This is a known cost of motoring. One that needs to be factored in as one of those costs of running your car.
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"rarely do we in london/kent get snow, or snow that remains on the ground for more than a day and causes probs to vehicles and that is indeed a fact."
It's also a fact that a Ford driven in the Highlands or across the Pennines is the same car driven down south. It's the Southern softy behind the wheel, like yourself that drones on about what everyone else should be doing when you should be on the ball yourself.
Paul, your posts are quite long and reading through all your spelling mistakes is rather time consuming. Can you check before you post mate. Please ignore this though if you are disclecksik.
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BTW - i did not want to brag, but I have helped 3 groups of people and their vehicles by pulling out of snow/ice and took one family home in my jeep SRT. 9Many people slag me off for driving the big-sih 4X4, but all are prepared to
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I hope you checked they were all taxed, MOT's and insured, under the drink drive limit, hadn't smoked or had any animals in their cars first or you could have been the author of your own fate Paul:)
Pat
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I have helped 3 groups of people and their vehicles by pulling out of snow/ice and took one family home in my jeep SRT. >>
paul2007 - does your insurance allow you to do this?
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yes. >>
Very revealing reply! ;-)
Just keep away from my car when you are doing your fully-insured good-samaritan non-business towing on public roads in ice and snow.
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Hi
i've met people like you. (they talk about winning the lottery which i do not do and say 'winning more than x is too much - i say to them to put my name on the ticket and if they won more than x, give it to me - it shuts them up)
Why the hell would i help some one if they did not want my help is beyond belief!!
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Why the hell would i help some one if they did not want my help is beyond belief!! >>
Just ask your generous insurance company. The policy is not titled "imaginary, dream-on towing good samaritan cover", is it?
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how does a breakdown make the motorist foolish? >>
zookeeper:
Do your own research. You should find that the majority of breakdowns are avoidable, and are due to either the ignorance or foolishness of the driver/owner.
Edited by jbif on 10/01/2010 at 13:13
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I don't expect side/residential roads to be gritted but some visible attempt at keeping main routes clear would have been welcome. There are major roads in my area that still have seen no attempt by the local authority to grit/clear them, and swathes of the M3 weren't gritted in advance of snow that had been forecast days in advance.
In my little part of the South, the authorities' response to this weather has been little short of abysmal, and frankly to blame people for trying to get to work when they don't have a choice (for lots of people no show = no pay), shows a staggering lack of understanding how some people in this country have to live.
Yes I'm sure some of the journeys could have been avoided, but I'd bet a heck of a lot of them couldn't.
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hear, hear!!
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They ventured out when they were told not to (and yes, there were plenty of warnings), so they pay the cost of recovery. As said before they should have factored recovery costs into their motoring bill, after all whats £150 against the running costs of a car over a year...
I don't like Mr Brown, but well done him if he did say no to the State forking out for these recovery costs... though I doubt it went that high!
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My friend
the official warning was, and i quote:
''DO NOT VENTURE OUT UNLESS YOUR JOURNEY IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY''
imagine if all the nurses, doctors, police, breakdown people, utility workers, food suppliers/etc/etc stayed away, where would you be!
i rest my case yet again!!!
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My wife is a community nurse. The local trust arranged for 4x4's to ferry them around (some from the army)
Please stop resting your case, you are not as good as Perry Mason.
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If I was to abandon my car - it would be because there was absolutely no other option open to me.
To return to the car and find it had been 'recovered' and that I had to pay £150 or whatever is criminal IMO.
It's got nothing to do with being a Southern softy or a hard Northerner either - Kent has been particularly badly hit, I hear, but - it'll all be over within a few days and then we can all find something else to moan about.
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my dear friend Perro
I'm sure you've read my posts, me, my other half,our children have all been out to work as usual other than 2/3 days were we took gov advice and stayed away by using up our precious A/L
We have even helped others.
I have spent weeks in the north and aware of the situation.
what you will agree with that there are are lot more people in the se of the uk than up north - therefore the situation becomes more serious more quickly.
the supermarket shevles are empty in some places according to local reports - panic buying does not help but i understand some peoples concerns.
