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I wouldn't worry, as long as you keep the oil changed at the correct intervals it will be fine. These old Polos are incredibly tough things, it takes a lot to break them, certainly better than the MK4 in my opinion.
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Yes, nothing to worry about. Just bear in mind that it may take 7 miles or more to reach full operating temperature (that's about how long it takes in two of my cars).
3000 rpm is a perfectly sensible level to treat as a ceiling until fully warm. I heed the advice of someone more expert than I am (many qualify in those terms) -- it's above 3000 rpm that an engine really gets punished (a very rough & ready figure, of course, given high-rev Honda engines, etc.). Hence, I don't push my 21-year-old Capri 2.8i much beyond that, as it's running unmodified on super-unleaded with a lead-substitute additive.
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Does that hold true for diesels too?
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What length of run to get the diesel's oil warmed enough for the MOT? Nearest main road is 50mph limit.
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I wasna fu but just had plenty.
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Having previously owned a car which was fitted with an oil temperature gauge, as well as a coolant temp gauge, I can assure you that it takes a hell of a lot longer for the oil to warm up than the water!.
Your "long way" out of the estate is pointless, if you're doing it on the basis of not wanting to push your engine while the oil is cold. You'd need to do at least 5 miles before your oil was any where near normal temp!
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Thanks for the replies so far people.
I thought I was taking it all bit too seriously, but just wanted know.
As mentioned in my initial post, the point in taking the 'long way' out of the estate was to put some degree of heat into the oil, even though I fully understand it could never be enough to be fully up to temperature. Thus a slight viscosity reduction would be more beneficial compared to none, especially in these winter months, where an oil warming from 0C to 10C goes from a viscosity of about 1000cst to 500cst.
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Roberson, I think you are taking this just a little too seriously. Its as simple as: 1/ Start engine 2/ Drive off 3/ Dont thrash it to the red line till its hot.
I'd make that four points by adding "idle for 20seconds to allow oil to circulate" between 1 and 2.
Owners of BX's and Xantiae do this anyway waiting for the hydraulics to wake up. I've seen this enforced wait suggested as a reason why the petrol BX was less prone to oil smoke than the equivalent Pug 405's .
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I drive about 13 miles to work on relatively clear roads,ie no stop/start running although progress is slow (45mph)sometimes. The Xantia is fitted with an oil temperature gauge and this time of year it rarely reaches 50 degrees Centigrade by the end of the journey.
It takes a good "thrash" up the motorway to get the oil temperature up to the same temperature as the coolant.
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What engine does it have?
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I checked your profile...2 litre petrol. Ignore my last message!
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I have a Merc C270CDi - it takes 40 miles for the fuel consumption to settle down, which I presume is the indication that the engine is fully up to temp.
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In the handbook for my car, (Saab TiD) it says: "Let the engine idle for about 10 seconds. Do not open the throttle wide for at least 2-3 minutes after starting."
Then under the section Economical Driving it says: "If idling, it will take much longer before the engine becomes hot. Engine wear is greatest during this warming up phase. Therefore drive away as soon as possible, but avoid high revving".
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"If idling, it will take much longer before the engine becomes hot. Engine wear is greatest during this warming up phase. Therefore drive away as soon as possible, but avoid high revving".
That doesn't mean that engine wear is greater when idling, though! I had a friend who took similar advice to the extreme, starting his car in gear so that it wouldn't have to idle at all! Not very surprisingly, his cars gave endless trouble...
I use the LJK Setright rule of thumb, which is not to use more than half maximum (red-line) revs until the engine is warm. A short idle before moving off ensures that the oil is at least circulating.
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I was also told this by some Peugeot mechanics for my 306 diesel.
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I was also told this by some Peugeot mechanics for my 306 diesel.
The 3000rpm thing or the oil warm up time?
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Oil , at least 10s idling to let oil flow,
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I can't help but think that this is all much ado about nothing.
How often do you hear of a modern engine dying because it components inside the block are physically worn out? I hear plenty of tales about snapped timing belts, head gasket failures etc consuming engines but usually ancillarly components put a car beyond economical repair long before the engine wears out.
Any thoughts?
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Agreed Quinny,
I'd say most of the population get in there car, start it and drive off straight away, a few of us may start the car and let it 'warm' up for a few minutes. With the ammount of money (billions) car companys spend on testing im sure they know this happens. As long as you change the oil 6,000 miles or so im sure it will be fine.
Lee
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I agree with Quinny100. When I sold my Laguna it had 180K on the clock. It was as sound as a pound, didn't use a drop of oil between services, used no water, no funny noises at all.
Same with a VW, sold at 140K, engine absolutely fine.
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I have heard of a number of high milers (C 200K) dying due to worn parts.
You get a few occurrences where there's been an oil blockage in an oilway on, say an oil ring on a piston
However, its mainly about efficiency. If the lubrication isn't up to much you'll get things like loss of compression, knocking etc - would anyone else who knows more about this than me (98% of the BR) like to help me out before I get really out of my depth.....please....?
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If the oil has been changed regularly, then a blockage should not occur.
