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Every time the oil gets changed on my c22o diesel the oil high light comes on for a couple of weeks even though I tell them to put in the exact aopunt of oil...6 litres according to the handbook. This is a great problem because the very experts disagree on how to check oil levels on the dipstick, some say cold, some warm and others anywhere in between. Different engine temperatures give different readings on the stick. I have started this thread before and even the good folks in the backroom cannot agree.
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Well, at risk of starting a heated debate, ;-), I was always told all pressures and fluids are checked cold at the start of the day/journey and would suggest logic agrees. Could you countenance the scenario where you have to go for a 10 minute drive or leave the car idling on the drive for 10 minutes before you could check the oil level? Totally wasteful of time and energy, both yours and the cars.
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I seem to recall that the manual for a Saab specifies something similar to this.
I know that on some Porsches the engine has to be up to temperature and running when you check the oil.
But most cars require it checking cold. If in doubt, RTFM.
--
I read often, only post occasionally
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Engine oils should always be checked cold for maximum accuracy.
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Not according to some manufacturers. Not if it is a Porsche, with a dry sump. Not for my Honda, where the oil check is to be done with the oil warm.
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BMW, Ford, Honda, warm it up, lt it stand and dip.
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From the Engine Oil Bible:
When checking the level of oil in the engine, the car should be on a level plane, and should be relatively cold. I've run into several people lately who insist in keeping the crankcase topped off completely, and they invariably check the dipstick just after shutting down the engine.
Reading the oil in this way results in an erroneous reading because a quantity of oil (usually about half a litre) is still confined in the oilways and passages (galleries) of the engine, and takes some time to drain back into the crankcase.
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I don't think the indicated oil level is that critical. Anywhere between the max and min marks will do. I often come across engines where the dipstick doesn't even reach the oil, and on draining find that there's usually three or four pints in the sump. Enough for the oil pump pickup to be submerged. I'm not suggesting that this sort of neglect is a good thing, but a couple of mm either way between the midpoint of the marks on the dipstick is irrelevant.
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It doesn't only lubricate,it also cools the engine and for that you need the correct quantity.
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Is 6L the capacity of the sump or the refill quantity after an oil change? They?re NOT the same thing, as not all the old oil is removed during draining (or sucking), so you may be instructing the garage to overfill.
As long as it?s not over the full mark, the oil level is not that critical ? ask the garage to put 5.5L in and then keep it between the marks.
My Merc C270Cdi holds 6.5L. It doesn?t have a dipstick and the computer tells me when it needs more oil, but you?re not supposed to add amounts of less than 1L. The computer knows if you add 1L and it extends the service interval.
I know (because there?s a hidden menu) that my car has 5.7L in it at the moment, and when I press the button to check the oil level it says ?OK?.
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Diesel oil levels
>>I know that on some Porsches the engine has to be up to temperature and running when you check the oil.
Not according to some manufacturers. Not if it is a Porsche, with a dry sump.
I was not aware of a diesel Porsche except for this one
www.pdce.de/
A proper Chelsea tractor.
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The thermal expansion of motor oil is pretty small (around 0.1% per deg.) - so the actual volume is not much different hot or cold. The main thing is that you measure it when all the oil has had time to drain back into the sump. In other words don't check it just after you switch the engine off. Give it a few minutes to drain down.
As to the 'no-dipstick' computer-based measurement systems fitted to some recent cars - well, why use a £400 ECU when a strip of metal will do the job more reliably?
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because the £400 ecu is there already, and some people never lift the bonnet.
If technology can do the job, why not let it?
------------------------------
TourVanMan TM < Ex RF >
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As to the 'no-dipstick' computer-based measurement systems fitted to some recent cars - well, why use a £400 ECU when a strip of metal will do the job more reliably?
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>>because the £400 ecu is there already, and some people never lift the bonnet.
>>If technology can do the job, why not let it?
All very well but.. Two years collected a hire car. All fine but the next morning when I started it, it indicated that I had an oil problem and a service was required.
I used said strip of metal, in the proper way and the oil was midway between the max min marks so I was a little happier especially as the warnings had now dissappeared.
I identified the cause of the alarm was me parking it over night on a slope causing the sensor to trip.
It was a Renault Scenic. Not the best hire vehicle to give to a customer if the oil is not up to max.
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I identified the cause of the alarm was me parking it over night on a slope causing the sensor to trip.
If you'd used the dipstick while it was on a slope then you'd have been similarly alarmed (if you didn't appreciate the effects of the slope).
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So if you have a dipstick and the manual says check it warm, do so, leave the car to cool down/drain down and you have a cold drained level you can mark on the dipstick. You can then check to that mark without warming up.
