SWMBO is looking to change her car, we've been considering a few options but it always comes back to the Golf VI, she had a MK IV and changed that for a Civic which for all its merits (brilliant 2.2 CTDi engine for instance) she never warmed to.
Now logic says that the Octavia is ostensibly the same car, for the money we're prepared to spend we could get a Petrol VRS with a few options (like curtain airbags) or a Golf VI 122 SE with options so they're about the same spec, probably decided to avoid diesels due to DPFs and the fact this car will be low mileage (5K pa). The 1.8 L&K Octavia is also a contender.
The sort of questions I have are:
Is the updated Octavia more akin to the Golf V than the Golf VI ? Having driven both of the Golfs the VI is a big improvement imho - a lot less rattly / plasticy and that's our concern with the Octavia.
Is the Octavia noticeably bigger - it looks it on the road - it's a second car so not necessarily a benefit.
Is the Octavia more reliable ?
Are the dealers better - they're certainly fewer and further between ?
Any other (polite) opinions, we're probably looking to place our order in the next week or so.
P.S. Seats don't seem to be 'that cheap' compared to Golfs so have been discounted, perhaps unfairly.
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My understanding, only gleaned from the motoring press mind, is that MKVI Golf is merely a very nice facelift of MKV Golf. And yes, Octavia is based on MKV Golf. My purely personal view is that the Golf is a nicer product to be sat in but I'd buy (and am still trying to convince her!) an Octavia tomorrow. I've got a MKV Golf and it's very satisfying to own. I think it's one of those cars where the whole is better than the sum of the parts, if that makes sense. It doesn't annoy in any way and does everything well. Feels as good at 92k as it ever did. If you can afford the Golf and don't need the space offered in the Octavia, then I think that answers it!
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Woodster - thanks for your response.
Interesting you say the Golf 'feels good', it's that 'feel good factor' which draws my wife back to the Golf, interestingly she kept her Golf IV for 5 years but wants to change the Civic after less than 3 and it's all down to something intangible, hence my post asking for tangible reasons to choose the Octavia over the Golf !
In actual fact the lifetime costs appear to be broadly similar - at least in terms of depreciation.
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Also looking in similar range for SWMBO... new if that's what it takes. She has 100% discounted the Octavia due to its *hatch with a boot* rear styling. For my own use we nearly bought one (an estate) to replace our Mondeo III earlier this year but being Golf based it was just too small after the Mondeo.
My cousin has just bought a new Octavia diesel for delivery in a week or so and their only negative was the grille/headlamp styling that seems designed to arrive well before the rest of the car.
I like the Octavia and I'm pleased one will be arriving in the family if not on our drive. However if the prices were broadly equal for what you're looking at... and the features were also equal for your use... I'd have the Golf.
Edited by M.M on 19/11/2009 at 11:29
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Having had 8 VWs on the trot I feel qualified to speak. I like the styling and feel it is a much cheaper Passat in execution. Love the big rear hatch and the front grille differentiates it nicely. No qualms about swapping marques.
Now have a 2009 Facelift Octavia hatchback.
Edited by Glaikit Wee Scunner {P} on 19/11/2009 at 11:49
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Having owned a Skoda and a Golf MK5 at the same time it would be the Skoda anytime - that's based on dealer experiences alone. ( two of each brand)
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Forgot to factor the dealers in. It is true to say in our area the VW dealers are quite arrogant and just expect you to cough up whatever. The nearest Skoda dealer is far more approachable and the next furthest is even better.
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Buy a Golf from the brokers and have it serviced at a Skoda dealer.
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It's funny you should say that - I spoke to a Skoda dealer (single franchise) and they said they would - it obviously covered the warranty as they used VAG kit, they quoted me a price that was cheaper than the local VW dealer. I would never buy a VW car again and use one of their dealers. They were bad to the point of negligence.
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All warranties must be honoured now, provided you can show servicing in accordance with manufacturers schedule and agent is VAT reg'd. I couldn't see VW's argument in event of a claim if, as we've said, a VAG group dealer was used. Think I've seen on here before that Skoda dealers are cheaper. I always instruct the dealer to do service items only - any other consumables (pads/discs/tyres) I get done elsewhere. And a friend of mine recently haggled with a main dealer over a scheduled service price and got them down when booking it. They need the business just like everyone else. I'm digressing...
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We have a small off shoot of the main VW dealer left as pretty much the only car dealership 'in town', everything else is on an industrial estate 5 miles away. Our previous experience of them (with the Golf IV) wasn't bad (although it wasn't good either). The nearest Skoda dealer is about 12 miles away and that is one of SWMBO's objections.
