This is my first post here.
I have a 98 VW Golf estate and I think the wheel baring has gone because I get a humming noise from the back wheels when i'm driving and last time this happened it was the wheel baring.
Unfortunatly I can't afford to have it replaced for another 3 weeks and in that time i'll need to drive 1500 miles (roughly 100 miles a day) to and from work. I'd like to know if its safe to do that because I don't want to wheel to fall off while i'm doing 70mph on the motorway.
Any idvice you can give me would be great.
Edited by Pugugly on 17/09/2009 at 23:11
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Some go on for ages, others suddenly get loud and then lock up and start to spin in the hub instead - which means they get hot, boil all the grease and make terrible grating noises, destroying hub as well.
Basically it is a gamble. However if the noise suddenly increases in intensity, best to stop rather than risk hub damage (if not damaged already!). Make sure you have breakdown cover.
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Change it yourself it is a few pounds for the bearing form a motor factors and an hours work for you.. If you damage the hub leaving it you will have to dig deep to replace that. Regards Peter
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Buy the Haynes manual and see if it's a DIY job? Ask on the H2O section of www.volkszone.co.uk, perhaps?
I wouldn't drive it 1,500 miles.
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Absolutely NO .
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I have often had cars with a noisy wheel bearing. Like most people I get more and more irritated as the noise gets louder and eventually do something about it, or not as the case may be.
I have never ever had a bearing boil its grease, break up, explode or anything of the sort. One would expect plenty of warning in the case of something like that. A Golf rear wheel bearing making a humming noise will almost certainly go on more or less for ever. Jack the wheel up and give it a jiggle - remember to release the handbrake of course - just to make sure it's only noise.
Edited by Lud on 25/04/2008 at 15:39
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As with Lud, I've driven thousands of miles with a noisy wheel bearing before replacing it and it never exploded and took the car and half the motorway with it.
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That said though, there was a thread here or in technical the other day from someone whose front wheel had come off on the motorway following the disintegration of the bearing.
However it is very hard to believe that this could have happened to me. I suspect the thread author in that case of having ignored terrible noise and perhaps other symptoms, hoping they would go away. Of course anything is possible in this world and I may be doing him an injustice.
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Loose wheel bolts, sorry. Destroyed the whole front end on that side though.
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The OP was asking what his chances are of total failure in the next 1500 miles, and they are small. The problem is that the cost of recovering from a failed wheel bearing could be higher than the value of the 10 year old car, and carries with the possibility of other costs as well.
Even if there's a 1% chance, the difference between £40 (cost of bearing and a Haynes manual) and the £1,000 cost of replacing the car is enough to make the £40 seem attractive, particularly as he can schedule the time he needs, perhaps even over this w/e. The money will have to be spent in three weeks time, so the opportunity cost of the £40 is very low indeed.
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Even if the chance is less than 1%, your reasoning is incontrovertible onb.
Does a 98 Golf have discs at the back? I ask because I seem to remember doing the bearings at the back of an old Golf with drums. The drum was in one casting with the hub. You could drift the old bearing out quite easily, but putting the new one in with a small drift, going round and round tapping it in bit by bit, was quite difficult to get started, but went well with a bit of patience. An excellent man in a Sussex garage showed me how.
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my two wheel bearing stories:
1) a MK1 Granada, no wheel bearing noise at all but on leaving a motorway onto a downwards sloping slip road, braked and there was a dreadful noise as both front bearings collapsed together.
2) a garage overtightened my Pug 505's wheel bearings, the car got about 40 odd miles on the motorway before one seized. It had got so hot all the components around the stub axle were welded together.
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AAAGH normd2.
I seem to remember when fitting some bearings you have to torque the hub nut up quite tight and then slacken it off, perhaps once or twice, before setting it and locking it in the keyway. Obviously the garage forgot to slacken that bearing off. Trust they made good.
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Lud - they did better than that; the Pug had taper bearings that had to be torqued to quite a low value as I recall, the 'mechanic' used an air driver to fit them! He'd only worked on cars with caged bearings before...
Yes they made good - two new front struts, bearings, brakes including calipers etc and an independant engineer's report on the work done - a free hire car for the week and a bunch of flowers for the missus.
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Check any bearing noise out immediately on this car model! There was no terrible noise before one of the rear wheels of my '98 Golf came completely off while going about 112kph last year!
There was a gradually growing wheel hum that I had noticed before the incident, but I assumed it was an alignment or balancing problem that I would fix ASAP upon moving that month... nope, the wheel sheered completely off from the axle without warning. Thankfully no one was hurt.
The VW shop I was towed to (this is in the US mind you) said that this is a problem with this model that they know about and are told by VW to look for!!!!! I was outraged that no one had mentioned this before, having been a proud VW owner all my life with relatively few auto troubles. Apparently there is a tendency for bearing lubricant to be lost and the "unique" bearing cuff to seize with the bearings and eventually the wheel works its way off the axle. (I'm not a mechanic so this is my understanding of what happened to my car.)
The only good thing... my sturdy 10 year old golf handled surprisingly well with only three wheels while we pulled over to the side of the road.
