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LOL , I`m waiting for the Gold Star for diligence in sourcing news ;)
Edited by oilrag on 29/02/2008 at 11:27
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By now I am sure you are aware that we have identified a potential issue in a small batch of cylinder head gaskets affecting the 1.3 multijet engine.
We communicated via After Sales a suspension of depot deliveries and asked you to suspend deliveries to your end customers whilst we evaluated the potential impact.
Whilst we have only experienced one failure in UK, we have taken the decision to intervene in 100% of cases in the identified chassis range. This demonstrates our commitment to delivering quality products and in particular ensuring that all Fiat 500 customers have an outstandingly positive experience with their new product.
While we apologise for the difficulties that may arise from this decision, we believe that 100% assurance during the launch of Fiat 500 is critical.
Today your After Sales department would have received detailed repair process instructions and the first parts arrive direct to dealers from Monday 3rd March onwards. However full details of the parts supply process will follow from our Parts division directly.
We have re-commenced depot deliveries and you now have the details to carry out the intervention, so you should be in a position to re-commence deliveries early next week..."
Thoughts?
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Hardly a catastrophe it happens with lots of products including vectra handbrakes renault bonnet catches the list is endless.Wouldn't put me of buying one if i were after such a car.
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Yes I think 1 problem isnt too much to worry about. I think it shows Fiat in a good light, there was a chance of a problem, they stopped production for 5 days until it was sorted, and then recommenced.
Wasnt it the mini shortly after launch that needed a massive recall due to exploding petrol tanks??
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The old 1.1 FIRE in Puntos etc used to lunch head gaskets too, it was pressurising the cooling system on ours for a couple of years. Never let us down though!
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That sounds quite a serious matter isn't it?
Also quite odd for a car which won "Car of the year award".
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One faulty car serious and maybe 87 more out of what fiat produce for themselves and other makers its not even a drop in the ocean.
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Quote, Fiat Forum
"A batch of Fiat Punto, Grande Punto, Idea, 500, Panda, Linea, Doblo and Fiorino vehicles, whose chassis numbers fall into the intervals described in the table below, are affected by a fault. Due to the non-compliance of the cylinder head gasket on engines with serial numbers between 2451169 and 2582915, in some cases there may be a leakage of engine coolant from the coolant expansion reservoir."
End quote
That looks like more than a few engines,spread across the models perhaps. But would you really not be bothered if your new 500 had just had its head off at the dealers before you bought it new?
Regards
Edited by oilrag on 29/02/2008 at 11:51
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Its a very widely used engine, in the models you listed, also the Corsa and Tigra (not sure about the Astra), and there was a faulty batch of parts delievered to the factory. Big deal, it was identified and rectified, any cars they think even might have a chance of being affected have been stopped from being delivered (80 something in the UK?). I really cant see it as a big issue unless for some reason there is some sort of vendetta going on?
Also I have been made aware the fault isnt with the headgasket anyway, it is a bracket that caused the head gasket fault, so the repair or check may not even need the head stripping.
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"unless for some reason there is some sort of vendetta going on?"
Can`t see how that would be the case as the source is full of Fiat enthusiasts, I too own a Multijet and have only bought Fiats for a few years...
I sometimes wonder whether (for example) salesmen from another marque would post negatively as a `spoiler` but you would expect if that ever were the case, for it to be a new member of a forum.
Even then, I don`t know if its ever happened.
regards
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Assuming the issue is fully sorted before sale, would it still concern you that the car had this problem before you bought it?
Surely if it's been correctly fixed, it's irrelevant?
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"Surely if it's been correctly fixed, it's irrelevant?"
Well, if it does involve headgaskets, I thought most people would choose to have one assembled on the production line rather than one that a Fiat dealer has taken apart. as one of their techs on the site refers to it (headgasket)being a 7 hour job.
Again if it is a headgasket. and if it is true information........
I thought I was being helpful in flagging the issue up, in particular as there is a list of allegedly affected engine numbers.