Like the several ill informed people here, if all were to stay off the roads - where would people get their food from or will there be electric/gas/water/etc/etc.
Btw , my son just rang me about something and told me how he went to the aid of a driver who's old bmw 3 series was stuck in snow. as he was helping to push the car back out of the snow he noted the road tax was out of date by a few months - he went back to his car and called the cops on the local number and reported the description of the car, and the person driving and took a picture as well. he is awaiting the cops to contact him.
so if you lack a road legal car, you are more likely to get caught out.
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Oh dear 2007. When you said you were going to rest your case I hoped fervently that you were going to rest it for a bit longer this time.
But you have over-egged the pudding again by boasting that your son is a creep like you who wastes police time.
Hands up anyone who wants to be 'helped' by 2007 or his dreadful offspring.
Edited by Lud on 10/01/2010 at 15:21
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Btw my son just rang me about something and told me how he went to the aid of a driver who's old bmw 3 series was stuck in snow. as he was helping to push the car back out of the snow he noted the road tax was out of date by a few months - he went back to his car and called the cops on the local number and reported the description of the car and the person driving and took a picture as well. he is awaiting the cops to contact him. so if you lack a road legal car you are more likely to get caught out.
You should insist your son emphasises to the Police how he helped the driver get the illegal car back on the road before reporting the incident.
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I know Bluebell Hill very well Paul, having once walked up there from Maidstone where my Brother lives = very steep!!! so it only takes a couple of cars becoming stuck to make it a no-go area.
My wife, who has more sense than I'll ever have says that Re: the cars being towed away and charged £150, if they were causing an obstruction or were a potential danger to other road users, then of course they would have to be removed, although 100 cars is a tad OTT me thinks.
Here in Cornwall last Thursday, loads of vehicles were abandoned en-route to work in the morning, they just had no other option due to ice on the hills, my wife is in charge of 22 people in 2 offices and most managed to get to work - British see!
Blame is for God and small children but ... I think a lot can be learned from winter 2010, whether the weather will change anything as regards to forward planning, well - I think I'll go and put the kettle on :)
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what you will agree with that there are are lot more people in the se of the uk than up north -
Really, on what do you base this statement?
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the authorities' response to this weather has been little short of abysmal, >>
Agreed. My view is that there is a case for keeping 20 days of salt in stock, and for having at least double the number of snow ploughs and gritters in service, even though they may only be required once in a winter's blue moon[*]. I belive that the cost to the economy of not doing so is far greater than would be the cost to the taxpayer of providing this surplus standby capacity.
blame people for trying to get to work when they don't have a choice (for lots of people no show = no pay), shows a staggering lack of understanding how some people in this country have to live. >>
I only blame those people who ventured out unprepared for the conditions. (Some of these fools were shown on the box trying to retrieve their cars the next day; they were trying to remove the snow under their tyres by kicking at it - they still had no idea that they needed a shovel for the job!)
The road I live on is just 100 metres long, and is covered in snow and ice, but has easy access from the main A road which has been clear of snow. The newspaper shop owner has delivered papers daily, the milkman has delivered mild daily, a new neighbour has had workmen coming everyday, etc. - but the people absent on this list are the binmen and the postmen.
Yes I'm sure some of the journeys could have been avoided, but I'd bet a heck of a lot of them couldn't. >>
Sure, full marks for trying but if those who got trapped for whatever reason expect the Police and/or the taxpayer to pay for removing their cars from the roads, i have no sympathy. The cost should be borne by the car owner/driver.
winter's blue moon[*] : A blue moon, so-called because it was the second full moon of the month, coincided with New Year's Eve in Europe and other parts of the world. Blue moons occur every two or three years but the next time one takes place on New Year's Eve will be in 2028.
Edited by jbif on 10/01/2010 at 14:00
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Blue moons occur every two or three years but the next time one takes place on New Year's Eve will be in 2028.
Remind me a few days before, jbif, that sounds like it may be worth a look... ;)
Edited by b308 on 10/01/2010 at 14:04
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I make my best efforts to get to work, down B and unclass roads, untreated in any way, because I am part of a team that provides a public service. If I don't get to work I am not paid and if they ring me up and say, the roads are unfit don't come in, I still don't get paid. I either have to fogo the pay, take leave or make up the time later in the year. I am not complaining about this - it is the way it is and, luckily, I don't rely on the meagre salary for my basic existence. I never ever go out on unecessary journies - what is the point?