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I have often had cars with a noisy wheel bearing.
That's interesting. Are some cars more prone to wheel bearing failure than others, or have you just been unlucky? Why should you have had a lot of failures and I've never had a single one?
Edited by L'escargot on 18/09/2009 at 10:10
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I too have driven a fair distance before replacing the wheel bearing on my laguna. It just came to the point where the drone was getting beyond irritating!
One thing to note is that the noise you detect may not tell you which wheel bearing has actually gone! See if you can get a friendly garage to hoist the car up with the handbrake off and spin each wheel, this should tell you for certain which wheel it is.
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I think I may have asked this before:
I've bought replacement bearings from a bearing supplier which are through hardened, and been told 'if they're for a car they're usually case hardened'.
Is this true? Can anyone tell me why? NC?
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Here are the instructions from a chum:
"easy one to do, kit is less than a tenner from GSF [GSF Car Parts] IIRC, pry off hub nut cover, remove split pin, locking tab thing, then hub nut, (24mm) then pull drum, if it's got discs you'll need to pull caliper and carrier off as well first, (10mm hex socket bit/allen key socket) then knock out bearing races with an old chisel or similar, tap in new ones with a socket, refit."
Give it a try, you never know, you might enjoy it.
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Use a credit card to pay the garage and then pay in three weeks.
Wheel bearing failure can be dangerous and more costly if not repaired
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Wheel bearings have just gone on my 1.3 polo, head a humming/squeeling sound thought nothing of it and off i go on a 102 mile trip on the motorway from manchester to barrow in furness.
Get to barrow and now have a bad grinding noise. took it to kiwk fit this morning and it now needs new bearings, stub axle, shoes, nuts and washer £280 including labour !
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I know this is an old thread, but it shows up on search for wheel bearing replacement so I think this info is still valid:
www.mailonsunday.co.uk/news/article-1092207/Woman-...l
Shows the worst of what can happen if you get this kind of thing wrong. Whilst I hate scare mongering, it's worth taking into account.
Personally I've just done this job and it isn't as easy as it sounds unless you have a good set of tools. Getting the old bearing shells out and the new ones in is a real PITA. Getting the right amount of tension in the bearing seems a bit of a black art, I did find a really good link to an article on how to do it properly, but can't seem to find it now. I originally overtightened the old bearing when I thought it was just loose. Ended up warping the entire drum due to the amount of heat that was generated in just two 20 mile runs.
The other risk you run if you decide to leave it is that it may well destroy the brakes or cause them to over heat. My old worn bearing resulted in enough play to have the shoes run on the drum constantly. Fortunately I replaced it before there was any real problem, but again, something else to consider. For a cheap garage job, I think I'd pay the money next time.
At the very least, get some decent tools and a Haynes Manual...oh and do it somewhere warm, only just got feeling back in my extremeties!
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Changing it now may save a deal of money. I have done loads of VW rear wheel bearings and they are easy with the right tools. In some of those cases, however, the car has been used at speed or for longer than it should and the inner race has welded itself to the stub axle. I have had to release quite a few with gas welding gear. Ted
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Whatever happened to the good old-fashioned check bearings, pack with grease and adjust servicing regime? Servicing nowadays seems to be limited to oil & filter change, visual inspection and fluid level check/top up and nothing else
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>>check bearings, pack with grease and adjust
It's difficult to think of a method more likely to ruin a bearing - the probability of contamination in a typical workshop is nearly one! It's much better to leave well alone.
Most bearing types don't need any attention at all.
Taking items off the routine maintenance list is one of the ways that cars have become more reliable over the years - I know that for some people this simple news will never sink in though! If an item needs attention, there's always a finite chance that the work itself will cause an early failure - in some garages, that finite chance becomes a much likelier prospect!
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With all due respect NC, the point I was trying to make was that maintenance-free, sealed for life wheel bearings seem to have quite a short life. A Citroen I once owned had quite a healthy appetite for front wheel bearings, wheareas two of the cars I currently own require wheel bearing and steering greasing as part of routine servicing schedule. Both cars over fifteen years old and on original bearings
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>>With all due respect
Oh dear! It's always a worry when people write that...
>>sealed for life wheel bearings seem to have quite a short life
I don't think the numbers of failures bear that out. In my experience, I have seen that sealed for life bearings are much less likely to require replacement. In rough terms, I've probably changed about 3 times more of the re-greasable bearings when compared to the number of sealed for life bearings.
I think your Citroen probably had another fault which caused the bearing problem, or, you bought from a duff batch.
It's a similar story with ball joints - removing the grease nipple actually made them last longer, by reducing the contamination caused during servicing. Replacing the points with electronics, adjustable valve clearances with hydraulic tappets, carbs with injection, open breathers with PCV systems are doubtlessly all changes bemoaned by some who can't be parted from their rose tinted lenses, but, I wouldn't be keen to go back.
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If you've recently changed the same bearing its likelly it was over tightened damaging the new one in the process.
If there is little play when holding and gently rocking the wheel at 3 and 9 o'clock , but significant play when the wheel is rocked between 12 and 6 o'clock the stub axle is worn oval and you'll have great difficulty setting up the new bearing.
