The car is a '98 Punto 75 Manual
The problem is the car is difficult getting into gear, especially when cold. Engaging reverse in the morning results in much crunching. Problem started about a year ago when the answer was to slip it into 1st or 2nd, lifting the clutch a little, depress clutch and then it would slip into reverse with no problem. However, now it is reluctant to go into any forward gear when cold. The answer now is to start engine in gear with the clutch depressed.
Car had new clutch and slave cylinder 18 months/6,000 miles ago. It has now done 60,000 miles. I bled the clutch today, with little improvement. No apparent leaks from the master cylinder. I haven?t yet checked the gearbox oil level, but thought I might change it anyway ? it?s meant to be done at 80,000. No oil leaks from the gearbox either.
So the questions are, any ideas as to the cause and, if I change the oil, should I replace it with SAE80W as specified, or go for something thinner?
Any advice, much appreciated.
Chris M
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Changing the gear oil worked for a similar problem on my daughter's Cinquecento. Stick to the recommended grade of oil, though some would recommend a synthetic in place of mineral oil.
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Run engine, hold clutch down at 75% of travel engage 1st gentley, does it crunch ? repeat with cluch fully down does it still crunch. If it does check the actuator lever is travelling fully when the clutch is depressed, take two to test. Report back. Regards Peter
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Peter D
When cold, it doesn't matter whether clutch is 75% or 100% depressed, it doesn't want to engage. A fair bit of force is required to engage first or second. Reverse crunches.
When hot, first engages fairly easily at both 75% and 100% and slips in easily if you depress clutch for a second or two. Reverse crunches unless you keep clutch depressed for a second or two first.
Clutch slave cylinder moves about 20mm when clutch pedal depressed. I don't know whether that is enough?
Chris M
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20mm is half what it should be, either you have air in system or something is wrong. However some of the problems you describe can be caused by the wrong oil in the box but you have not ahd that changed so it probably is not that. This could also be a busted spring in the clutch causing drag. Can you engage all gears when the engine is not running and the clutch is depressed. ??? Regards Peter
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Thanks for your help so far. It's my wife's car and I don't drive it very often so I can't be sure, but I think all gears can be selected with the engine stopped. I'll check tomorrow. Would a faulty master cylinder cause problems with the slave not moving sufficiently?
Chris M
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Clutch is on the way out ,nothing to to do with oil.
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Andy, your right, it's nothing to do with the oil as I have just changed it and it made no difference.
Peter, all gears engage OK with engine off and clutch either engaged or disengaged.
I have removed the rubber bung from the clutch housing and can see that when the clutch is depressed the pressure plate moves by several millimetres, so even after the clutch plate has expanded, there is a gap of about 1-2mm between it and the pressure plate. Is this a normal amount? I haven't rotated the engine to see if this is the case through 360 degrees.
Chris M
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So it is drag this is causing the crunch. This can be caused by several things from end of life clutch, clutch sticking on the slines, worn pressure fingers to broken compression spring. Howevever, perhaps someone on the forum with the same car would like to measure the movement you describe as it sounds a little small to me, particularly on a worn clutch. As you sure you do not have any air in the clutch hydraulic system. Peter
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Further, this can be caused by delamination ( bond failure of the friction material thus the clutch is thicker in one area of the clutch and is just touching the plate, it does not take much to cause your sort of problem. Regards Peter
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Thanks for your very helpful advice Peter.
I may have another go at bleeding it. I used an Eezi Bleed and did the brakes at the same time (same reservoir)- maybe the air pressure was getting low by then. I think I'm clutching (!) at straws, but it's worth a try. If that doesn't do it, then it's off to local indy for their opinion and maybe a look at the clutch. I'm not into taking gearboxes out myself now - even small ones. The clutch was replaced by the previous owner and so I can't say what quality the part was.
Chris M
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Car went in today and clutch was replaced. All OK now. Apparently it was the pressure plate - a couple of faulty springs causing the clutch to drag.
Thanks for the help.
Chris M
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Good news.
With all that crunching now get the gearbox oil changed to pull out as many bits as you can.
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Changed at the same time.
Chris M
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