my son has just got a citrone saxo 1.1 54k and is going to do a oil change.
he wants to use a fully synthetic oil but is not sure wether to add a flushing adgent before changing.
has any one got any advise regarding engine flush and is he wasting money using synthetic on a older car
thanks
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i am not a fan of flushing agents,
i would use semi synthetic.
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\"a little man in a big world/\"
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If the car has been regularly service I would not use a flushing oil. Magnetec 10/40 and 6k oil changes are idea for this engine. Regards Peter
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I always flush if I buy a car of which I do not know the history.
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Instead of a flush, change the oil and filter with a good quality oil, then in a month or two, do another change and filter, then change every six months.
I suppose you want to be sure that going fortward the car is well looked after, as you don't know it's history.
The folks on here don't generally recommend a flush - they know their stuff.
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my son has just got a citrone saxo 1.1 he wants to use a fully synthetic oil
Waste of money in a car of this engine size, IMHO. Semi synth or mineral oil would be sufficient enough.
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Waste of money in a car of this engine size, IMHO.
Why's that?
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It's an old low tech design with probably quite wide tolerances relative to newer designs.
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It's an old low tech design with probably quite wide tolerances relative to newer designs.
Correct. I also imagine the handbooks recommendation doesn't include fully synth in it's listings either.
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I see. Not a case of its size more like the design and age of the unit.
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I see. Not a case of its size more like the design and age of the unit.
Well, size does play a part of it. Modern high performance engines for example should use a top quality oil, but something like a 1.1 litre Saxo engine will be fine on "ordinary" oil.
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>>has any one got any advise regarding engine flush and is he wasting money using synthetic on a older car
really up to him if he wants to use fully synthetic,but doubt there would be any benefit in using it,apart from being more expensive and not warranted/needed I see no point.
And would not use any flushing agent-should not be needed,It can cause problems.
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Steve
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This PSA TU1 lump has been around for years, A nice semi synthetic 10 W 40 oil to the correct spec is what you want & a genuine Citroen oil filter.
Try the parts department at your local Citroen dealer, You may get a shock how cheap the parts are.
I bought many an oil change kit from the parts department at my local Peugeot dealer, £10 got you a filter, drain plug washer & the 5 litres of oil & all genuine parts too.
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Just drain hot,changing from mineral to sythetic at this mileage
can cause oil leaks at seals so i am told, never tried though.
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its his first car and is very keen to get it right . will use semi semi synthetic no flush , like the idea of second change in couple of months.
thanks everyone
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My son has a 1997 1.1 Peugoet 106 1.1 - same car as Saxo. We bought it at 20k miles 3 years ago. ALways used Comma 10-40 Semi synthetic. Now 70k miles and as good as when bought Uses no oil. Slight seep from cylinder head gasket and that's negligible. Oil changes every 6 k miles.
Fully synthetic? Waste of money in this engine imo. It's a 1980s design....before fully synthetic oils were available...
madf
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Head gasket leaking oil on a TU engine is a well know fault, When it gets worse & starts to cover the alternator in oil its then time to replace the head gasket.
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Think National are still doing their oil and filter change starting from a tenner. Great value, but I understand its no use if your son is actually wanting to learn some basic maintenance skills.
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Head gasket leaking oil on a TU engine is a well know fault, When it gets worse & starts to cover the alternator in oil its then time to replace the head gasket.
Can you give me some more info on this? I believe SWMBO's 1.4 Saxo (N-reg) has a failing head gasket. It is losing water (approx 10cl per journey!) and the coolant is a bit brown and lumpy. White gunge inside the coolant cap as well. Oil seems fine though.
What is involved in the gasket change and how much is it likely to cost? I've been told we would need the head skimming and the timing belt changing as well as the gasket doing - is this good advice? Belt is only about 10k old. Would the oil have the be changed at the same time or would it be worth having it done? Only 4 months since last service but then I guess only 2 until next oil change recommended.
TIA
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The TU head gasket just leaks oil after a while, Leave it too long & it drowns the alternator in oil & ruins it & costs you more money.
The head gasket design has also been modified since your car was built.