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There is a lot of anger at the poor ( polite version) performance of the local authorities in treating the roads.
Yes I think there should be a strategic decision to have a stock of road gritters salt, grit even snow ploughs.
The taxpayer will have to pay for it but if it means there will be some action to clear the roads it will be worth it.
Or perhaps it should come out of the huge amout all legal road users already pay but the money is wasted by the Labour party in more quangos and PC groups etc etc. Ill stop now before I become too political. ( and save my blood pressure)
.
Remember this when you come to vote.
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Remember this when you come to vote.
I shall if i can find anyone likely to do anything different, so far it's deafening in it's silence.
Why are we so dependent on the nanny state here...yes i know thats how the state wants it, sheep blindly following where their told to, but have so many people lost so much self reliance and responsibility that they can't cope on the road with a bit of cold or snow?
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GB,
Would it be fair to congratulate our local council ( im just over the fields now! ) for what seems to be an effective gritting policy?
Ive found our roads quite passable for the most part - especially compared to Northampton - when it snowed the other day, you could actually visably see the council boundry when entering Northampton where gritting is apparently a bit new age for them :-)
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Would it be fair to congratulate our local council ( im just over the fields now! ) for what seems to be an effective gritting policy?
I don't know Stu, i'm not really bothered whether they grit or not...ungritted does have advantages as many of those incapable of driving unless on perfect roads simply don't go out which has been very nice the last week, and if the road's bad you do know where you are, unlike feeling safe on cleared roads then hitting a patch which got missed.
Glad to hear you've come nearer to us civilised northern half of the county'ites.;)
Went down the 509 to MK early on Weds morning, soon as we reached the Bucks border salting had halted so Northants had done their bit...we came up behind a gritter at Olney ploughing but not gritting and followed him to the motorway (nipped past on the dual carriageway)..his grit spinner was covered in snow so i doubt he'd spread any grit at all..certainly the road surfaces bore that out.
You'd be proud of me, i haven't washed the cars since last weekend but did give all 8 alloys a scrub to remove the salt layer.
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>> Would it be fair to congratulate our local council ( im just over the fields >> now! ) for what seems to be an effective gritting policy?
I suppose that I should also congartulate both Worcestershire and Birmingham for keeping the main roads open as well. So far I've not had any problems getting in, and they have concentrated on the main roads which is where I'd expect them to do... On the side roads I have to use I've just taken it very easy... keep it up, folks!
Paul, re your earlier reply, if you can prove that all those abandoned cars were driven by the people you mention, then fair enough, but I don't think you can, just as much as I can't prove it the other way...
Oh, and before you have a go at me for my journeys, I suppose that I should mention that they need me and my colleagues to run the trains...
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b308
i could say i could not careless about trains as i do not use public transport but won't!
many that work in the private sector fear for their jobs and this is why they turn up.
many work a locums and only get paid if they turn up.
sure there were people out there that could have stayed away, but trust me most would have been there as a necessity.
many may have been caught out as weather predictions are a bit like tossing a coin
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>>can't cope on the road with a bit of cold or snow
Its all down to the gulf stream lulling the UK into a false sense of security. As soon as we get a taste of the weather that we would have all the time in this part of the hemisphere were it not for the above, theres panic over salt reserves.
People from Canada, Scandinavia or Russia watching UK news must be incredulous...
Edited by corax on 10/01/2010 at 15:11
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Its all down to the gulf stream lulling the UK into a false sense of security.
We're only starting to get winters like we should have and indeed did only a few years ago, good job too i hope they become the norm again.
Bit of tough going always sorts the men etc.;)
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Quite a bit of snow in my part of the world (north mids) but gritters doing a good job on main roads. No problems at home or work - binmen and post getting through, parts getting delivered, both kids schools open. Only problem was our bank who could not deal with our query due to 'extreme weather conditions' and told us to ring back later, we got the same message then too. Presumably staff not bothering to turn up. When you are on very good money i dont suppose losing a day or two pay is anything to worry about then.
