Hello
I do not normally support these petitions and protests but it has become far too much.
Please sign the petition for lowering the fuel duty
petitions.pm.gov.uk/reducefuelduty/
The more signatures the more it will make an impact
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(iam not a mechanic)
Martin Winters
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I`m all for the tax on fuel to be increased.
As someone pointed out in another post recently, fuel tax at least makes those who duck out of taxation at least pay some tax.
( i think that was one of the best points ever, but can`t remember the member to give credit)
Edited by oilrag on 11/12/2007 at 11:07
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Signed!
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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>the more signatures the more it will make an impact
wont make any impact at all.
Riots ala Francais style, now that has impact.
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< Ulla>
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Unless you're petitioning for lower overall taxation, any decrease in fuel duty simply has to be recouped elsewhere. What would be acceptable? Increased income tax, increased VAT on low rate good/services...? Someone, somewhere will pay more - at least fuel duty is a tax on consumption, so, to some extent, is mitigatable.
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No, the government has been raking it in on the VAT side since the oil price went up. Remember VAT is charged on the total - higher pump prices = more VAT revenue. That's completely independent of their inexcusable 2p hike in duty in October.
There are stupid petitions on that site asking for 20p reductions and the like which is of course ridiculous, but the government could make a gesture here and show it has at least some concept of life in the real world.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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Well tax is tax - if the increased VAT revenues, coupled with the fuel escalator(?) hike alleviate pressure on other tax channels (and fuel tax is a 'green' tax) so much the better.
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While I'd rather not pay any tax, at least this one is unavoidable, even by the lowlife. My biggest gripe is not tax per se but the inordinately inefficient way it is spent. I'd sign a petition for that. I wish they'd remove the road fund licence and put it all on fuel. The RFL is merely a tax on possession rather than on use thus neither 'green' nor congestion reducing.
If this tax is cut, which area of spending would you prefer to see cut or which other tax increased to compensate?
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If other tax had to be increased to compensate, then one on food miles would be good. Fewer carrots from Thailand (or much higher priced ones) or whatever has to be a better thing, and mean there are more ships, planes and fuel left for things that really do have to be shipped worldwide.
Edited by Dipstick on 11/12/2007 at 11:50
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I am not going to sign. I hate paying such high fuel duty but I hate paying income tax even more. Govs have to get their money from somewhere so rather than bleating on about high fuel duty, why not vote in a party that has lower overall tax rates. fuel duty might not come down but other taxes probably would.
I suppose that it is easily summed up by personal circumstances. If you earn £250k pa and drive 15k miles the current situation is just fine. if you earn £15k and drive 50k miles then I suspect that you wouldn't be so happy.
the one bit of the petition that I do think should be scrapped is the tax disc. far too old fashioned/complicated and really how much difference to revenue occurs with the different bandings? I suspect that by the time higher admin costs are taken into account it is probably revenue neutral.
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rather than bleating on about high fuel duty why not vote in a party that has lower overall tax rates.
If Brown hadn't chickened out of calling an election, that's exactly what the country would have done.
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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If Brown hadn't chickened out of calling an election that's exactly what the country would have done.
The party in power gets voted in for a fixed period of time, and thats what we have. No good moaning they didnt go to the country early.
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< Ulla>
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I quite agree, but it makes me feel better :-)
Cheers
DP
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04 Grand Scenic 1.9 dCi Dynamique
00 Mondeo 1.8TD LX
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I won't be signing.
While the SUV remains a fashionable acceptable vehicle motorists collectively cannot argue that fuel is too expensive.
We will be able to argue this when (some examples):
Land Rover are laying off staff due to short time working;
BMW say they will not adapt the new X5 for RHD as the UK sales won't justify it;
You can drive up the M6 from Birmingham to Lancaster on a Friday evening without dropping below 50mph.
Until then it is too cheap as there are too many large, uneconomical vehicles on the road and too many of us travelling too far for "pleasure".
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I think the blame is not being directed correctly.
Anyone considered what part commodity dealing and futures speculation has done to the price of oil?
Anyone considered how George W's failed push to grab Iraqs oil reserves has unsettled the middle east and pushed up the price of oil?
How about the USA's blind support for Israel to appease the jewish lobby in the US? that caused OPEC to go militant in the first place.
