Pity the poor gentleman causing M25 proportions tailback chaos on my local Tesco forecourt this morning by having accidently put two litres of unleaded into his diesel A2!
In a nutshell ? what happens next:
Rescue service hotline activated?
Complete flushing of fuel system necessary?
Likely cost of this bleary-eyed/early morning mistake?
It wasn't me I assure you ? merely a sympathetic observer...
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I reckon that might not be a problem at all if he fills to the brim with Diesel.
Someone who knows for sure will be along in a second...
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Parp, Parp!
Note: All Toad posts come with an implied smiley.
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Toad is absolutely right. Putting a bit of petrol into the diesel is a way to prevent problems in the cold in winter. IIRC, up to 25% petrol isn't a problem.
Don't try it the other way round, though. Diesel into petrol certainly doesn't work.
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It does, up to a point, if the car is a pre-cat one. I once put a couple of gallons of diesel in by mistake, but as the tank was very low I then filled up with petrol. It did go, with a lot of smoke. When I got home I drained it all out into jerry cans and refilled again.
I used the mixed stuff in lawnmowers and an old tractor, so it wasn't wasted.
But I'm more careful now.
BTW, why can't they standardise the hose colours in petrol stations?
It seemed once as if the colours would be Green=unleaded, red = LRP, black = diesel, blue = super unleaded. Simple. Now virtually anything goes. Even green needs checking just in case.
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Don't try it the other way round, though. Diesel into petrol certainly doesn't work.
That sounds like a challenge!
I'm off to Wales tommorow.
I reckon my Rover can do 650 miles in a weekend having had 2ltrs of Diesel.
Prace your brets now!
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Parp, Parp!
Note: All Toad posts come with an implied smiley.
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Fiver says it gets there and back having run better than ever before and becomes Toad's secret tuning aid for next 12 car.
;-)
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Having mixed up the car (diesel) and motorbike (petrol) fuels once, IMHO you can get away with about five or ten percent diesel in petrol.
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Three days ago I put 14 ltrs of unleaded petrol into my Citroen C5 HDi diesel. Fortunately my tank was already over half full of diesel so, when I spotted my mistake, I filled the tank to the brim with diesel and drove VERY SLOWLY to the Citroen Garage about 2miles away.
I was given the full doom and gloom scenario by their service department and told that I might just get away with a tank emptying and flushout. The downside was a new pump, seals and catalytic concerter - at around £2000.
The garage had to put me at the end of a very long queue and I am still waiting to hear their final diagnosis.
Older, less sophisticated diesels could put up with a few litres of diesel and simply bun it off. Today's complex filtration systems are far less foregiving. I believe that car manufacturers should include a 'government health warning' in the bumph that comes with the car. I also believe that diesel pumps should be separated from petrol pumps to avoid this very common mistake happening. Yes, I was an idiot who lost concentration for a moment. But there are an awful lot of us about.
I will know my fate shortly, but my LESSON IS LEARNED!
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Further to the above. I now have the car back and I was fortunate that draining the tank and cleaning the pipes sorted it out. The total cost of this stupid error was in the region of £200.
I shall take grat care not to let it happen again!
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Further to the above. I now have the car back and I was fortunate that draining the tank and cleaning the pipes sorted it out. The total cost of this stupid error was in the region of £200.
Been there, got the t-shirt -- and I remember well how much the bill hurt. If it's any consolation, you're not alone in making this mistake!
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hi, this may mean nothing now, but if you had driven 2 miles, then it would of been ok to leave it, as i did it twice (i know stupid) but both times the car stoped with-in 500yards, so 2 miles would mean it was ok, a friend of mine also done it, but he relized his mistake, at the pump, the garage was really halpful, they lent him a tube, and a drum, to siphon the petrol out, and they also told him to jack the other side up, so i think your garage was making a killing out of you, sorry.
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I had a friend who had had diesels for years until he got a Pug 306 petrol. He forgot and topped it up with diesel out of habit and promptly came to a halt. The AA came out, syphoned off his tank and put it straight into his (diesel) tank.