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My 54 reg Primastar van once flashed the "Check Oil" sign when I had a large amount of rubbish above the rear axle. The van wasn't overloaded.
When I emptied the rubbish out the "problem" dissapered.
How do you explain that?
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Not always true. As others have said read the manual. smarts MUST be checked when the oil has been warmed up and left to stand for 10 minutes or so. Checking when cold could result in an unnecessary top up and a ruined turbo - thats £800 please!
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Similar with the SAAB 9-3 Tid. The procedure is so specific, and so importnat, that SAAB sent all owners an A4 size letter explaining how to do it! The level must be checked with the engine warm , car on level ground and 5 minutes after stopping. When you first check the level there is no oil showing on the dipstick at all! When you put the dipstick back in and take a 2nd reading you get the correct level. People who rely on the 1st reading and add a litre are then grossly overfilled, to the great detriment of the engine.
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smarts MUST be checked when the oil has been warmed up and left to stand for 10 minutes or so.
How do you check the level after an oil change?
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This is a great problem because the very experts disagree on how to check oil levels on the dipstick, some say cold, some warm and others anywhere in between.
Ignore what everyone else says, refer to your handbook. What does it say?
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My manual says check after it's at operating temperature and left 5 mins to drain. So I do. Autobox says check hot too, Range Rover used to say cold - so there is no universal rule, Read the manual is the only correct answer.
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Lots of good advice, but I've yet to see a dipstick with one mark on it.
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Not seen a dipstick yet that has not got Max/Min levels marked on stick,biggest problem with oils is seeing the level as oil is so transparent/clean,as mentioned go by user manual.this is safest way,or contact Main dealer for advice- failing that manufacturer
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Steve
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My V220CDi manual reccomended checking oil level at normal operating temp. The oil level sensor had to be replaced under warranty so was very glad mine had a dipstick.
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My V220CDi manual reccomended checking oil level at normal operating temp. The oil level sensor had to be replaced under warranty so was very glad mine had a dipstick.
This is why I don't like electronic monitoring. If there is no dipstick provided then the monitoring system can fail and you wouldn't know about it until the bearings start knocking through oil starvation.
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Steve, the biggest problem with plastic dipsticks is that they seem to oil repelling on one side and oil absorbing on the other. Accuracy is impossible !
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>>the biggest problem with plastic dipsticks is that they seem to oil repelling on one side and oil absorbing on the other. Accuracy is impossible !
its not possible to get perfect accuracy,reason why a max min.is applied to dipsticks,I also think people worry too much.min level on cars I have owned are approx 1/3 pint between max/min not much to worry about IMO.I always go on 2 approx mm above/below line and never had a problem,though agree with an earlier post electronic checks are not as accurate and would rather trust a dipstick anyday
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Steve
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My manual says check after it's at operating temperature and left 5 mins to drain. So I do. Autobox says check hot too, Range Rover used to say cold - so there is no universal rule, Read the manual is the only correct answer.
How do you check the oil on an auto box ?
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I've never before heard about anyone specifying the quantity of engine oil that they want putting in their engine at oil-change time.
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L\'escargot.
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Escargot - I can't just see what post you are commenting on. Surely the amount of oil one specifies to have put in one's car for an oil change is that required by the servicing schedule, either held by the dealer or in the car handbook?
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>>Surely the amount of oil one specifies to have put in one's car for an oil change is that required by the servicing schedule, either held by the dealer or in the car handbook?
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IMO the capacity stated in the handbook is the total DRY capacity of the engine.
When the old oil is extracted, by either sucking or sump plug removal, some is left in the sump and in various locations around the oilways etc. So the handbook value would cause an overfill hence it is unrealistic to specify how much to put in.
Possibly state it should be less than xx litres but I doubt they measure it.
So when I change my oil I fill it to max up as per dip stick. Then start the engine and run briefly to ensure the filter is full. I then allow it to drain down, even though it has not got poperly hot. Re-check and top up but not to max.
After the next time it is up to operating temperature, after allowing it to cool, a further re-check and maybe a little top up to max.
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Escargot - I can't just see what post you are commenting on.
It's this, in the original post.
"Every time the oil gets changed on my c22o diesel the oil high light comes on for a couple of weeks even though I tell them to put in the exact aopunt of oil...6 litres according to the handbook."
I would never dream of telling the garage that services my car how much oil to put in when they change it. I may be naive but I assume (and always have done) that they will put in the quantity required. Similarly I would never tell my dentist how much filling to put in a tooth, nor tell my doctor how much vaccine to inject into me.
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L\'escargot.
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As with engine - as it says in manual.
RR had dipstick, current car you have to lie under car and remove a fill plug.
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