I feel as though I`m taking some flack (generally speaking) for mentioning it, but its being openly discussed on an enthusiasts forum so i thought it worth mentioning here, at least to give people information. As I said in my original post, "allegedly" and in my writing no further than what`s in the source. (sigh)
I`m not commenting further ;)
Regards
Edited by oilrag on 29/02/2008 at 13:20
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Sorry Oilrag, didnt mean it to sound like that, but with this being the third highlighting of a potential issue with the 500 I genuinely wondered why. My sis got one 2 weeks ago, it isnt on the list and she absolutely loves it! :)
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It's hard to imagine what the fault could be, when it shows itself so quickly?
I've seen the "bracket" suggestions too, and wonder what on earth could a bracket have to do with a head-gasket?
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Its a Fiat,what can you really expect.I have just rented a Grande Punto 1.3 Multi Jet in Spain for a week with a mixture of driving,motorway,mountains,towns,the lot really.Avis car,12000 miles(i re configured the computer) and returned 52.3 MPG over 930 miles.Not too bad,but the car itself was really starting to fall apart,trim rattles,doors only unlocking when they felt like it,very creaky/knocking suspension.Very cheap quality carpets and seat covers that were also wearing badly.Not a car that i would want to own and only reinforced my views of Fiats from 20 years ago,the were were junk then,they have not improved.The motoring world has moved on Fiat have not.
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No judgement intended from me - it was an honest question. My mechanical knowledge does not stretch to encompass whether a repaired head gasket is in some way inferior to the original fitment.
So, is it?
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>>So, is it?
If done properly, not at all.
Probably, like many modern engines new head bolts should be used, and the bolt installation procedure should be followed carefully.
As long as the surfaces are well cleaned, and not damaged or scratched during the cleaning, they should seal well again.
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Thank you NC.
I have been hesitating to say, a new heaqd gasket put into a virtually new engine by company fitters wouldnt bother me in the least. After all the thing has been assembled partly by hand in the first place and will be sold with full warranty.
I feel some people may have a superstitious horror of anything to do with head gaskets. Actually the bad stuff is the knock-on effects of head gasket failure if gradual or persistent or not noticed when severe or, as in my case once, dealt with piecemeal once too often in a car with wet liners and a warped cylinder head put in by me in a wet freezing muddy barn long after I was old enough to know better...
A head gasket is just a slightly squashy shim designed to make a proper high-pressure seal. Petrol engines have had them for ages. They work well.
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>>slightly squashy shim
An interesting outcome of a proper analysis of the loads within a bolted joint is that the less "squashy", the better. Compare the modern head gaskets with the old fashioned copper/asbestos/copper^^ gaskets, and you'll see that modern ones are much stiffer.
^^ although knowing this place, there will be some who mourn the passing of defunct and under-performing technology
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Much stiffer perhaps, but slightly squashy on some level or they wouldn't work. I changed a head gasket on my Plymouth in America. The gaskets were made of pressed steel, very thin, but with pressings to provide the squash. Very pleasing aesthetically and philosophically.
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>>slightly squashy on some level or they wouldn't work
Yes, compliant enough to conform, but no more is the ideal. Also, the co-efficient of thermal expansion of the gasket should be compatible with the materials being joined. Iron blocks and alloy heads create a problem, because there's always significant thermal strains to contend with, and these tend to pull the gasket around every time the engine undergoes a warm up / col down cycle.
The more the gasket moves, creeps or deforms after the initial tighten down, the more bolt pre-load is lost, and the more likely the gasket is to fail - either by direct leakage owing to insufficient clamping pressure, or more indeirectly by gasket fretting and fatigue as the gasket moves back and forth.
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Just seen my first one on the road.Now i am not one that judges cars to be for ladies/hairdressers or any other ism/minority but the Fiat 500 imho makes the Ford KA or VW Beetle look macho.
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Sorry I can't resist it,
"Fiat enthusiasts forum" Is this an oxymoron?
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Interesting - then why have a head gasket? - my Ally head / Iron barrel 56 Matchless G3LC doesn't need one - and modern cars must be so much more advanced...........
Edited by Pugugly on 01/03/2008 at 21:47
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Oil feed via to rockers via external copper pipes and no coolant? and just a circular contact area?
Regards
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