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Many years ago when I was a student I went on a weekend outing with the Hang Gliding club. We borrowed one of the Engineering faculty transits and set off early one morning. Stopped off to fill up the van and managed to put diesel into the petrol engine. We got about 50 yards out of the filling station before the van stopped. We had to be towed to a garage to have the tank drained and the engine cleaned out. The mechanics of course had a field day - much ribald wee-wee taking of the so-called engineers (not me, I was doing Chemistry) Happy Days.
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I've not admitted this to anyone before, but some years ago on a cold, wet winter's morning, I put nearly 3 litres of petrol into my Montego diesel before realising my mistake. I brimmed the tank with diesel, paid for both the petrol and diesel (the cashier said that my mistake was not uncommon) and crossed my fingers. Thought I'd got away with it - but was it coincidence that my head gasket went 1000 miles later?
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Talking of winter, in days gone by we used to use a 10:1 mix of diesel and parafin (avtur, actually) in our generators to stop the fuel waxing on a cold and windy mountain top way down south.
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Put 3 litres of petrol into a diesel Saxo last year. Phoned the AA to ask what to do next, and they said just fill it with diesel and there will be no problem. I posted about this on here, and those in the know reckoned you could get away with anything up to 1/3rd of petrol in the tank without risk.
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We ran some experiments a few years ago, with up to 5% diesel into petrol. It produced consistent improvements in smoothness, low speed driveability, and mpg. Theory is that the diesel molecules, being slower burning than petrol, keep the flame going longer and thereby create fuller combustion.
BUT, BUT, the diesel tends to separate out in a (carb)float chamber, and under high demand (ie high revs full throttle) you sometimes got too much diesel = loss of power and huge volumes of white smoke. Less of a problem on injected cars where fuel is constantly swirling in tank.But even on injected cars, at anything above around 4,500 rpm the point was reached where the diesel could not burn quickly enough, again = huge white smokeout.
At the point where the diesel ceased to burn completely a high proportion of it was forced down past the rings into the sump, so we saw oil levels rising and oil dilution occuring. At this point the experiments were curtailed, but the inside of the engines involved were spotlessly clean !
Regards, Adam
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Fascinating...
So would you advocate shoving a litre of Diesel in before doing an "Italian Tune Up", consisting of a 100 mile round trip at 70mph?
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Ian,
From a professional standpoint, I cannot say I would recommend that. But then, some people might disagree (!) and say "as a one-off, rather than a regular thing, why not, provided you change the oil and filter immediately afterwards".
Brian,
No, we did not continue the experiment long enough to establish a happy medium. Frankly, it got a bit tedious going from one pump to the other and getting shouted at by the forecourt people ! But, if pushed, I would say that 5% would be about the maximum, but even then one had to watch the revs, which is not what modern engines are all about !
Regards, Adam
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Adam
Did you establish a ratio that maximised the benefits but did not have the adverse effects?
A litre of diesel in a tankful of petrol must surely be cheaper than diesel additives?
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I gather HGV drivers, well the clever ones apparently, used to add some petrol to the diesel in winter before the advent of the anti waxing diesel fuel came along.
Back in the old days before then, it wasn't unusual to see HGV's stopped at the roadside because the diesel had waxed up in the freezing weather.
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If adding a small amount of diesel to petrol really is a good thing, then wouldn't central heating oil be the easier and cheaper option, rather than moving around pumps?
I know we have had the discussion before about diesel substitutes lacking some of the additives necessary in a diesel engine, but as a small additive to petrol that would not be a factor.
I know there would be no tax paid on the CH oil, but if it were seen as an additive to improve combustion or clean the engine, rather than as a fuel per se, then perhaps it would be in the same category as other fuel additives, which presumably are not taxed either.
But the real question is, is it a good thing to add a bit of diesel to petrol anyway?
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This sounds horribly like the 'Redex' 'upper cylinder lubricant' treament. I'm sure the more mature members will remember the trigger can on the forecourt and the purchase of '3 gallons and 3 shots'. In my case my dad used to buy it sometimes, usually when leaving for holiday and 'the car will be working hard'. It pretty much had died out once I got to buy my own petrol.