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No, if you have had to replace the same bearings regularly its likely that its because they are non adjustable and not "man" enough for the job theyhave been specified for.
Such as, Focus rears, Citroen/Peugeot various front. etc etc.
Its not always the workshop fault, its often a poorly specified bearing!
Remember the Ford/vauxhall rear taper bearings, easily adjustable, not replaced anywhere near as often as the newer focus ones!
Its progress!
Edited by yorkiebar on 31/12/2008 at 21:35
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Golf 3 estate rears are tapers, I speak from experience, my stubs are oval. Trying to adjust them to be within MOT spec reduces there life because they bind at 3 and 9, even adjusted up I got an advisory. The car is history now and being broken for spares
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Yep Mk3 Golf is a taper bearing and kit per side is less than £10 from GSF. Can be banged in with a suitable size drift (I use a large socket) and a club hammer. Reasonable mechanic should have it done in 30 minutes.
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1994 150,000 mile Astra Estate- never any wheel bearing or steering problems. Was I just lucky?
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My Renault 21 was bought with a fresh MOT and a wheel bearing that clunked sometimes. It went through two more MOTs clunking gently.
(The car itself failed the last MOT on a list of minor faults as long as your arm... I gave it away.)
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Realise this thread is a bit old b ut my Mk3 Golf with 92k on the clock recently started exhibiting rear wheel bearing howling noises which got steadily worse. After a couple of hundred miles of noise i took the wheel off and noted the hub felt a bit lumpy when rotated. About 4 months previous,i had had new brake shoes via a local garage. I suspect they overtightened the hub not and put extra pressure on the roller cage bearings. Anyway a bearing kit was obtained for about £11. I cleaned up the hub,felt and visually checked the shells and just changed the roller bearings and packed with new grease being careful to tighten the nut just slightly so as not to load the bearing excessively. Also renewed oil seals.All is now fine !
Hopefully i wont have to eat my words but didnt fancy spending ages knocking out old shells and fitting new ones.
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Oh dear!
I think you may be castigated for admitting your heinous crime. ;>)
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My partner's Mk III just started exhibiting noise from the
rear, so I checked the bearings. There is some sort of
collar in the drum, which is exteremely loose, plus the
brakes need replacing anyway. So thought I'd change
the whole lot at once.
Tried to follow Haynes instructions, and failed to get the
oil seal out. Is there some secret technique for this, or
a special tool / puller? levering it out with screwdrivers
requires a) screwdrivers that don't bend, and/or b) arms
twice the size of mine ;-)
What are the "shells" that are referred to in this thread,
and why would you replace them? I can see that replacing
the bearings should be a simple job (once I get the seal
out), but the thread seems to suggest replacing the shells
is more difficult?
Any hints on DIY for this job?
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I did the same thing on my old Sierra. The outer races looked a swine to remove (Very tight fit in the hub carrier - ideally need a press to remove/install) so I cleaned them up, packed with grease and installed the needle rollers from the new kit into the outer races that were already on the car. Adjusted the bearings correctly, and the drone was silenced then, and for the next 50,000 miles I covered in the car. Not a jot of play either.
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Any hints on DIY for this job?
There is stuff on youtube that is worth looking at. Scotty Kilmer does some fairly good videos.
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I've had several rear wheel bearings go on my 1994 Passat B4 estate. The rear hubs are the same as on the Mk 3 Golf, I believe - which is why they are prone to wearing out on the Passat.
In my experience the bearings drone on for ages, gradually getting louder until you feel perhaps it's time to replace them. I've replaced the bearings myself. If you have a Haynes manual they are quite simple to replace as long as you follow the procedures carefully. The critical thing is ensuring the new bearing outer rings are seated fully in the rear brake drum, which forms part of the hub.
Re the collar bit on the hub that moves. If it's like a washer UNDER the hub nut, the nut is supposed to be tightened so that the washer can still be moved. The shaped cap over the nut and the circlip ensure that the nut can't come undone.
Edited by Sofa Spud on 26/10/2009 at 15:46
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You can use the old shells you removed to help drive in the new ones evenly. This is the trickiest part of the operation, since, like I said above, they need to be seated fully fair and square in the seating.
On my Passat's drums there are small nicks in the seatings provided in the hub that allow you to drift out the old bearing shells from behind
Edited by Sofa Spud on 26/10/2009 at 15:53
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The rear seal just levers out, a new one will be in the kit.
Clean out all the grease from inside the bearings and you'll see 3 equally spaced grooves allowing you to tap out the outer bearing rings with a blunt punch / drift around 6mm or so.
Lightly tap and move around to the next groove in turn gently easing the outer ring out of the bore.
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Lightly tap and move around to the next groove in turn gently easing the outer ring out of the bore.
Yes. And you can tap the new one in, going round and round it, in the same way if you don't have a press. The difficult bit is to get the new ring to engage in the bore. You need to protect the bearing surface while you do that using a wood block or suitable metal drift (the old ring is a bit on the small side). And while you are tapping it in you have to take care not to scratch the bearing surface. But it isn't too difficult and doesn't take for ever.
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