dealer waiting for replacement to come in; it's on "back order" which apparently means there's a queue!
Yes because there is very little slack in the system. Just in Time manufacturing means if they need 5,000 turbos 5,000 will be made - you won't find warehouses full of spare parts. The 2.0TDi is now VAGs most popular engine and the factory is at full tilt coping with current demand.
Like cjehuk I am also an A3 owner of almost 2 years and 30,000 miles and two very minor warranty claims. Yes Audis are more expensive, but so are Saabs compared to Vectras and Jags compared to Mondeos, but you notice the differences.
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VW (and their dealers) are on a different planet. I'm looking for a car for my daughter and considered the Polo 1.2S, but it's just too expensive, at £10,200 new, £9200 from DriveTheDeal.
The dealer rang me up all excited because he can get me a year old car for £8400. He seemed stunned that I didn't snatch his hand off.
Whatever happened to the 30% you're supposed to lose when you drive out of the showroom? 'Ah', he said, 'but it's a VolkWagen'!
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Classic bit of segmentation - see the comments about Persil and Surf here -
www.unilever.co.uk/ourbrands/homecare/
One is 'Britain's most trusted detergent brand' and the other 'leaves a little extra change in your pocket' - in other words, one is for people who want the reassurance that they are buying the best product, with cutting edge cleaning technology, the other is for people who are looking for value and perhaps more secure in there own judgement. Both are from Unilever, aimed to capture different types of customer to maximise the company's market share.
Persil is heavily advertised, with allusions to cutting edge cleaning technology, Surf is advertised much less - occasional reminders that it exists, it works (removes 99 stains) and is good value.
Whilst there are undoubtedly some trivial differences in the product, the biggest difference is in the market positioning, and the biggest cost difference is in the amount of advertising you are 'buying' - I'm still talking about washing powder of course ;-)
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Sorry - 'their' own judgement! Usual comment applies re edit buttons.
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Usual comment applies re edit buttons.
Usual "I'll ignore this" approach taken, re: edit button comments ;o)
DD.
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Classic bit of segmentation - see the comments about Persil and Surf here -
Same with Computers - List Prices for Large SCSI hard drives for a PC were 2/3rds the price of "the same" drives for the UNIX servers - differences? - part number on the box
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>>>>"The dealer rang me up all excited because he can get me a year old car for £8400. He seemed stunned that I didn't snatch his hand off.
Whatever happened to the 30% you're supposed to lose when you drive out of the showroom? 'Ah', he said, 'but it's a VolkWagen'!"
Our local dealer beat DTD on the price of a new Touran!
Servicing is very expensive though, looking at over £250 for 2nd service at two years!
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the way it was explained to me, years ago, was thus.........the item in question then was a Range Rover indicator stalk, which looked suspiciously like a Maestro/Montego item
look at the whole price of a Range Rover and then divide that price by the bits in it, (so presumably if someone tried to be clever and by all the bits individually they'd come unstuck)
do the same with a Montego and hey presto shared parts have differing prices
no idea whether it's true, but i believed it
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> if someone tried to be clever and buy all the bits individually they'd come unstuck...
Didn't the bits tend to come unstuck anyway in those days?
>;---)
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Slightly off topic, but when the side repeater indicator fell out of the TVR Griffith I once had and damaged itself irreparably, I went to the local TVR dealer to order a new one. I can't remember the exact price I was quoted, but it was around 20 quid. I must have looked shocked because the guy at the parts desk eventually confessed that the part was actually from a Fiat Panda. I went to the local Fiat dealer, showed them the damaged side repeater indicator and it turns out it was indeed from a Panda, so I bought a bought a replacement from the Fiat dealer - for 2 quid.
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Slightly off topic, but when the side repeater indicator fell out of the TVR Griffith I once had and damaged itself irreparably, I went to the local TVR dealer to order a new one. I can't remember the exact price I was quoted, but it was around 20 quid. I must have looked shocked because the guy at the parts desk eventually confessed that the part was actually from a Fiat Panda. I went to the local Fiat dealer, showed them the damaged side repeater indicator and it turns out it was indeed from a Panda, so I bought a bought a replacement from the Fiat dealer - for 2 quid.
Good work !
If more people did this and passed on the info it may eventually help the ease the rip-off society we have..
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Like cjehuk I am also an A3 owner of almost 2 years and 30,000 miles and two very minor warranty claims. Yes Audis are more expensive, but so are Saabs compared to Vectras and Jags compared to Mondeos, but you notice the differences.
Its true that Skoda and Audi/VW are essentially mechanically the same, and indeed I think Skoda's are a very good buy. As an Audi owner and the purchaser of a new A4 Avant, I am still willing to pay the Audi premium for the improved interior and the slightly better soundproofing I think you do get with Audi. However in the case of Saab/Vauxhall I think the new Saabs are a rip-off now having owned a 93SS a couple of years ago. The finish of the car is no better than the equivalent Vauxhall which is much cheaper to buy and to service.