How about the major car makers refusal to develop alternate fuels for nigh on 30 years?
What about the closing of the pits and the move of UK power generation to oil and gas?
What about Chinas insatiable thirst for energy and raw materials pushing up the price of everything? (caused by secret and not so secret US trade embargoes for 50 years)
UK tax? a mere pinprick in our fuel conundrum.
And mark my words, its going to get very bad indeed. The rush for biofuels is going to push the price of raw staple foods through the roof as farmers shift crops to high profit biofuel crops. People are going to starve so you and I can run around in our cars.
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< Ulla>
Edited by Altea Ego on 11/12/2007 at 12:29
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I wont sign
Mostly because I agree with the points above - it's preferable to income tax.
I also think it's a waste of time - I don't think this government would take any notice of a petition even if all voters sign. Even if we voted for 'my little david', I doubt that we'd see much difference.
I also disagree with the 'put VED onto road duty' argument.
The government has done this many times over !
The current VED system is nothing more than a registration process - to provide some level of checking of paperwork. It's cheap for 'green' cars.
There is some argument for lowering the tax on diesel - at the expense of petrol; but as a petrol user, you won't hear it from me :-)
I like AE's points above.
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Good stuff AE. I wouldn't dare :o}
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If Brown hadn't chickened out of calling an election
We had better get used to oil costing a lot more. In real terms, the pump petrol price is actually lower than it was 20 or 30 years ago. I expect economists on this forum may be able to point to a graph showing that petrol is still cheaper in real terms than may be even 5 years ago?
I too would prefer NOT to have Old-nu-Labour running the country. But that is a different topic altogether not suited to this motoring forum.
The fact is that all of the current 3 major parties are all in favour of reducing Co2 emissions from motoring, and in favour of using the pricing mechanism for gettting the public weaned off using cars, and using the tax raised as a nice earner for their spending policies. Oil and other resources, including food are now being consumed at an alarming rate by the new middle classes in India and China. 2008 is going to be a tough year for inflation.
I am also in favour of any tax system which raises funds direct from the consumer. Examples are the bureaucracy of Road Tax, Congestion Charging, TV Licences. The unfair advantage of crossing borders in to the UK with cheaper diesel should be tackled by an "entry tax" at the ports, similar to airport departure tax levied by some countries.
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As someone pointed out in another post recently fuel tax at least makes those who duck out of taxation at least pay some tax. ( i think that was one of the best points ever but can`t remember the member to give credit)
I think it's one of the most foolish points ever. What about the majority who do not duck out of paying tax? They have to pay even more. That's really fair...
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I think it's one of the most foolish points ever. What about the majority who do not duck out of paying tax? They have to pay even more. That's really fair...
I can't see the logic of that at all. Those who pay tax will pay anyway, those who try to avoid it can't avoid fuel duty, unless they steal it.
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Tax on fuel is probably the fairest tax about. Those who are rich and profligate with choice of vehicle and lifestyle pay more, the others pay less in various sliding scales of profligacy.
It needs tweaking a bit. Much lower taxes for registered UK hauliers, thereby keeping our daily bread and our 110 inch HDMI flat screen TV's cheaper. No tax for farmers producing foodstocks. (yes yes I know about "red" diesel but thats just VAT"
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< Ulla>
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It's pointles really, even a 10p/litre cut is only going to save an average driver a couple of hundred quid a year tops. There are much more significant savings to be made by not giving away your hard earned to the banks in the form of SVR mortgages and eye watering borrowing on store cards.
Still, charging VAT on the tax element is a bit much.....
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RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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From forecourttrader.co.uk
In 1916 petrol was £1.85 per litre (8.40 a gallon) in todays money
In 1957 £1.16 per litre in todays money
In 1973 and 1979 £1.02 per litre in todays money
The roads seem quieter than usual round my way.
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So prices haven't changed much then? Except average earnings are now much higher so the time someone on average pay needs to work to buy one litre of fuel has decreased dramatically.
You've never had it so good! ;-)
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A worker in 1957 had roughly double the purchasing power of his counterpart in 1916, in the 1970s just over three times, and in 2006 just over five times.
measuringworth.com/datasets/ukearncpi/result.php
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Hang on. The facts don't fit in with received wisdom that we're hard done by. That'll never do!
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