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WT
Cheers for the update.
our area a more salubrious place, near bluewater;
post, hit and miss.
milkman - can't get up the slope with battery van but walks.
bin collections missed and no pick due for the next 5 days at least.
local waitrose running out of items, especially milk and bread but does re-stock asap.
power flickers.
side roads frozen and no grit and will not be grited as well as pavements.
main roads ok.
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our area a more salubrious place near bluewater;
More salubrious? Area round bluewater is a dump.
Edited by WorkshopTech on 10/01/2010 at 15:39
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WT
i don't want to give you my exact location but trust me, it's a damn nice place. but it's your choice if you wish to agree
:)
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Come on 2007 - I'd like to give it as wide berth as possilbe
Edited by CGNorwich on 10/01/2010 at 16:00
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>>>local waitrose running out of items, especially milk and bread but does re-stock asap.<<<<<
If your local waitrose is running short of supplies Paul I can assure you it's because you and your neighbours are panic buying.
The Firm both I and mr pda work for have had deliveries into Waitrose National Distribution Centre at Aylesford and Bracknell DAILY this week and that includes Morrisons at Sittingbourne, Tesco's Purfleet and Sainsbury at Charlton.
Granted the deliveries may have been a couple of hours late but the lorry drivers have got through the terrible road condition and managed to do their job.
Whilst all this was happening, I was fending off emails via Blackberry's from car drivers, complaining that lorries were a} going to fast or B} going too slow or C}blocking the road and asking what I entended to do about it as a trustee of the Professional Drivers Association.
One night we had 2 'day' drivers run out of time and had to spend the night in their cabs on the roadside at Ayleford with no food, toilet, hot water or bedding BUT the deliveries were made to Waitrose.
See how the other half live Paul and think just how lucky you are to be able to take A?L when the going get's tough.
Pat
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post, hit and miss side roads frozen and no grit and will not be gritted as well as pavements
Probably why the post is hit and miss. Our postlady has delivered our post without fail, despite the fact she has a bicycle with a heavy load balanced on the top of compacted snow and ice. I know how difficult it is for them because my mum used to be a postlady getting up at 3.30am in order to sort and get out to the routes on time. When we had some bad winters in the 80's I remember her bike slipped and she banged her head on the car she was cycling past. Also they have their hands nipped by dogs waiting on the other side of the letterbox.
I went out and gave ours a christmas cash bonus in the previous interlude of snow when it had rained and refrozen. She could hardly walk across the road to receive it. A lot of the stuff they have to carry around is chucked in the bin as soon as it goes through the letterbox.
So try and look at it from their perspective. And if they can't post today, they'll be able to when the paths and roads are safer....
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Corax
I was not having a go at the postie - just an observation.
i respect decent people that work hard for a living!
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>>to trat a broken leg, and the after math especially if that person with the broken leg is a working tax payer is eastimated to be a cool 400k per person on avg. <<
I put it through babelfish but it didn't help.
Anyway this is utter nonsense.
It actually saves the country money if a pensioner breaks her hip and dies within a few weeks due to complications. Not nice, but it's true.
A simple fracture in a younger person is likely to cost them 6-8 weeks off work, a couple of days as an inpatient (possibly no time at all), and 4 or 5 visits to the fracture clinic.
400 grand?
Nope.
**EDIT** and just to add, over the past 50 years dozens of ill-prepared drivers and their passengers have DIED as a result of trying to drive along roads that turn out to be impassable - I don't recall governments being the 'cause' of their demise.
Edited by Lygonos on 10/01/2010 at 15:33
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You can throw all the salt/grit in the world on a road but if the snow comes down thick and fast over a sustained period, combined with sub zero temperatures, then for a period of time roads will be overwhelmed and the chances are that any motorist caught on them will at worst be stuck and have to abandon their vehicles. Which is what has happened.
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I am having a flashback to the M4 last Tuesday night, quite heavy traffic in a near-blizzard, everyone scurrying along as fast as they dared - down to 30mph at times - with that abandoned-vehicle scenario in their minds. It was certainly in mine. Phew!