The TU engine is all aluminium so you MUST skim the head when replacing the head gasket, If you don't you will be doing the job again in the not to distant future.
It is also good engineering practice to replace the timing belt when doing the head gasket, They are cheap enough & you would have already gone through most of the dismantling to remove the head so you might as well stick a new timing belt on to.
Also its a good idea on the TU engine to replace the water pump with a genuine PSA Peugeot / Citroen one at timing belt renewal, They like to start weeping water not long after & then you have to take the nice new timing belt off again to change the water pump, So it makes sense to do it while you have easy access.
For the cost of an oil & filter change on this car its also worth doing if you want a proper job done, Also replace the coolant with the correct mixture, Use the new long life PSA stuff.
Find a good garage who know there PSA Peugeot / Citroen cars & they should be able to give you a rough price on this job.
Are you 100% sure the head gasket is on the way out? Have you checked the pressure cap isn't leaking because its worn & old?
Gunge inside the oil filler cap could just mean the engine doesn't get hot enough, Does it just trundle around town for a few miles or does the car get up to full operating temperature on a nice long journey?
Slight water loss on a Saxo could be the radiator starting to leak, Have you checked its sound?
Have you had a failing head gasket confirmed by a garage / mechanic?
Before spending money on it, Check the simple things like joints around hoses, hose clips & the radiator etc.
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It's more than slight loss - the header bottle went from max to below min in a week and went down by about 1/4 after one journey.
No water under car after it has stood and none plus no obvious leaks after having it idling for a few minutes. Checked hoses and radiator and no sign of anything. Have been advised to check for water from the exhaust - is this worth doing?
Pressure cap seems fine - how would we check it? Also, I have noticed what looks like some fresh oil on the block - can't remember the layout as I've only been under the bonnet twice but it was on the left as you look from the front of the car and only below gasket area.
We are going to get a mechanic to look it over but I'm pretty confident from the amount of water loss and the state of the coolant that it is the head gasket.
If I'm reading you correctly, the best approach would be:
Head skim, replace gasket, timing belt and water pump, change oil, filter and coolant? Sounds like that could be an expensive job - not what SWMBO would want to hear at the moment...
As for driving, typically 10 mile runs, mostly motorway with a bit of town stuff on the end. Don't think the car has done more than about 25-30 miles on a run since she got it about 3 years back. Rarely does very short runs - typically her house to mine or her house in to Manchester, both around 10 miles. (The former mainly motorway, the latter about 5 miles motorway then 30/40 limit the rest of the way.)
Thanks muchly for info so far.
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The oil at the front left corner of the block is the typical TU head gasket oil leak that will kill the alternator if it is left too long, You can just keep an eye on them but once they really start to throw oil out you have to change them pretty quick.
It is sounding like this Saxo needs a head gasket replacement, If you plan on keeping the car then get it done properly, Head skim, Head gasket, Timing belt, Water pump, Coolant, Oil & filter.
Like I said the new TU head gaskets have been modified to stop them blowing unless you cook or abuse the engine.
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We've been quoted £350 to get this done by a garage she is familiar with and trusts. The chap seemed honest enough and said pretty much what you have said so I'm happy he knows his stuff. Does this price sound reasonable? He included crack detection in the head skim - is this usual?
I do know a mechanic who will do this job as a 'foreigner' for about £100 cheaper but I'm not sure if it would be wise to use him or if using the garage would be a better bet. Would this be something any mechanic should be able to manage or would you recommend using a garage? Money is tight so the cheaper option would be better but we are also minded of the long term plus don't want to let ourselves in for any other problems.
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Forgot to add BTW, the water is looking pretty brown now. Oil level looks unchanged though. We are hoping to get another 4 or 5 days from it then we are away for a week so were going to leave it at the garage. Should we be OK with this as long as we keep levels topped up?
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Do not bother with flushing oil, I think they do more harm than good. Synthetic oils themselves act as flushing agents and keep the engine very clean internally.
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Possibly the first ever use of synthetic oil in automobile engines was during the second world war. In the African desert Sherman tanks, using standard Chrysler car engines, were frying their engine oil and seizing engines solid, these synthetic lubricants were tried out very successfully.
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