Given the oil consumption of the old engines it now seems overkill.
Regards
John S
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Does anyone else remember the Autocar test of the early model Golf diesel c1978?. Adding a percentage of petrol recommended for the prevention of winter waxing. Tester reported that it made overtaking stopped busses an interesting sport, but no harm to the engine. Fill up the Audi with it's preferred diet and drive away.
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Pity the poor gentleman causing M25 proportions tailback chaos on my local Tesco forecourt this morning by having accidently put two litres of unleaded into his diesel A2! In a nutshell ? what happens next: Rescue service hotline activated? Complete flushing of fuel system necessary? Likely cost of this bleary-eyed/early morning mistake? It wasn\'t me I assure you ? merely a sympathetic observer...
see www.rostab.com for a simple answer that prevents diesel ever being put into a petrol car or vice versa.
A \'no-cost\' option on new vehicles.
So simple you wonder why they did not do it before.
Once fuel pump nozzles have been supplied on forecourt pumps, replacement fuel pipes extend the advantage to existing vehicles, albeit at a small cost- a lot smaller than new engines, diesel injection pumps atc etc
If you don\'t push for it, you won\'t get it
DieselDirector
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Top idea!
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groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
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Been there, done that, got the T-shirt (and the red face, and the jibes about women drivers)
Just bought a s/h diesel car on a saturday, drove it homewards, stopoped for fuel before collecting a friend to go for a spin. Was very careful to pull up at the black pump, didn't want to make that mistake.
Drove off, and after about two miles the engine started spluttering like a kangaroo, before conking out. Friend irritated me mightily by saying "it must be the spark plugs", with me saying "it don't have no spark plugs". Argument not even settled when mister know-it-all looked under bonnet and couldn't find any spark plugs -- he reckoned it must be a duff car if they'd left out the spark plugs.
Called the AA, who towed car off to garage, but garage couldn't look at it till monday, No car for w/e, then threy reported back next day that they could find no problem.
Me tore hair out and cried that I had been ripped off, bought duff car, phoned vendor to moan. Vendor imsisted car was fine.
I eventually dug out the fuel receipt, and found it said petrol ... so I walked back to the filling station, and found that the pump was diesel on one side, but petrol on t'other. Grrr!
Called garage, who flushed engine etc. Car was fine thereafter, no sign of any damage to engine, but it cost me £100 for 2.5 hours labour, plus cost of oil-and-filter, plus cost of wasted fuel.
All in all, I reckon I was over £150 down for my mistake, plus without car for few days, plus putting up with all the blokes teasing me. The only people who were nice about it was the garage, who made a nice few quid ...
Claire
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"much ribald wee-wee taking of the so-called engineers (not me, I was doing Chemistry) Happy Days."
Chemistry, CHEMISTRY??!! You really should have known better than ANY engineer - sorry pal you don't get off scot free IMO!
I did this once to a diesel pickup (Vauxhall Brava - they didn't do them for very long).
A fiver's woth of petrol went in and duly resulted into poor running. The car did not come to a complete stop though. I limped to a fuel station that fortunately sold diesel (not all of them did) and brimmed it with diesel.
Turned it over a few times and eventually got it running OK. Phew! It was an unregistered car.
Hugo
"If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If it is broke, blame someone else!"
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copy of letter sent tonight to VW local dealer and VW Uk head office :-
To
deleted
Dear Sirs
Passat PD100
I am writing with regards to advice and subsequent work carried out on the above vehicle at the end of last year.
I reported difficulty starting the vehicle last year and booked the car in for a check over in-between regular services. The car appeared to be running normally, it just took an extra second or two to fire up in the morning and I was worried that it was a very early sign of glow-plug failure or something similar.
During the inspection, your technician reported that there was a smell of petrol for the fuel tank and said that the solution was to drain the tank and ?prevent further damage to the engine?. I was clearly told that any small amount of petrol in the tank would cause serious damage to the engine and that I was lucky to have made it to the dealer?s premises. Although I checked all my company fuel receipts and there was no evidence of petrol being introduced, and the vehicle was running well apart from the initial small delay when starting, I accepted the suggestion and paid a total of £223 for the tank to be drained.
