Honda Jazz problem

Honest John Back Room » Technical matters
What is life like with your car? Let us know and win £500 in John Lewis vouchers | No thanks
View Threaded
Mon 14 Aug 2006 14:11
Honda Jazz problem - TonyP
About one month after the 3 year warranty expired, my wife said that her Jazz was a bit jerky. I said it's likely that the plugs need changing as she does many very short journeys and at the last Honda service I declined the plug change as they wanted £150 to do it!! Seeing as the car had only done 13K they said it should be fine.

Anyway the car got worse so a recommended local garage done the plugs for £60. The problem persisted. I took it back to the garage and they ran a diagnostic check which threw up zero faults!! He said therefore it could only be one of two things - an air pressure sensor in the manifold OR most likely the exhaust gas regulator (EGR). He said it is a common for these to stick. Problem is if he changed the EGR and it was the other problem then I'm hit with 2 bills! He suggested I get the actual fault diagnosed by Honda.

Honda want £60 just to tell me what's wrong and a further £60 over and above the fitting quote from the garage (who told me it takes 10 minutes to fit!!) Anyway Honda agreed that the EGR is the likely cause as these parts are prone to sticking!!

My question is that our car has only just done 14K miles and now we're faced with a bill of over £300 for a part that they know can be faulty so surely this is more of a defect that should be rectified FOC? What happens if the new part fails in another 14K - I get screwed again!!

Anyone else heard or had this problem?

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 14:24
Honda Jazz problem - M.M
I am faced with exactly the same issue on a Jazz I look after that will be here in Sept to be sorted.... and I gave exactly the same advice to the owner. i.e. We'll do the plugs as they are a logical and fairly cheap item that will be needed anyway... but the EGR valve is a known issue and will be the next culprit to look at if the plugs don't help.

My advice also said Honda "should" be 100% on the ball with this issue and what's what with this car so if he wanted a "one stop shop" they "ought" to be that place.... albeit at a cost.

M.M

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 14:48
Honda Jazz problem - Altea Ego
My question is that our car has only just done 14K miles and now we're faced with a bill of over £300 for a part that they know can be faulty so surely this is more of a defect that should be rectified FOC? What happens if the new part fails in another 14K - I get screwed again!!

The warranty is 60,000 miles or three years, Under your rules you would want honda to fix it after 5 years, Where does the warranty end?

The "only done" 14k miles is the problem, its not getting used enough.

------------------------------
TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 14 Jun 2016 16:23
Honda Jazz problem - kassim

I am Kass and I have Honda Jazz 1.4 with 8 spark plugs, 4 infront and 4 at the rear. I was having the same problems,the Jazz was jerking at low speed. I unscrewed the EGR valve and cleaned it with WD 40 and I changed 8 spark plugs, it just jerked and is jerking.The next thing I suppose is testing each of 8 spark long packs and see where a falut lies.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 14 Jun 2016 16:35
Honda Jazz problem - RobJP

Did you try getting a proper diagnostic done first, or just change parts at random ?

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 14:57
Honda Jazz problem - nortones2
Did the local garage change all 8 plugs, and use the right grade? Try that angle first i suggest.....
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 15:37
Honda Jazz problem - TonyP
Garage definitely changed all 8 as the performance improved after it. The fault we've got is intermittent i.e when the EGR sticks. Besides the owner is a friend of a friend and when I took the car back he spent a good 20 minutes doing checks etc for nothing. He also rang Honda for part prices in front of me..in other words I have no reason to doubt local garage.

My gripe is not the fact that we have a part failure after the warranty has expired it's because the part is known to Honda as being unreliable and is a common problem. In my view the part is obviously sub standard and should be replaced FOC...but that ain't gonna happen.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 15:51
Honda Jazz problem - Altea Ego
Its not honda specific.

Its a technology problem. Most cars have problems with EGRs as some stage or other it seems. Its almost a consumable item these days.
------------------------------
TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 15:58
Honda Jazz problem - nortones2
Well thats the plugs sorted then:) Maybe the low mileage/short runs contributes to the EGR sticking? An Italian tune up is what I give the wifes Jazz occasionally, as otherwise it wouldn't get exercised into the top-end of the rev band much.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 16:53
Honda Jazz problem - jc2
Any vehicle that uses eight plugs on an engine like this shows a serious failing in the understanding of combustion.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 17:46
Honda Jazz problem - Aprilia
Any vehicle that uses eight plugs on an engine like this
shows a serious failing in the understanding of combustion.