When I had my previous A4 B7 170PDi I got some VW 507 oil (which it habitually guzzled) at a Skoda dealer whilst visiting relatives in the NE and it was 20% cheaper than VW or Audi were charging, down in the SE the Skoda dealers were charging exactly the same as their VW and Audi counterparts so I'm not sure there's a real saving to be had in my vicinity by using them to service the car ?
I suspect we'll be looking to brokers to get either car since I expect the dealers to offer a long wait for build and therefore no real discussion of PX and so no advantages to doing business through them - but I might be pleasantly surprised. I'm tempted to use DtD as I've seen them recommended so many times before.
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>>Octavia is based on MKV Golf>>
The original Octavia was launched in 1959...:-)
The version we know was launched in 1998 and was updated about five years ago.
It's more akin to my VW Bora as although it's a hatchback, it has a saloon outline just as with the Seat Toledo (based on the 1990s Jetta).
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My daughter has an recent Passat diesel and I have a recent Skoda Superb diesel. Her is 140bhp mine is 130bhp but very similar to drive and I swap between them, no problem.
They are different cars but the drive in both is very good, so it's down to preference. I would stick to my Skoda. I had an Octavia previously and it was great, reliable, comfortable and cheap to run and that boot!!!!!!!!! you get an echo from it. The real difference is when it comes to dealers. I have taken and collected both cars for services and the Skoda dealer is miles better than the VW dealer in every respect. So grab it while you can, Skoda won't be that small niche dealership for much longer. Good luck with whatever you decide. Concrete
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VW dealers differ in many ways to Skoda - its not just a money thing..
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I agree dealers do differ, I even had a great Renault dealer in the past---honestly. Our local VW dealerships staff are very snotty and are doing you a favour by dealing with you, the Skoda dealers staff are the opposite, but I only speak as I find. In this repect you are right it is not a money thing-it is a whopping great ATTITUDE thing. They are there to service your vehicle, for which you pay handsomely and keep them in jobs. If they cannot grasp that simple fact then they can differ in as many ways as they like they will not get repeat business from servicing or sales. I am not being overly critical, I have been using dealers for servicing for over 40 years and I am in sales myself so I know how to deal with people and get the best response from them and I am sometimes so disheartened when I witness some of these dealership front desk 'oiks 'and the way they treat their customers. Concrete
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Yes when I said the local VW dealers want you to cough up whatever I meant their attitude was more... It's technical you wouldn't understand... we know best... yes it may be your car but you don't really have a say in what we do... no you can't speak to the technician... our service receptionist can tell you all you need to know... and so on.
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They missed a GIANT fault on Mrs P's Golf when I took it in for a service. Much maligned National Tyres found it and fixed it a week later when I went for new tyres (suggested by VAG) who didn't find the hugely misaligned wheels let alone fix it. I have never, ever go back to them.
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I would take the Golf. The Golf Mk6 is a massively redesigned and refined Golf 5 with very few take over parts. I think the Golf is the best compromise of the VAG compact products. It handles very well without the feeling you get in an A3 that they've forgotten to fit springs. It also rides very well without the wallowy feeling of the Octavia. Its a compact size so you can park it and it will cruise all day at autobahn speeds (unless its the bog standard 1.4).
Whenever I drive a Golf I always wonder why I need anything else. Then I drive a BMW and realise it's got a case of needing...
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the wallowy feeling of the Octavia.
The only Octavia I've driven, an early-2000s I.8T 4X4, doesn't feel wallowy at all but quite firm, although it sits slightly high on the road. Much nicer than any Golf I've driven although they are all right and some models are terrific.
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Octavia is a nice car (I have one) but the Mark VI Golf is superior in many ways, not least in the handling and the quality of the interior. Octavia is "last year's" technology and will depreciate in value quicker than the Golf. As for dealer's I don't buy into this Skoda good VW bad thing. In my experience it just depends on the individual dealer. I could name a truly awful Skoda dealer and equally a very good VW dealer
If you are prepared to pay the premium for the Golf you will get a better product.
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OP, you have really answered your own question. There are many logical reasons to have the Octavia but your wife is drawn to the "intangible" feel of the Golf, as many people are. Nothing wrong with that, I think she may always want the Golf if she's driving around in the Skoda. So buy the Golf! And I say that as an Octavia owner!
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Thanks for all of the replies, every other car had already been eliminated and the Octavia versus Golf question was to settle the 'head versus heart' aspect of the decision, if you buy the wrong car you're kinda stuck with your choice for a while if you don't want to be too profligate !
Incidentally, by my reckoning the costs for the two are broadly similar over the 3 year period for which I compared them.