I have now purchased a BMW and the manual states that up to 25% petrol should be added to a diesel in very cold conditions. I find this advice completely at odds with the information given by your service department.
It appears to me that the possibility of damage to the engine was overstated and that I may have been asked to authorise un-necessary work.
Could you please confirm whether your records agree with this statement and whether you stand by the advice given at the time.
Yours sincerely
{Contact details removed, as we operate a no naming/shaming policy on this site. DD}
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Help please!
My wife (it really wasn't me) put 0.25 of a litre of diesel (about 30 pence worth) into her Merc A class last night - it's a 1.4 litre fuel injected car (or sad excuse of a car). She realised quickly that she had made a mistake.....not getting the fuel filler in the tank properly should have alerted her! Anyway, after realising her mistake, she went on to fill it up with 51 litres of unleaded petrol and drove it home 20 miles without any problems.
I did the opposite thing to my own car a few months ago - I put about a fiver of petrol into my diesel car - it was the first time I had put fuel in it and it was my first diesel (my excuse anyway). I called recovery out who drained my tank and then flushed the car with diesel twice. They said even a litre of petrol could damage my diesel. The recovery guy went on to give me horror stories about putting even a microscopic amount of petrol in diesel engines and vice versa.
So I am asking for advice now - should I worry about the old girl's car? Should I do anything at all? Or will the very small amount of diesel in her car not affect it badly. Should I call recovery out again and deal with her car this time?
Many thanks.........Shant
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don't know if it applies to all engines & I deny any technical ability whatsoever. On a couple of occasions in the past I put a small amount of petrol, less than a couple of litres, into my Vectra 2.0 DTi. On both occasions I filled the tank with diesel and carried on. I found no running problems and when I returned the car at the end of its lease it had just over 110,000 miles on it with no problems because of the petrol.
I have heard that the same is not true putting diesel into a modern petrol engine. i.e. that this would cause problems.
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had a lapse of concentration last night at the garage and put 5.5 litres of unleaded petrol into my 1.9 tdi diesel car before noticing. then topped up the 55 litre tank with diesel to end with a 49.5/5.5 litre diesel/petrol balance.
car has run perfectly fine for 50 miles since without any sign of damage. had a trawl through the web and read conflicting stories that range from draining the tank and getting the fuel system checked out and possibly flushed or repaired at the garage... to carry on as normal and no harm will be done.
be grateful for any clarification on this dilemma.
N.B. the AA advise not to start the engine if you misfuel and to get the tank drained at the service station; hindsight is a wonderful thing!
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Hi there,
I had the same thing happen to me last night. I drive a 2003 Golf 4 - 1.9TDi (2003). I filled up exactly 5 litres of petrol. I then called the agents helpline and received various conflicting questions ranging from draining the engine etc. Eventually, I topped up the car with 40 litres of diesel. So technically there is approx. 45 litres diesel, and about 5 litres of petrol in the car.
Do you reckon I will have any problems?
Also, should I drive the car until it's on empty, or top up the car on half tank to further dilute the 5 litres petrol?
I am quite worried about the situation.
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I would'nt worry about it but to put your mind at rest why not keep briming your tank whenever practical, say every 1/4 tank used. That way you'll keep it diluted as week as possible. I bought some used ex-army jerry cans once, was a few litres of something in them and it never did my first fiesta diesel any harm.
BTW only 50 litre tank on a golf 4?
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Nah you will be fine. 45-5 a 9 to 1 mix will be ok.
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Mea Culpa
First time filled up the Trajet, put in about 4 litres of U/L into the tank, realised the mistake and topped off with Derv. Came home and told wife who just looked at me....... I told her not to do this when we got the car!!
Anyway, vehicle seems to be fine with another 1,200 miles on it.
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Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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Just wondering what is worse in terms of damage caused, a Diesel running on petrol or vice versa?
