Hi all,
We (me, wife & 11 week old son) currently run an 04 reg Toyota Avensis 1.8vvti T4 hatch, and very happy with it we are. Big enough to fit junior's pram & gubbins in and reasonably economical, if not terribly exciting.
However...
I am about to come into an inheritance. While we have no desire/ reason to change the car at the moment, I am getting very tempted by all these cheap luxo-barges. The wife has always wanted an S-type jag, and it looks like they are temptingly cheap (£10k for an 05 plate 3.0v6 from a main dealer?). We'd struggle to justify a car like that under normal circs, but with prices as low as they are and some cash coming it feels like an opportunity to be a bit naughty!
So, a few questions:
Would the running costs be crippling compared to our Toyota (we do about 6-7k a year)?
Will these jags go much cheaper?
Any reliablility issues?
Is the 3.0v6 the one to go for (the CBCB suggests these are good, but also recommends the 4.2, which is tempting but may be scarily high on juice)?
Mrs APM really fancies a jag, but I would be open to alternatives. I'd like to look at: 530, E class, S80 and A6; any other good options I've missed?
Thanks in advance!
Alex.
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Hello Alex,
I have had a recent fit of the wobbles over the possibility of buying a VW Phaeton. These are fabulous luxury motors and can be bought very cheaply at the moment. A bit bigger than a Jag, and unless you're willing to consider a diesel might be a bit beyond the pale, but still, worth thinking about.
I am *probably* not going to get one, and have been swayed by many suggestions on a thread I started on the subject, so you should get some cracking advice on here. I am leaning towards an S80 or a Passat CC as a more sensible "treat" come the spring, hopefully prices may have softened further by then. Am also considering an A6 or A8, despite being a bit luxury-brand averse.
I think if I were to fancy a Jag it would have to be an XJ6, rather than an S-type.
Good luck!
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I think if I were to fancy a Jag it would have to be an XJ6 rather than an S-type.
the fuel consumption on the XJ6 is far more noticeable than the S type. My independent gives me XJ6 or XJ8's as a courtesy car and the fuel seems to go straight down through a hole in the floor
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Westpig, company fuel cards are a teriffic way of blinding one to the problems of low MPG!
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I appreciate your desire to run a Big Cat. However before you splash the cash, just bear in mind a) the running costs and b) will you be able to get all the prams/buggies/pushchairs etc in the boot? Would be an awful disappointment having bought such a lovely car only to find you needed a shoe lift to get all your stuff in before you loaded up the roofrack!
I appreciate you had considered a Volvo S80. Lovely car, but tends to depreciate like a stone. Why not try a V70, combines room, safety and comfort.
Sorry to hear about your sad loss by the way.
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there's no real bad reliability issues... (i've owned a 3 litre for 6 years)
at the age you're looking at the early problems will have been sorted out.
the heating system can have a valve stick, which is about £200, door locks can stick, they're £200.. you'll need to find a good Jag independent, there's plenty in Jaguar World Monthly
boot is a bit shallow, but has quite a good reach, comfy, quick, reliable car with a load of extras in it as standard (compared to many marques)
fuel economy will be 28-30mpg (eventually) at 70-75 mph on m/way, between 16 - 18.5mpg in town, depending on how bad the traffic is. If you like hearing that V6 on the A roads, then you're looking at 25mpg
Edited by Westpig on 17/11/2008 at 13:48
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apm - I too echo the concern about the bootspace on an S-type for prams et al. What about the tip run too? Is a saloon going to cut it?
Have you considered an x-type estate with the same 3.0 engine?
Alternatively, and I realise this is an unoriginal suggestion, check out E39 5 series. These were executive car of the year for 7 years in a row or something and the 530i estate will probably be the best all round car.
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A mate bought one a couple of years ago, pre credit crunch and paid about £12000.It looked nice in a sort of metallic green with cream/beige leather interior, all the toys and at first he was thrilled with it.
Then small niggly faults started to occur and of course the fuel consumption was high and so was the cost of servicing, tyres etc. The novelty wore off within a year or so and he traded it in, still pre credit crunch for a Ford Mondeo ST TDCI.
All I can say is that he liked the Mondeo more than the Jag, but the shock was the trade in price of just over £3000 which is eye watering depreciation.
Having said that, I think the purchase price was high and the trade in a bit low so the old saying of "yer pays your money and takes yer choice " is apt.
Edited by Mr.Tee43 on 17/11/2008 at 14:08
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Although my only Jag has been an older series 111 XJ6 - I did have an extended test drive in the newer version (from 03 onwards) about a year ago - and thought it was very Jaguar-y: really sumptuous interior, good handling, quiet lazy oomph & comfortable.
