Drove from Cheshire - Surrey on Monday and back Tuesday.
Tried an experiment after reading threads and rants about speeding last week.
The M6 was too busy both ways to learn anything.
M40 - set cruise control, initially at 70mph; gradually raised to 77mph and left it there, assuming (outside) possibility of 10% speedo error. Left it thereabouts both ways...
Results - it was like going backwards. We passed a few lorries, and one or 2 cars, but the vast majority of cars were going at 80 - 85mph, judging from passing speeds.
We did NOT see any 'dangerous' driving save a Vectra that wanted to overtake everybody before his exit, and one guy on a mobile.
Isn't a law which is disregarded by the vast majority of people a bad law?
|
Yes.
Laws are obeyed only if they either have the support of a majority or else are enforced by draconial powers.
|
I've noticed this on the M56/M53 every day. At 70, the only things that don't overtake you are lorries and the odd car. Makes you wonder what use the 70 speed limit is when 80% of the population ignore it.
Andy
|
|
You might want to check just how accurate your speedo is,you may well be surprised.
|
|
And a limiter would be similarly inaccurate.
|
|
|
|
Check your speedo by driving at an indicated 60mph (preferably at off peak time please) along a motorway and the roadside telephones should pass at exactly 1 minute intevals, being 1 mile apart. Crude, but then so am I.
|
|
|
|
|
a conveniant revenue from speeding fines paying for even more CCTV and cameras?
|
|
|
|
|
Laws are for the guidance of wise men and the obediance of fools.
|
|
|
|
|
I don't know how accurate a GPS really is but my speedometer over reads by about 3 mph at a true 60 and about 5 at a true 80 - true being the GPS indication.
|
|
GPS is +or - 2% depending on how many satalites you are accessing the more the the better accuracy ,also if you have an outside antenna and if you have a differential unit and antenna you are down to +or- 01%
|
|
|
|
I don't do a lot of distance A road driving in cars. However on Tuesday a I took a 60 mile + drive on a single carriageway A road.
I've long realised that driving a long way on motorway at legal speeds has the effect of shutting down my concentration - fiddling with the radio checking the phone etc.
However sticking to the 30 & 40 limits [1] on my Tuesday drive I noticed the same problem. 30mph is *so* slow that my mind wandered a lot. I ended up changing radio channels and realised too late that I'd passed one white T-junction on the left without noticing it at all. [2]
I don't know where I'm going with this 'cos the rules are clear. 30mph means 30mph. If people get killed then it the rule thats wrong not the adherance to it.
Interesting to note that even in 30 limts there often aren't enough perceived dangers to keep the average driver awake.
[1] I'm not claiming to be holier than though. In a car I will tend to treat 40's as somewhere between 45 and 60 and 30's as somewhere between 15 and 40. On Tuesday I just felt like a bit of blind rule observence.
[2] This doesn't happen on the bike. No radio, no phone and a cast iron incentive to look out. [3] I stick religiously to 30's to try to do some PR work for bikes. - Dunno if it works - if the limit is for any length I will be frustrating the cars I just overtook who then have to be held up by me for ages.
[3] The weakness of my bones compared to the crumple zone of a Volvo.
|
Excellent points Dave, I find the same concentration thing myself.
It's interesting, SWMBO has recently [3 months ago] started driving again after passing her test a few years back and not really bothering to drive afterwards. I've had to point her in the direction of her speedo several times and whilst she says there are no problems 40-70, she finds it difficult sticking to 30 in a 30 zone. This is someone who is putting much concentration into what is going on on the road and in doing so finds how easy it is to creep above 30. I am not for one moment justifying that it should be allowed but what I am saying is that it should be enforced more sensibly - perhaps with SPECS cameras [distance over time] on difficult roads. On difficult bits of road that are perhaps busy or very wide I think a GATSO ticket for 36mph when you were trying to concentrate on the conditions is unfair.
|
|
|
I tend to stick to the limit, or within 5mph of it, in 30/40/50 zones, but on other roads I drive/ride acording to the conditions and perceived dangers. Unless, of course, conditions demand a lower speed. Not sure what that says about me or my driving.
The reason I stick to urban limits is that my road is a 30 mph limit and, with many people treating it like Brands, I can at least show consideration to others in built-up areas.
I generally don't have problems with speed limits or their enforcement, but the 70 mph limit on motorways is too crude a device.
|
Do you not find that driving / riding according to the conditions and perceived dangers usually keeps you within 5mph of the limit in 30/40/50 zones too, unless conditions demand a lower speed? I use the same judgement regardless of the speed limit.
GJD
|
Absolutely.
I do get, however, more attempted intimidation by cowboys when driving SWMBO's car (a Skoda Fabia) than my own (an Audi TT) at 30 mph.
|
|
|
|
|
"a GATSO ticket for 36mph when you were trying to concentrate on the conditions is unfair."
Boy is this true! In built up areas I used to focus on the gap under cars looking for childrens feet about to jump out on me.
Now my main focus is 9 feet in the air looking for the grey boxes and the middle of the carriageway looking for the white lines.
|
Why? I can not understand this "I am a less safe driver looking for speed cameras".
Whats wrong with driving at 30 and not caring if there are cameras?
|
|
trever you are a @!#$ get used to it go away and work for the labour party
|
|
|
|
"Do you not find that driving / riding according to the conditions and perceived dangers usually keeps you within 5mph of the limit in 30/40/50 zones too"
Absolutely not!
The whole Ashdown Forest is 40 limit.
As I understand it this is to protect Deer from harm and drivers form deer.
However there are open bits that can best be described as plains with acres of visiblility, left right in front and back.
If someone told me they we're gonna hit 165 on one of those long straights I'd be hard pushed to justify a lower speed from the conditions alone.
|
Dave
I probably didn't emphasise *usually* enough in my original sentence. There are too many exceptions like the one you describe. My point was that *most* (but by no means all) of the time, my judgement keeps me within a few mph of urban speed limits, if not significantly slower when necessary. Rural roads are often a different matter. And it is more than coincidence that those places where judgement suggests higher speeds than the posted limit tend to be the same places that the cameras live.
GJD
|
|
|
|
Sorry Gavin! Your 'usually' was perfectly clear, for some reason I didn't see it!
Praps I need to slow my reading down not my driving!
Please ignore my incorrect rebuttal!
|
|
|
|
Solution to the concentration problem - remove airbag and replace with spike :-)
|
|
|