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diesel into a petrol vehicle will cause the engine to stall. It can then be safely drained and flushed and most of the time will run as good as before.
A small amount of petrol into diesel won't do any damage. Petrol is more explosive and I suppose could detonate a diesel engine if to much is put in. The injector pump on a diesel is lubricated by the fuel and would seize eventualy.
the worst mix I've heard anyone get away with was a 406 1.9 td with 30l petrol/30l diesel and 1l engine oil. The engine oil must have given it enough lubricity.
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the worst mix I've heard anyone get away with was a 406 1.9 td with 30l petrol/30l diesel and 1l engine oil.
Those XUD9 engines aren't fussy, lots of people run them on straight veggie oil, even heard of people running it on melted lard, probably one of the most forgiving engines + injection pumps out there, seems to run on anything.
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sorry to hear about your misfortune.
i took advice from the site and bought some millers dieselpower plus (about £7) and available online or from local motoring stores; you only need to add a cap full or two depending on how full your tank is at the time (instructions on the bottle). halfords do similiar products but i don't know how they rate.
i'm not an expert on these matters, but after adding the lubricant i regularly topped up with diesel to delete the petrol. after a few weeks i had a long journey and ran the tank as low as it would go without running out (had no more than 1 litre left!). i repeated this process and the car has been fine since.
don't know if there will be any long term effects but my car has just been first serviced and i was told there were no faults (i didn't tell them what had happened).
the alternative to doing what i did is to get the fuel system drained, flushed out and possible part replacement, but this can be expensive!
hope this helps you decide what to do.
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AFAIR Petrol into diesel is not too catastrophic as petrol is less viscous that diesel, and hence will flow easily through the injectors etc.
Diesel into petrol is a different matter if I am right. If you catch the problem before you leave the forecourt, provided you only put in a few litres (lets face it who can actually afford more) you can brim it with the correct fluid. I'f you've filled up then it's drain the tank time, but NOT on the forecourt.
Am I right here or about to be corrected?
Hugo
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a friend of ours stuck a tank full of unleaded into their S reg Peugeout diesel estate...it stopped needless to say.........!!we emptied it out into containers and gave it to the father in law so he can run his lawnmowers on it........the car has run great since.....the local garage offered to do the job for £40......
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Nearly - so very nearly this morning. Had pressed the button, had the green nozzle in my hand. I mean - 18 months driving a diesel! Why do we do we do it?
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I think putting petrol into a modern diesel can cause serious damage to the pump (as the only lubricant it gets is the diesel passing through and petrol does not provide any lubrication). With modern, sophisticated diesel engines this can mean a very expensive repair. This is one of the reasons why I'm a bit reluctant to buy a secondhand diesel and reading these posts it seems more than likely that a diesel has had some petrol in at some time.
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I concur;
after four years of successfully putting diesel into my cars, I managfed to brim my new BMW 3 series diesel with petrol. I drove it 50 yards called out the emergency services and had it towed into the nearest BMW garage.
Must be the most expensive car journey I've ever made; total bill for the wrong fuel is £4,800 and growing. New diesels run on really high pressure fuel systems and apparently after 50 yards the petrol had already contaminated most of the fuel system.
When I said I would take the car elsewhere to have it fixed, BMW responded by saying that they would void all my fuel and engine warranties on the car if I took it to a non-BMW garage.
Fear won and the car stayed at BMW.
HOWEVER, BMW have a remarkable filler system on diesels : bright green nylon surrounds, the same colour as the unleaded petrol pump handle.
The garage tells me they get at least one petrol into diesel job per week; the recovery guy handles at least a dozen a week.
Buy shares in BMW, they have discovered a real money-making scheme.
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Pity the poor gentleman causing M25 proportions tailback chaos on my local Tesco forecourt this morning by having accidently put two litres of unleaded into his diesel A2! In a nutshell ? what happens next: Rescue service hotline activated? Complete flushing of fuel system necessary? Likely cost of this bleary-eyed/early morning mistake? It wasn't me I assure you ? merely a sympathetic observer...
