Those of you of a certain age will remember the pop-up arms usually situated at the top of the 'B' post instead of conventional indicators on some old cars. Will a car fitted with these still pass an MOT today or do flashing indicators need to be fitted?
Thanks in advance.
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Yes-but if fitted they must work and be illuminated.
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IIRC a car that was originally fitted with pop-up arm indicators that complied with the then construction and use regulations, is tested accordingly. So yes it will still pass an MOT.
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Roger
I read frequently, but only post when I have something useful to say.
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Forgot to mention that the testing of very old cars like these as far less stringent than todays' cars.
Also would recommend knowing the correct hand signals as they frequently did not lift!
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Roger
I read frequently, but only post when I have something useful to say.
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As i understand they are ok for an M.O.T. but i am afraid that the majority of todays drivers would not know what the hell they are and as such it may be wise to retain the trafficators and to wire in unobtrusive indicators for piece of mind.
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Blimey, you're all on the ball tonight! Many thanks.
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Section1.5 of the tester's manual but not tested if vehicle first registered before January 1936.
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Have a friend used to have a 1956 Morris Minor with trafficators. They worked, but weren't the easiest to operate! They also were unreliable at any speed above 30mph, as the air resistance would push them against the rear of their aperture, and prevent them from closing! Someone had rejigged the rear lamps to be indicators, like the US type. Lovely old thing, but lack of power and poor brakes meant it was a challege to drive!
A.
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Dr Alex Mears
MG BGT 1971
If you are in a hole stop digging...unless
you are a miner.
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When I was a student (long time ago in the late 1960s:-) I had a Rover 16 with Working trafficators. They worke dat most speeds to 60mph.. I actually checked them on a motorway!..
Hand signals were not essential as somehow the bulbs in mine were brighter than normal...
BUT no-one looked for trafficators - even then.. so hand signals as well.. Easy when the drivers window was actuated by a specially geared lever.. 1/3rd turn and it wound the window completely down.. none of your slow electric rubbish!
madf
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www.motuk.co.uk/manual_150.htm
Vehicles first used before 1 April 1986
Semaphore Type
B 1. Operate the direction indicators and check
a. the operation of each indicator
b. that every direction indicator emits an amber light
Note: A semaphore arm must illuminate when in operation. It may flash, but is not required to do so
c. selector switch presence, security, condition and operation.
2. Check the correct operation of the 'tell-tale'.
Note: A 'tell-tale' may be audible or visual. A 'tell-tale' is not required if
one or more direction indicators on each side of the vehicle can be seen by the driver from the driver's seat.
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If I get the car I have my eye on I'll let you know how I get on.
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APM - some non-purists have converted Morris Minors, using a Marina engine and front discs - I believe.
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Two cars I owned had semaphores. They were fragile. Once went close enough to something with one of the signals out to break it. The remains had to be straightened out more or less and stuffed back in the slot. I can confirm that the indicators would come out at some speed, but wouldn't go back in until speed dropped below 40 or so, being 'powered' only by their own weight.
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' to wire in unobtrusive indicators for piece of mind.'
Which piece would that be?
Sometimes they would stick and a passenger would be required to thump the b post to make it operate.
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pop-up arms usually situated at the top of the 'B' post instead of conventional indicators
To me pop-up arms are conventional, and flashers are new -fangled!
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L\'escargot.
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My experience with trafficators later than the 1960s is that people following tend to take their foot off the accelerator while they work out what that strange thing sticking out of the side is for. I would tend to follow up with a hand signal. I now have one car with no indicators at all so the turn left hand signal seems to have the same effect in that they wonder what the crazy driver up front is doing and hang back!
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You are talking about the new electro-magnetic trafficators, not the traditional kind operated by a lever and wires running over pulleys?
They have a solenoid with a metal plunger running down a hole in the middle. This can fill up with dirt, spiders' nests etc, so it is well worth cleaning out. The linkage connecting the plunger to the arm is geared-up, so is very susceptible to dirt and corrosion too. If the bulb is too big it increases the weight, which can cause the arm to struggle to lift.
If replacing, watch out for size variations. i remember some were irritatingly 1/4" longer than others, so fouled the recess in the door pillar.
I remember one unobtrusive upgrade was to change the sidelight soockets to accomodate double filament bulbs, so that flashers could be fitted. These could have a separate switch, but neater was to wire them into the trafficator circuit so that both worked. That also retained the self-cancelling feature.
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I remember seeing a conversion attempt to flashing indicators while retaining the pop-ups. Unfortunately the wiring was connected wrongly and the poor trafficators tried to pop in and out as the light flashed.
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Yes, I see how that could happen. The light and the solenoid are on the same circuit, so both come live together. To make the light flash but the solenoid stay on steadily would need a much cleverer piece of wiring.
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Simple. Wire the flashing indicators via the flasher relay. Wire the trafficators to the input pin of the flasher, not the output pin. Indicators will flash, trafficator will rise.
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I think the point was someone was trying to be very clever and make the light on the trafficator flash, like a side repeater. He didn't appreciate that the light, and the solenoid, are wired in parallel, so that connection has to be undone and a separate wire taken to the unit to distinguish the two feeds, one flashing, the other not.
That's my guess as to what went wrong. I toyed with the idea myself about 40 years ago, but instead opted for simplicity. The car I had then didn't have a B post, being open, so the trafficator was low down just in front of the wheel arch. Even less visible than one at window height, but it had the advantage I could stick my arm out and give the (RH) trafficator a bit of help if it was reluctant to rise.
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