I believe the 3-litre XJ6 is lighter than an S-type, so can't see you'd be much worse off in economy terms & performance at least on par, with a more sophisticated air suspension option - and has what you're after in a Jag. No disrespect to current S-type owners, but the original S-type was little more than a re-baged American town car. The later S-type was nearer the mark, but still lacks the requisite Jaguary-ness in my view.
The build quality & fittings I've seen in the s-type still seems to lag the XJ6 - the whole ambience in XJ6s is , in my view, several classes above the 'budget' S-type.
If you're 'going for it , why stint yourself? You may only get one shot at the British luxo-barge experience, so go the whole hog with an XJsex, I mean six.
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Allowing for mileage - I think £10k is way too much for an S type petrol.
At an auction (two weeks ago)
Black S type 54 reg or 05 can't remember)
Sport trim
Black leather
Manual (ok maybe worth less- but probably better imo)
mileage Iwas under 100k (about 90 ish) - can't remember excatly
FSH, 2 owners
£5800 - plus buyers fee probably about £6k.Was a very nice car in excellent condition.
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How about a Legacy Spec B 3 litre saloon or estate. The cabin is a nice place to be, all the toys, a better car dynamically and just about bullet-proof. No wood though :-)
Edited by nick on 17/11/2008 at 17:00
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My very thought nick. But having never been in one (or noticed one) I didn't feel I could voice it.
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I believe that the latest gen XJ6 is one of the best value used luxo-barges on the market. Early ones from '03 and '04 have dropped way below the £10k mark. It's lighter than the S-type so economy should be at least as good (or bad, depending on your point of view). I'd advise you to bide your time, however, as demand for these luxury cars is only going one way.
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I dislike 'I want to buy an X' threads where someone says 'buy a Y' but I am going to commit that sin.
If you want a Jag S then a Jag S it should be. £5,000 will get you a seriously nice one at auction. Yes really. Large petrol engined cars are virtually unsaleable at present.
However as stated above look at a VW Phaeton. These can be had three years old at £10,000 and were some £60,000+ new and are incredible machines.
You only live once.
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Yep, I too dislike 'I want to buy an X' threads where someone says 'buy a Y' but now I too am going to jump on that bandwagon!
Staying with Jag, I have recently bought a stunning black 3.0V6 Sovereign X type auto estate. Superb in every respect. Brilliant engine, plenty of space, lovely interior, all wheel drive... do give them a look
Good luck.
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I'm glad that your happy with your Mondeo, Cheeky.
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Er.. yes right Smithsonian, thanks. I'm very happy to have a nice motor based on the Mondeo with an excellent chassis and sensibly priced parts. Take your low blows and envy elsewhere and change the record. Plenty of people here know the X type/Mondeo DNA bloodline.
The S type shares some of its components with a USA Lincoln if I remember rightly? Excellent car too, and lots at the right price.
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Sorry Cheeky, it was only intended as a joke. I'm sure it's a nice car and, to be fair, a Ford Mondeo isn't exactly a bad start in life. I like to use this one on Audi-owning friends by commenting on their lovely new Skoda....
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No worries. Now feel embarrassed at being over sensitive!
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Alex sorry to be a lone negative voice here but I really feel the need to interject into this limo barge love in. Apologies if this comes across as patronising - it?s not my intention
You have a car that fits your needs perfectly. And it?s a Toyota so it?s highly likely to keep going without trouble.
You are about to get some cash, which will allow you to buy a car you couldn?t really justify previously.
All the carp about ?you only live once? etc is all well and good, but unless this inheritance is going to pay of your mortgage and fully fund your pension pot then I think you also need to think about the future.
We are in the middle of a recession, jobs are being culled left right and centre and you have an 11-week-old baby. My advice, forget these silly cars. Just sit on the money a while.
We all know that cash burning a hole feeling ? don?t give in. Chances are, that car which looks so shiny on the Internet will have a few marks and a few squeaks and a few things that don?t work quite perfectly in real life. Even if you did get a minter, your kiddie will decide to draw on the cream leather, and then poo on it and then puke on it. And then kick the back of the seats away. And then you will visit a supermarket car park and someone will ding it.
So forget about it for now. Why not use some of the cash to get the Toyota cleaned and serviced, then dump the nipper with the outlaws one weekend and take the missus away, hire a flash motor for the day whilst your there and have a great time. Just don?t spend all you dough on something you don?t really need.
Edited by nick1975 on 17/11/2008 at 21:25
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Why must you live so relentlessly in the real world!!!!
