the end.
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Imaginary story!
The ford S-Max Titanium has an electric drivers seat height adjustment.... so your story it's crap from the beginning... I own a S-Max 2.5T Titanium for 2 and a half years now with 70k miles ... and the issues that i had are only related to maintenance, and maybe the buttons that you are talking about are present on the standard version that can't be bought along with the 2.5t engine.... so please talk only if you know what you are talking about.... if not ... go get something else to do...
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