The MagneCap BBC feature was screened the weekend, link to view the feature is below.Solution to misfuelling?
www.magnecap.com/?d=press link to MagneCap on BBC News
www.magnecap.com
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Woah - One TVM is enough thanks!
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on a few ocasions now i have run the trooper on next doors tank draings after he has put petrol in his new disel golf. Fuel economy improves and engine is smother. Each time it has been abot 5 litres petrol intto about 30 disel (quarter tank)
paul
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I filled an empty Diesel Citroen C5 (HDi 2005 model) with 24ltrs unleaded, realised my mistake, added 40 ltrs of diesel. Thats about 1/3, 2/3 mix. Ran 150 miles no problems even up to 80 mph. Toppped up with diesel after 150 miles and again at 100 miles. fingers crossed, so far so good. For my next trick, I wil try chip fat!
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I realise this is a really old thread, but while we're here...!
I was stunned last week, when in a brand new 320d I had on loan, on going to fill with diesel, under the filler cap the plastic surrounding the filler hole was bright green! Talk about trying to get people to fill with unleaded!
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"fingers crossed, so far so good"
Until the common rail injection system fails and costs more than the car is worth.
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As a long term diesel driver, who has misfuelled twice in 9 years, please tell me how one can get diesel into a petrol engined car at a service station? I thought the diesel nozzles were too big to go into a diesel filler receptacle? I appreciate that a mistake can be made with jerrycans but I thought it couldn't be done at a garage.
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that'll be a PETROL filler receptacle.... :)
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'please tell me how one can get diesel into a petrol engined car'
It can be done, very slowly.
I once saw about two litres of diesel put in a petrol tank, in the time it took me to put about eighty litres of diesel in mine. I told him, he wasn't very happy!
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This is real DOOM and GLOOM stuff..Please take heart
On a quarter full tank of diesel I put in about half a tank of unleaded....did not notice but after a few miles heared a light pinking sound on load. Thought about it and carefully topped up with diesel..now about 50% mix....carefully motorways at 50mph back home...car running normally. Rang main dealer who quoted up to £11,000 as norm( engine and fuel system no charge for teeth sucking) local dealer suggested £700 to drain tank and dismantle fuel system.
DECIDED to use AA Fuel assist ( make a note of number 08702403985) and as a non member was reassured and visited within a few hours, tank drained ( fuel ecologically disposed of) added bottle of diesel fuel sytem tune-up 100 litres of fresh diesel, £200 bill and bob's your uncle ....quiet, responsive and running perfectly!!!
Although it is not possible to say that no damage was done, the car has performed perfectly ever since....several thousands of miles. Obviously petrol into an empty tank will be disasterous but as long as things are being lubricated there is a good chance.
Hope this reassures someone who may contemplate panic action.
Question.? If this is happening to 150,000 motorists a year why is it still possible to put a small nossle into a larger hole? This may be a universal question I hear you say.
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I`d second that - don`t be too gloomy!
Put 3 gallons petrol into my 05 Focus II 1.6TDCI on Wednesday evening. On Thursday am it was slowish to start- wouldn`t rev until it warmed up a bit. Fine - pulled as well as ever. Had done 5 miles. Pinked a bit at lo revs though.
Later, after stopping, cooling and another 5 miles, more reluctant to start and rev.
This is where things went badly wrong, `cos I thought the DPF filter must have blocked - so ran the thing at standstill to get it HOT!. Eventually the engine stalled and would not re-start; at which point it occured to me to look at the receipt. Petrol. Engine system warning light showing.
Friday pm. Towed in to the local tyre shop who drained and flushed everything, fitted new fuel filter and re-assembled. But it would not start. Usual gloomy thopughts about a bill from £1000 to £1500 for new pumps, injectors, etc.
Called local diesel specialist - who said "don`t worry too much" - they were proved quite right - see below.
Sat am the tyreshop still could not get to it to start, until they tried towing; which produced instant results - and the car now runs perfectly.