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I considered an Octavia before I bought my Golf VI this year. Didn't drive any Octies, but did have a look around a 2009-spec Octavia S. The Octavia is a much bigger car, with a pretty impressive boot - if it's load space you're after, it would be hard to beat. The perceived quality of the interior didn't seem far short of a Golf S: switchgear is very similar, if not identical, and it did have one or two extras (net pockets on side of console and oddment trays in the seat bases IIRC). The Octavia has a very similar range of engines, but also has the option of the 1.8TSI engine, which seems rather nice, and isn't available on the Golf (in the UK). On the other hand, the Golf VI does have ESP and 7 airbags as standard, which the Octavia doesn't.
Edited by Typ 8L on 19/11/2009 at 22:10
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I think this depends very much on the model you're going for. I had a Golf estate (2.0TDI) and now have an Octavia as I wanted a GTI estate (GTD, to be exact) which you can't have as a Golf (i.e. with the 170 bhp CR engine) but can as an Octavia (or an Audi A4 for about £6,000 more).
For some equally unfathomable reason, you can't have the 1.8 petrol engine in the Golf, but can in the Octavia. This (with 158 bhp) must be a lot faster than a Golf with 122, and if you can run to the petrol vRS (197 bhp) the gap is even wider.
So it's a matter of what SWMBO wants (logic may or may not play a part here....). If most of her driving is around town the smaller Golf will do the job very well: if more of it is on the open road then it seems a shame not to spend the same money on the vRS, or indeed less on the 1.8.
I agree with the comment that it's the individual dealer that's good or bad - it's just that the proportion of Skoda dealers which are family-owned (the factor that usually makes all the difference) is higher than for VW.
Edit - one other thing: the vRS ride is harder than on the Elegance (and presumably also the L & K) - this may be a factor for you.
Edited by Avant on 20/11/2009 at 00:09
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Thanks Avant, all stuff we've been considering, the true test will be to drive a 122, we've tried the 170 TSi (Mk V) but assume it's much like the Mk VI 160 and we've tried the 140CR in the Golf VI too - very nice and a vast improvement on the 170PD I hated so much in my A4 B7.
I'd like the VRS petrol but she'd prefer something a bit more low-key, less of a 'target' at the traffic light grand prix.
You're right - a Golf SE with the 1.8TSi would be perfect..... I think if the 122 disappoints then we'll be trekking over to the Skoda dealer to look at a 1.8TSi L&K/Elegance Octavia.
Will post findings on the 122 soon.
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I had a Mk1 Octavia for 5 yrs and 120000 miles. I bought it 2nd hand at 5yr old and it was a pretty good buy. So much so I wanted a new Octavia Scout Tdi. It ticked all the boxes but after 3 lengthy test drives I could not get comfy with the seats. I am about 6'1" and 16 stone. The seat just seemed to push me in/forward at the upper back/shoulder area making me hunched.
I bought a Volvo V50 because of the comfy seats but still think the Octavia would be a far superior car.
Sounds like the Golf and Octavia may be too big for your missus' requirements. Have you considered the new Polo?
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I've been going around a similar loop for a while now.
I like the Octavia in both hatch and estate form. But I have a hankering for an E-class estate, for similar money one can pick up a nearly new Octavia or a 3 year old Merc.
Throw the latest Superb into the mix (especially the estate in a couple of months) and I've a choice of 3 cars which are all practical, pretty well equipped and should be good to drive.
My feeling is that in 18 months or so Superb estates will be a very good used buy, and maybe I just need to be patient.
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The Superb estate could be a very good new buy too. There's a good chance that it'll capture sales (especially in CR 170 diesel form) from Volvo and Mercedes, and also from the Mondeo if the price and equipment compare favourably.
If it becomes the 'estate to be seen in' - yes, it's possible - it could hold its value quite well too.
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Well the Golf 122 drives very nicely imho, perhaps you don't really need 245PS and 400lbft to get along gracefully? (sic), I am a convert..... It's very refined / quiet too.
So now we need to get our local dealer to sharpen his pencil, offered a reasonable-ish PX since they don't sell non-VWs but no discount when even What Car suggests £1K off, (with DtD it's more like £2K). Claims of long build times but there are near-matches for spec in the country, can't have our cake and eat it but will push for a more equitable deal.
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Thanks to all who posted, we bought the Golf, our nearest (and generally helpful) dealer wouldn't budge on price due to claimed (and real) availability problems - so we went to one a few miles away who did, SWMBO very happy and will have the car in a few weeks.
If anyone is interested, VW seem to have very long build times on the TSi 122 at the moment so you might need to be flexible on colour / options.
Thanks again.....
Edited by idle_chatterer on 22/11/2009 at 19:37
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The Superb estate could be a very good new buy too.
Quite likely, it'll be cheap, reliable and well equipped, I doubt anything will be close for the same money.
But having bought new once, it's not something I'll be doing again for a while. I prefer to spend as much of my money as possible on the wife, kid and cat.
But there's a part of me that really wants to change my current car, so it's only a matter of time I guess.
Edited by Lou_O on 23/11/2009 at 11:21
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