I would be quite content to have an engine give up the ghost at 200K, it is a fairly impressive mileage by most peoples' standards. However, there is no reason why a well maintained and considerately driven car should not go on for much longer than this, especially if it has been subjected to long journeys rather than the urban stop-start murder. I am sure that is why I got 180K out of the Laguna, and it would probably have gone on for much longer if I had been prepared to tolerate the high fuel costs.
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>>Any thoughts?
As long as correct oil is put in and given a couple of seconds after starting before driving off,see no reason to get any problems.Had this discussion with someone else,they start up and drive.Never had a problem though
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Steve
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Thanks again people, some interesting responses.
I wasn't too worried about the oil itself. The car only does about 5000 miles p/a and the oil is changed yearly with GTX Magnatec 10w/40 which meets the handbook specs, along with the filter for an OEM Mann one.
Perhaps I should have said, but the engine does have piston slap (which promptly disappears when warm). But then again, I wasn't too worried about the fact it does it (a characteristic of short stroke VW engines) but much more about it getting any worse. But, with it doing 35000 miles with piston slap and not getting too much worse, no worries there either.
I was curious that?s all. There?s no other place where you can get the volume and mix of opinions like you do in the BR, which is why I asked :-)
Thanks again, any more views?
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Much ado about nothing? Not an unreasonable view. I guess it depends on your general attitude to life. Do you like to take care of things or are they just there to be used until they break? I have a 21-year-old pair of shoes as well as a 21-year-old car, but you'd never guess that from the condition of either of them. I like good things chosen carefully (for which I scrimp and save, because they are usually expensive) and investing in their long-term health and durability. I'm just not one of those who don't care and get rid of it before it gives them trouble. And when I do eventually sell, it's at a good price.
I drove a W126 Mercedes a few months ago with 370k on the clock. The engine had not been rebuilt, neither had a gasket been changed. Engine and transmission were as sweet as a nut. Guess what: it had been serviced with oil changes at 6k intervals on the dot and had done 50k per year for six years.
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Nobody is saying its not an unreasonable view?? the poster was curious as to what we thought and has thanked people for there honesty. My general attitiude to life is to try and look after things especially cars, although I haven't got a 21 year old pair of shoes thats for sure :) The point maybe being stated is that, starting your car and driving off pretty much straight away isn't going to do 'that' much harm as long as your car is looked after. The original poster was asking for views on this, which we have all given. Just because I dont wait 10 minutes before I drive off doesn't mean I dont look after my car and won't get a good price when I sell? my car is serviced EVERY year, my oil is changed every 6,000 miles too.
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oil is changed every 6,000 miles too.
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when, where and how did this magical 6000 miles figure emerge?
wasn't in the day's of stevenson's rocket by any chance, was it ?
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The days when people realised service intervals are mainly to do with running cost calcualtions in 'What Car?' and fleet manager spreadsheets.
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when, where and how did this magical 6000 miles figure emerge?
Not magical :) I do around 12,000 miles a year which is average. So change my oil every 6 months at roughly 6,000 miles.
Lee
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I'm interested in the "3000 revs when engine is cold" thing
At the end of our street, where it meets the main road, there is a sharp turn onto the road, and then to leave town one goes up a steep hill.
When I set off on a journey, it almost always involves going up that hill which, naturally, I approach a) with a cold engine, and b) with no momentum. As I accelerate up the hill from about 15 or 20mph, I pretty well always take it up to 3500 revs before changing up. Am I doing this wrong?
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Leef, we're at cross purposes. Driving off straight away instead of waiting for ten minutes is good; cold idling is bad. I think taking care of things is good; so do you. Time to refill my whisky glass, I think. I'm not interested in confrontation and ad hominem exchanges.
There's no magic number of revs, but we all know that pushing a cold engine is not good, because engines like to be warm. 3000 revs is roughly in the middle of the rev range for most cars and is easily remembered.
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As well as the oil, the pistons, block, head etc all need to reach operating temperature. Aluminium and steel expand at different rates.
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I think to sum up this thread, one should start the car, wait a few seconds - no more that 15 say, and then drive off, not using too many revs, but enough to stop the car labouring. Driving straight onto a fast moving road is no bad thing, as long as the revs are kept to a reasonable level until the car is warm. At 3000rpm, 99% of cars will do at least 60mph, so it no problem keeping up to speed on an A road.
Cars also warm up faster if driven immediately rather than hang around in traffic and going around an estate 'to warm the engine up'. Just get onto the road a get going!
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Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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And your thoughts regarding my steep hill, Espada?
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Leef, we're at cross purposes. Driving off straight away instead of waiting for ten minutes is good; cold idling is bad. I think taking care of things is good; so do you. Time to refill my whisky glass, I think. I'm not interested in confrontation and ad hominem exchanges.
Hi Roger,
My message wasn't meant to be/sound confrontational, apologies if it did. We all have our own opinions, which is what makes these forums so damn good. I'll now refill my glass with a can of RedBull.
Lee
PS touche for the "ad hominem" I actually had to look that one up on google :)
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