If I had gone to a main dealer, no doubt I would now be waiting 10 days for an appointment, to be told there was no hope but a hefty bill etc etc and re-programme the whole engine.
In fact I got a bill for £105 including a £25 filter.
Message: Don`t panic, don`t go to a main dealer, do go to a diesel specialist if necessary, do not believe all the mumbo jumbo stuff - common rail technology is not witchcraft. If you only drove a few miles you will likely be OK - but get the tank drained anyway. If you drive half-way down the M1 you might have a problem. I found a common rail diesel runs quite nicely on petrol; for a bit. But it does pink a bit. And of course, like the man said - it might come back to bite you later. So get a mechanical warranty in good time in case it does.
Oh! - but it made a pretty good job of cleaning out the DPF filter - but that`s another story. They say a DPF problem is cheaper - around £800?
AS
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If you only drove a few miles you will likely be OK
That's dangerous advice; the pump damage from mis-fuelling doesn't show up for weeks or months.
A mis-fuelled car should never be started.
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How do you know? Have you had a problem, after weeks/months?
If someone has driven a few miles, they are stuffed anyway in theory. As I thought I was. But in practice, I have no bothers, after a tank drain.
All I am saying is do not PANIC - you do not at once need to rush off to a MAIN DEALER, who, with gleaming eyes, will relieve you of £000s to restore your pride and joy to it`s virtuous condition before your mistake. My message was (and is) give it a try!
OF COURSE a mis-fuelled car should not be started - mine has all the tick boxes - (Pump on, when ignition on - VERY high pressure Common Rail - latest Hi-Tech Ford/Peugeot TDCI/HDI system). So you are right about that.
But what do ordinary folk do, if they HAVE started the wretched thing|?
Are you seriously suggesting AFTER making a mistake, that EVERY owner should submit themselves to the Confessional of the Motor Trade? As though the latter was some benign, kindly, socially, responsible, expert (?) organisation, which exists for the comfort of motorists? You have to be JOKING!
My point: It`s likely to be much less disastrous than we are led to believe.
Your point: do not take risks. (BEFORE - agreed)
But AFTER- What Risks? If you are in a hole anyway, why not take the risk? What have you to lose?
Sum Up. This car runs perfectly - if anything, better - perhaps piezo-electronic injectors like a bit of petrol to clear out the gunge. Also, if petrol is incapable of lubricating close tolerance metal parts, how come all those hi-tech EFI petrol system pumps avoid damage?
I had a Triumph 2.5 PI years ago with a high pressure mechanical injection system - all the pumps, injectors etc, were lubricated by petrol, and lasted well. Even if the system was dodgy - that was down to bad technicians.
So, is all this not just scare-mongering, by a Motor Trade who are usually distrusted anyway? After all, they are onto a good earner here - are they not? And the average dealer is pretty ignorant - is he not?
And "Seals" - who says so? Are you in the Motor Trade?
I just do not like to hear of people being ripped off by traders, whose technical personnel are often anti customer, whether they are BMW dealers or others.
AS
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How do you know? Have you had a problem after weeks/months?
I must have seen several hundred misfuelled cars - and the damage typically appears about 3-5000 miles later; often poor starting.
My message was (and is) give it a try!
And if, in the process you contaminate the whole system with metal frag from the HP pump?
But what do ordinary folk do if they HAVE started the wretched thing|?
Contact their insurer. They won't be keen to pay months down the line.
Also if petrol is incapable of lubricating close tolerance metal parts how come all >> those hi-tech EFI petrol system pumps avoid damage?
That would be why they're bronze.
I had a Triumph 2.5 PI years ago with a high pressure mechanical injection system - all the pumps injectors etc were lubricated by petrol and lasted well. Even if the system was dodgy - that was down to bad technicians.
You are joking - aren't you? I remember attending all the breakdowns in hot weather on 2.5PIs and TR6s; wrapping the pump in a cloth and telling the owner to stop and water it every ten miles. I'm not sure if I can still recall how to set-up a Lucas Shuttle Metering Unit - but I could do it back then.
And "Seals" - who says so? Are you in the Motor Trade?
That would be a yes.