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sorry what i meant to say was, have a look at 911s, the 996 is surprisingly affordable these days, and you can get an infant in the back.
you are a long time dead!
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>>hire a flash motor for the day
Indeed.
If the OP hires an S-type, he can get a feeel for it, and see exactly how much luggae he can get in the boot, PLUS work out the consumption, let his missus take it for a spin, try to fit a kiddy seat and see how practical/impractical the car is in carparks etc.
I have an acquaintance who bought a car without thinking too wisely, and he moans about the fact that by the time he has the kids in chairs in the back seat, and pram and associated baby stuff in the boot, there's no room for any shopping! As Homer says : Doh!
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I was in a similar position this summer (but fortunately not through inheritance) - but as I do 20,000 miles a year I wasn't going to get rid of the excellent diesel Golf estate in favour of something like a Jaguar. But maybe you could do what I did and get a fun car as well as the main working car - i.e. keeping the Avensis. You have to budget for VED and a new insurance policy, but it's worth a thought.
If you're a mechanic you could go for a classic (again perhaps - didn't you have an MGB GT once?) - I'm not so mine is a 2001 BMW Z3.
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Just to further muddy the water, I would consider a Lexus. Almost certainly a safer buy. A colleague at work bought an S Type a few years ago: it cost him £12K over 18 months. A one off probably, but he now has a BMW. In any case, as has been mentioned, I doubt the boot is big enough for your needs.
Happy hunting!
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If it gives a warm feeling to look out of the window and see the Jag on your drive then go for it.
Its got nothing to do with reality and everything to do with treating yourselves!
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>>Will they go much cheaper???
Well, in 4 years, your 10k will have completely evaporated - residual value 1k, money spent on it (it's a Jag, not a Mondeo, it will cost you money...) £2k.
So how does that compare with buying a brand new Mondeo for 10k which will be worth 1k in 4 years' time?
I keep looking at the 1999/00 versions of the S-type on autotrader - that's a lot of car for 1k... though I appreciate you probably want something newer.
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Thanks for all the replies, everyone- most useful.
Just to clarify, the inheritance will be a property plus a sum of money (my greatly missed grandfather); to spend a few thousand on a car wouldn't be a high proportion. That said, there may be other priorities (extension etc).
I work in the public sector and barring a specific issue to be determined shortly, in a fairly secure position.
The wife is fond of the S-type (when previously car shopping her ex-husband over-ruled her liking for the jag and bought a Ford Explorer instead (shudder!)). That said, she's not wedded to it and would consider alternatives, but not a BMW (she used to have an E46 318CI, and hated the negative attention is engendered). I think we'd spend about £10k on a 55 plate or so, poss from a dealer, but consider private/ auction with advice.
I do like the S-type, but would consider an XJ (if not too long for our drive to enable second car to park there). Wife is softening position a bit, and might consider other options; I really fancy a Lexus, but know very little about them in fact. I think the GS300 would be the equivalent? The Phaeton is an interesting option- just seen an 04 plate on autotrader for £8k (v6 4-motion). Nice!! Not sure the wife would like a Subaru, although I would... I am twitchingly tempted by a 300C- are they in the same sort of class? How's the depreciation?
I think this would really only work with a car that's done a big chunk of depreciation (to make it a reason to ditch our worthy buy a bit dull Avensis), hence focussing on the jag in the first instance. I think we will widen our search and take some test drives (with pram in tow). I'd like to look at:
S-type
XJ6
GS300
E-class
S80
300C
Legacy
I really like Avant's idea of a second car for fun- you're right I did have an MG BGT, but think now we have junior a more modern vehicle would be better... just like the wife's much missed MX5.
Hmmm...
Much to consider!!
See what we can take out on saturday morning, methinks...
Cheers all,
Alex.
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As others say, the boot on the S-type is smaller than you'd imagine so you'd need to check that out for yourself.
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Yep, a very nice dilemna to have! It reminds me of the old joke about publicans - the only time you see them with a worried expression, is when they don't whether to buy a Rolls-Royce or a Bentley.
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If you find the Avensis worthy but dull, then the GS300 might feel similar. Think about a GS430 instead. It's not that much madder but it is that much more interesting.
(I've had a GS300 and an S-type, driven the GS430 a few times and preferred the GS over the Jag.)
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Are you, perhaps, overlooking the most important consideration?
Mrs APM really fancies a jag
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the most important consideration? >> Mrs APM really fancies a jag
HJ liked the non-turbo V8 XKF... are there any good used ones yet one wonders?
(Perfectly inoffensive post by the way GM... ) :o}
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(Perfectly inoffensive post by the way GM... ) :o}
:)
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