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By my definition anywhere near a Waitrose is over crowded and definitely not 'nice'. I like looking at the Geese by the pond over the road, the horse riders passing in the field behind and the Barn Owl in the evenings. That's my 'nice' area. Grit? not here.
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My moment if fame was to participate in a local BBC 30 minute documentary about the councils approach to gritting (or not) in our local area. Titled - 'True Grit'.
Copies available :-))
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FC
sorry i did not read your post b 4 responding to MD
though i rarely walk on the pavements, i do feel for the people that have to use pavements. This nationwide salse economy of saving money is not on.
good luck
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MD
My drink near came back out of my mouth and on to my new laptop = ROFl
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jbif, dont talk rubbish...how can a failed diode pack causing alternator failure be the foolishness of the driver/owner?
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jbif dont talk rubbish...how can a failed diode pack causing alternator failure be the foolishness of the driver/owner?
Its not, but you dont expect the taxpayer to pay to transport it to the garage do you.
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Its not but you dont expect the taxpayer to pay to transport it to the garage do you.
Like yeah ! init !
Call it blame kulcha if you will.
Remember, where there's blame there's a claim.
We read today of 'elf n Safety telling people not clear their footpaths otherwise someone may sue if they fall on a not pristine surface.
Rediculous ! but that is where we are at...
Edited by gmac on 10/01/2010 at 18:45
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The drivers that were stuck in the snow, most possibly belonged to 'break down' orgs! so their car may have been fixed free or towed free. however the AA/RAC/ETC where overwhelmed with calls and that is a fact.
you post was not aimed at me i think but the poster is not advocating the statements you make.
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I like snow and ice .
It keeps the hoi polloi off the roads.
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I like snow and ice .
It keeps the hoi polloi off the roads <<
For the same reason I like petrol at £1.30+ a litre
:-)
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...We read today of 'elf n Safety telling people not clear their footpaths otherwise someone may sue if they fall on a not pristine surface...
That can be twisted another way.
I heard a radio report from America which said the approaches to the subways in New York are cleared by the local authority.
The reason given was the authority could be sued if it let people walk on slippery snow and ice.
According to the correspondent, no judge in America would entertain a 'you only half-cleared it and I hurt myself' claim.
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you post was not aimed at me i think but the poster is not advocating the statements you make.
You are correct, my posting was rather flippant. Without getting political, we often read about people bemoaning the fact the Government are turning the UK into a nanny state but after seeing the actions of the majority is their an alternative?
We are talking about people going out in Arctic conditions illprepared.
I am a contractor with a young family in the same boat as many on here, no work = no pay. If I must go out in this I like to give myself a sporting chance. There is always the unknown but to put yourself at risk without the basics is, in my view, madness.
Edited by gmac on 10/01/2010 at 19:03
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no AE i dont ..are we talking about breakdowns or cars that have no traction due to the weather?
Edited by zookeeper on 10/01/2010 at 18:57
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I can't wait to see what the whinge level will be when we get a metre or more of snow in areas that are not used to any snow, and one year we will!
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I will then put snow chains on my Jeep SRT and fit a snow plough to the front - lol
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Paul, you have a special gift for endearing yourself to other people - I quote from your recent posts:
The jeep hemi was a treat to myself. Importantly, we can afford them! (this and the S class)
I do feel for the people that have to use pavements...
I live in a more salubrious area.. (than the West mids)
I nearly brought my drink back over my new laptop (How much was that then?)
My son reported the driver for no tax and took a picture (good boy, well done)
Look forward to more of your posts about motoring.
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Paul
you are the best creation since Mr X. I'm sure there is potential for a comedy series
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CGN
this 'mr x'
though i've read here for longer than i've been registered, never came across the name.
i never like to offend people but don't mind adding bits of wit.
importantly, my reason for posting is sincere and i usually seek info -EG 'the oil sucker' thread and others.
i have several items i do not like and strong views on these.
i am paaul2007 and no one else.
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Paul,
Whether you are for real as you say, or a brilliant creation,as I hope, do carry on posting. Livened up this forum no end!
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I bet he goes the same way as Mr X. Remarkable similarities.
Edited by Old Navy on 10/01/2010 at 21:02
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Never seen in the same post
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