Not at all.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 17:49
Honda Jazz problem - Aprilia
EGR is required to meet emissions regs and they can get a bit 'sticky' when car is used on short runs.
My advice would be to remove the EGR valve and give it a good dose of carbon remover to shift the contamination. Refit and should live to fight another day. If you are paying silly-money dealer labour rates then a new valve is probably a better long term solution.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 21:08
Honda Jazz problem - grease monkey
tony p,there is a technical service bulletin released by honda about egr valves on jazz`s giving the symptons you describe,get the valve replaced & all will be well again,i have replaced numerous egr valves on jazz`s at work & it is quiet a common complaint on an otherwise good car.
as for the comments from another poster "JC2"re: "Any vehicle that uses eight plugs on an engine like this shows a serious failing in the understanding of combustion " well the jazz engine is labeled I-DSI ,intelligent dual sequential ignition contrary to what you said it shows a very through understanding of combustion,the front bank of 4 spark plugs fire before the rear bank of spark plugs and the timing of this is variable so that this little engine can achieve complete combustion and do over 50 mpg without difficulty,.
--
if it aint broke don`t fix it
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 21:38
Honda Jazz problem - Bill Payer
grease monkey - does the tsb relate to a specific age range of Jazz's?

Our's is 3 nxt month and has extremely intermittant hestitation, which is so random I just thought it was one of those things. Obviously if there is a potential egr valve issue then it would be good to get this done while it's having its 3 yr service next week. It is a low mileage / short journey car.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Mon 14 Aug 2006 21:43
Honda Jazz problem - nortones2
Grease monkey: Is EGR valve "sticking" related to any particualr issues, like short journeys, fuel quality etc, or is it inevitable after time?
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 15 Aug 2006 11:23
Honda Jazz problem - M.M
It goes without saying really that I will try and clean the EGR valve before replacement on the one I have to do.... but experience with similar valves shows even when they look spot on the fault still exists and only a new one will sort it.

As a matter of interest one of the main reasons for the 8 plugs and combined/sequential firing in the Jazz is to enable it to run a high 10.8:1 compression ratio and still use regular fuel without pinking.

M.M (D.W)
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 15 Aug 2006 21:55
Honda Jazz problem - grease monkey
from memory the technical service bulletin refers to the egr valve being contaminated with something,i`ll read it at work tomorrow & post the answer tomorrow night.
--
if it aint broke don`t fix it
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 16 Aug 2006 09:31
Honda Jazz problem - TonyP
Thanks for the responses people. Seeing as it definitely appears to be the EGR I will save myself and inspection fee and over inflated labour charge at Honda and go back to my local garage for them to do it.

Cheers
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 16 Aug 2006 09:46
Honda Jazz problem - cheddar
>> Any vehicle that uses eight plugs on an engine like
this
>> shows a serious failing in the understanding of combustion.
>>
Not at all.


8 plugs on a Jazz is a bit OTT, 16000 RPM m/cycle engine producing 200bhp/litre make do with 4, or 1 per cyl, as do the most efficient petrol car engines.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 16 Aug 2006 09:48
Honda Jazz problem - cheddar
The Jazz is often cited as the most reliable car in the UK though the only person I know to run one had total engine failure at 50k miles. On the otherhand there are many old Civics with three or four times that mileage still going strong.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 16 Aug 2006 10:46
Honda Jazz problem - nortones2
But the dual ignition system is aimed at reducing pinking at low revs and wide throttle, and consuming all the fuel, therefore quite a different purpose. There is more than enough tech detail here: asia.vtec.net/Series/FitJazz/lseries/index.html
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 16 Aug 2006 12:58
Honda Jazz problem - jc2
EGR on a modern gasoline car???
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 17 Aug 2006 12:50
Honda Jazz problem - DP
What Car did a test back in the late 80's on an Alfa 75 2.0 Twin Spark where, at the end of the standard test schedule, they repeated all the performance and power tests with one plug on each cylinder disconnected. They then threw in a "blind" road test with several testers, none of which were aware of which configuration the car was running in.

The conclusion was, the car ran the same, drove the same, performed the same, and used the same amount of fuel whether running on four or eight plugs. The only major difference was that emissions were not tested - who cared in the 80's?