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If it's any consolation the sat-nav in Lamborghini Gallardo and A3 are identical, and (over)priced the same
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If you want to buy a car on price, buy the Skoda or Seat sure, they are very competent cars. I can't lay out that much money on something that doesn't make me feel special. I just ordered my second Audi.
Hmm. So you don't buy a car on price? If price is not an issue I can think of cars other than Audi.
I 'feel special' when I get good value for money.
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Hmm. So you don't buy a car on price? If price is not an issue I can think of cars other than Audi. I 'feel special' when I get good value for money.
Sure so can I, but BMW's don't 'feel' as nice in term of the interior in my view, Jaguars are too old for me currently and I have never liked Mercedes. I don't want a 4x4 currently, and nor do I want a Focus/Astra/Golf. I've test driven the Mk5 Golf and it feels the same to drive as my A3 but less special inside. I feel having lost £7500 on the A3 over 3 years that's pretty good. I feel that it was worth having the extra money invested over a Focus 2.0TDI which would have lost £7.5k or more over the same time for the better interior. It's lucky there is choice on the market eh? I'm not too bothered about list price if I can afford it, the true cost, the depreciation is what matters to me and in those stakes a premium brand nearly always beats a run of the mill for whatever reason.
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>> Hmm. So you don't buy a car on price? >> If price is not an issue I can think of
I'm not too bothered about list price if Ican afford it, the true cost, the depreciation is what matters to me and in those stakes a premium brand nearly always beats a run of the mill for whatever reason.
I second this, the low depreciation of my A4 over the last 2 1/2 years has been great compared to any of the mass-market brands, and you feel better every day driving something which doesnt creak and rattle with a few thousand miles on it.
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Overall depreciation depends, ultimately, on how long a car is kept for. If the purchase price of a car is, say, £12000 then that is the most it can depreciate over the life of the car. Another car purchased for £15000 will, some day in the not too distant future, be worth not a great deal. As soon as it's value is under £5000, it will have depreciated more than the £10k car.
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I'm not too bothered about list price if I >> can afford it, the true cost, the depreciation is what matters >> to me and in those stakes a premium brand nearly always >> beats a run of the mill for whatever reason. >> I second this, the low depreciation of my A4 over the last 2 1/2 years has been great compared to any of the mass-market brands, and you feel better every day driving something which doesnt creak and rattle with a few thousand miles on it.
Interesting that you imply that an Audi is not a 'mass market' brand - it most certainly is - Audi are pretty big volume seller.
I have had to repair a few of these cars and I can assure that VAG uses many of the same suppliers (with parts to the same standards) as on, say, GM cars. Moreover I've now removed the dashboards from two examples in an effort to cure creaking. Not to mention replacing parts on that fiendish front suspension where all the fastners sieze up - that's the work of the Devil - badly gashed my hand on the last one.
Don't get me wrong, Audi's are not bad cars, but they are nothing special. If you are won over by the smart trim then fair enough, but the underlying engineering is average and very much 'mass market'.
If you want real quality engineering then buy a Subaru - beautiful engineering.
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I would tend to believe the likes of Aprilla who know what they are talking about. Having lived in Germany I eventually saw all the so called "premium"brands as mass market as there are so many about. The Germans tended to see Mercedes as the one that was a cut above but that was admittedly late 80s/early 90s when they used to build them properly.
I've said before and admit to being duped by badge snobbery and the perception that VWs were superior but all three I had were crap so I would bear testament to the engineering (specifically the electrics) as being very average and certainly not justifying the price premium I paid.
But then again I keep saying this it's all about personal experience and perception. I've had a Vectra (which was sound and reliable) and am now on my second Saab 93 and to me the latter is superior. My father, a non driving ignoramus, considers it superior and he is commenting purely on his perception of quality. Someone will no doubt disagree.
So buy what you like but listen to the experts when it comes to engineering quality and most importantly, don't mistake a flashy well made interior for overall engineering integrity. I speak from experience.
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>>don't mistake a flashy well made interior for overall engineering integrity.
Bravo!, well said! Excellent point well made! The plastic on the dash has absolutely nothing to do with the engineering of the rest of the car.
The sound a door shuts when closing is tuned very carefully, so idiot punters will make the lazy association of "well, the doors seem solid enough, so the engineering of the whole car must be good too". The technical name for this is "sound quality engineering", and as the sound made by a vibrating panel can be changed dramatically by the addition of a bit of sticky foam (in just the right place!) which costs pence, customers can be assisted in their lazy thinking by manufacturers very cheaply.
To the original post - the price of anything is simply what people are prepared to pay for it. VAG obviously think people will pay, and it is their commercial decision to make - it doesn't matter if this price isn't fair, just, or consistent with other pricing on other models - it's their choice. If VAG or any other manufacturer weren't trying their best to cash in on their more badge snobby customers, sorry, discerning customers!,I would be truly amazed
Number_Cruncher
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I have to go down on the side of "moron"Audi customers here, if I had ample money I wouldn't look twice at a Skoda when I could get something just that little bit better.
I don't feel special when I get value for money, I feel special when i get something nice. :-)
Blue
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