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Cabusa
Please don't shout: it doesn't further the discussion. Neither does confusing opinions with facts.
I like this forum because of the respect shown, and that it is more than just an airing of opinions.
Peanut
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good reason for not buying a used modern diesel car ! I mentioned buying a used 5 series diesel to a BMW mechanic about a year ago and his comment was - "don't, - get a petrol engined one, we have an X5d in the workshop at the moment which someone put petrol in by mistake, the bill so far is just over £3000, and will definitely be over £4000 by the time it goes back and its only one of loads" As to "what happens next", i would think that approx £50 for AA membership and their rescue system would be money well spent ( no, i have no connection except for being a regular member ) then advertise it for sale and hope that potential buyers don't read this forum ! and if you need to buy a used diesel, suss out the seller carefully, with your Sherlock Holmes hat on.
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Diesel into petrol has been mentioned and from my experience a very small percentage of Derv won't do any harm.
It might cause poor starting, a smoky exhaust and even a bit of pinking, but no long term damage.
On the other hand, some time ago I came across 10 gallons of lightly contaminated petrol - and (waste not want not) decided to add a couple of gallons or so whenever I filled up with fresh petrol.
All went well until I checked the oil level after a couple of re-fuellings - way above max. Thinking that I might have overfilled at the last oil top up, drained oil out until at midway point. The next level check - well above max again !
It dawned on me that the diesel wasn't being burnt during combustion, and draining past the rings and into the sump.
The engine didn't seem to be bothered though. (Renault 1.4, pushrod, manual choke).
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I saw an interesting little gizmo in my local station yesterday that clips onto the inside of your filler cap and gives a spoken "Diesel only" warning when you open it: good idea. If you get a Diesel car for the first time it is well worth sticking a note to yourself on the dash for the first few weeks. Sounds silly but I know a lot of supposedly bright people who have misfueled.
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none
That's really interesting; Mazda have a problem on their DPF-equipped cars of the oil rising - looks as though that's the mechanism during re-gens.
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Yesterday my dad put £13 worth of diesel in his petrol Yaris at Morrisons. The AA sent one of their fuel responce units of which they have 20 nationwide, and very professional was the service. They have all the kit on a designated van.
They put warning signs up round the car, put earthing cables to battery neg and also to a stake in the ground. They disconnect the fuel line to engine and suck it out, they take the cover off tank and suck out dreggs. Takes about 30 minutes. Cost was £186 but that includes 10L of new fuel. It is all done there and then so no towing away to a garage.
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I have always thought that it wasn't possible to get a diesel pump nozzle into the filler neck of a unleaded car as it is too big.
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<< Mazda have a problem on their DPF-equipped cars of the oil rising - looks as though that's the mechanism during re-gens.
thats not a 'problem' its a known 'feature'....
if you look at the dipstick, there is a hatched area above the max line, if the oil level goes above this, you need to do an oil change.
its due to the vehicle starting the re-gen, but not being able to finish... these DPF-equipped cars dont like short trips as they are unable to re-gen, so the cars used on school runs, are going to be a lot of trouble......
the way Mazda's re-gen BTW is they overfuel causing the DPF to burn off the particles, if the cycle is interupted, the the unburnt excess fuel drains off down the bores into the sump.
I cant help thinking, this will cause long term engine damage, ie bore wear, and could this be part of the reason the crank bearings are wearing?
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Tony
Yes; we've come across this "feature" on here before. £80 oil changes every 4,000 miles IIRC.
There's no reason why an aborted re-gen should make any difference; the over-fuelling [it's actually post-injection] would cease the moment the engine stopped.
As no other DPF/FAP equipped car seems to do this; it's time Mazda got their engineering sorted out, as it's clear that it's the post-injection pulses that are leaking past the rings - not "the DPF re-cycling the accumulated soot into the oil" as Mazda once tried to fob it off.
The epidemic of big-end failures are beginning to look like clogged oil pick-up issues caused by combustion gas leakage past the injector base-seals. So far; every case of that I've encountered has been on a non-DPF engine.
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