Cheers
DP
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 16 Aug 2006 20:47
Honda Jazz problem - grease monkey
well tony p,i have some details for you re:honda technical bulletin for jazz egr valve

sympton.
when driving at a constant low speed ( engine rpm between 1000-2000 rpm) the car jerks forwards and backwards.

cause.
silicon compounds contained in vehicle body wax and windscreen washer fluid,evaporated in the engine bay compartment. this creates SILOXANE gas which adheres to the internal surfaces of the egr valve.

now it is known, the makers of the egr valve have applied FLOURINE oil to the surface of the egr lift sensor to stop SILOXANE particles from sticking to it.

only certain jazz`s where affected which is known by chassis number. the good news is that if your car is affected with tthese symptons,and is in the range of chassis numbers then honda have extended the warranty period for the egr valve to five years or 90000 miles,so it is worth getting your local honda dealer to check your car if you have these symptons.

hope this clears things up for you tony.
--
if it aint broke don`t fix it
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 17 Aug 2006 12:15
Honda Jazz problem - nortones2
Interesting GM. I checked via www.honda.co.uk/owner/cars/qasPUD.jsp for recalls/updates. Maybe the OP could try that initially: more information when approaching the dealer!
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 17 Aug 2006 14:06
Honda Jazz problem - TonyP
Thanks GM

The symptins you describe is exactly what is happening - the slower I go this worse it is. Never really notice it on the motorway.

Is this info available publically or are you privvy to inside info? Reason I ask if I go to the dealer with this I can just imagine them saying 'who told you that!' and will probably deny all knowledge!

Do you know which series of chassis numbers were affected?

Really appreciate this?

TonyP
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 17 Aug 2006 18:52
Honda Jazz problem - grease monkey
tony p,its inside info im afraid and is not available to the public,my advice is to contact honda customer relations in the first instance,explain the problem etc,stress the low milage,low usuage of the car etcsay its just out of warranty,& im pretty sure that they will get you sorted out, good luck
--
if it aint broke don`t fix it
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Fri 18 Aug 2006 09:22
Honda Jazz problem - TonyP
Cheers GM

Will give them a call.
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 30 Aug 2006 16:37
Honda Jazz problem - TonyP
Grease Monkey - you are a top man.

Took the car into Honda, armed with your info, and at first they tried to give me a load of flannel about the problem and that I would have to pay £50 inspection etc. Final upshot was that they're going to replace the EGR for nothing and won't charge me the £50 either.

Well done Honda but more importantly thanks GM - you have saved me £300. I think i owe you a large pint!!

Cheers

Tony
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Wed 30 Aug 2006 21:23
Honda Jazz problem - grease monkey
im really pleased for you tony,glad to hear you got a good result
--
if it aint broke don`t fix it
Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Thu 15 Jan 2015 16:18
Honda Jazz problem - kassim

I have Honda Jazz 1.4 Petrol and it started jerking at 70,000 miles. I changed spark plugs myself( 8 spark plugs, 2 plugs per cylinder) only took one hour. Did a test drive and same problem, was still jerking. Next problem to look was the EGR valve, took it out and cleaned it woth lot of WD 40 and fitted, the problem seemed to go away but then it came back?? EGR valve is more than £100 but I still manage to drive without any problems.

Reply | Report as offensive | Link
Tue 12 Jan 2016 17:14
Honda Jazz problem - Abu Umayr

My 2007 Jazz (Auto) was jerking for 8 - 12 months (only when driving off from stand still), otherwise car is fine for loca and motorway. It's common for Auto cars, they need gear box fluid flused or replaced every 40 or 60K mines.

I go mine done from Honda (Crown), cost me ~£190 inc VAT.

I got my service done from friends garage (before this fix) and he suggested the solution... also another friend who is car expert suggestion this.

Now car very smooth for past month+

Abu Umayr Islam

Edited by Abu Umayr on 12/01/2016 at 17:15

Reply | Report as offensive | Link

10 warranty myths exposed

Here’s how to sort the fact from the fiction when it comes to car warranties.

Cheap Car Warranties

We give you the low down on how to save on insurance, little-known tricks and tips, what insurance groups mean and how to use insurance aggregators to beat insurers.

Insurance group finder and how to save on insurance