With the wife delivering our first child a few months ago, it has become apparent our supermini is no longer adequate for transport.
We need something that can handle a pram plus assorted other luggage, and ideally seat four adults in reasonable comfort. It also needs to be reasonably economical, and reliable.
Some friends have suggested an MPV, but I'm more inclined towards a diesel estate since we need luggage space more than seats.
The main priorities are:
- safe
- reliable
- good storage
- decent legroom
- economical
Two possible estate options that have been suggested are the Toyota Avensis and Skoda Octavia.
Neither the wife nor I is too bothered by badge status. We'd probably prefer to buy new, and then keep it for five or six years.
I'm interested in your views on MPV v estate, and whether the two estates suggested are worth consideration?
|
If you are looking to "ideally seat four adults in reasonable comfort". as well as a baby seat, then this will narrow your choices dramatically!
I would say an MPV would be better at this due to its separate 3 seats, but you may be looking at Zafira type MPV with additional seats as sometimes baby seats by their design, can be as wide, if not wider, than an average adult backside!
|
Oops. Should clarify.
Either parents + child
OR
Four adults and no child.
Apologies.
|
My only comment is that you will have found that lifting children into and out of cars in seats or otherwise is back breaking work and frequently you hit your head on the car body as well.
To avoid this go for a higher car - this means a small MPV. The luggage capacity is still pretty good.
--
Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
|
Are you sure that in the time you intend to keep the car you will not have another baby?
We have an 03 Mondeo 5-door that comfortably swallows two child seats inside and a double buggy in the boot plus luggage.
The only major gripe is that the buggy will not fit length-ways between the wheel arches!! In our Alfa 145 it does! This simplifies packing the boot a lot.
We bought the Mondeo at 1year old. The cost premium and economy of an MPV of similar proportions was prohibitive.
|
With babies, I would always go for MPV.
This is based on the fact, that being higher, with higher seats its much easier to get baby in and out of the car seat.
Dividends also come when child is growing up, higher seat = better view = happier child on trips.
I wish I had had a MPV type vehicle when young RF was baby/growing up.
--
RF - Da DAA. < changes in phone box > Its TOURVAN man
|
|
|
|
|
I would agree with Espada - lifting and putting baby+kit is very hard on back. Look at an MPV - especially as you will be able to put more than one baby seat in mor easily. You may not be planning more but often find you have friend's mini children to transport. Make sure you take pram with you to see how much room it takes up and calculate whether it will take a double buggy if necessary!!
|
Sounds like you need a Scenic. Gives all you are seeking and much easier to get the nipper in and out of the child seat than a conventional car/estate.
Don't be put off by the relability tag. We're on our second Scenic derivative/our third Rennie and have never had any problems over some 160k miles to date.
|
Re relability.
You were extremely lucky. I found the Scenic unreliable, mostly electrical faults.
|
48k miles, 4 years, the sunroof stuck once. Car? Scenic
moosh - you were extremely unlucky, not the other way round,.
--
RF - Da DAA. < changes in phone box > Its TOURVAN man
|
|
December edition of Used Car Buyer had a good article on the Renault Scenic. There's a man near Reading that sells them. The only thing the article pointed to was the automatic gearbox pre year 2000 could be a bit troublesome. Otherwise it got the thumbs up.
|
|
Forgot to mention you could also consider the Picasso. People I have come across seem pleased with them.
|
Thanks for the responses. The feedback on MPVs is very interesting.
Would anyone care to suggest any other options in the MPV department. Also, on the estate side do the two options I suggested sound reasonable or are there better out there?
I think what I'll try to do is arrange a few test drives in MPVs and maybe the estates too, just to be sure.
Should be fun.
|
|
You could also try a Nisan Tino. The people I know who have had them seem v pleased with them
|
For an alternative see the thread entitled 'Touran'.
Sister in Law has a 5 year old son and a Scenic diesel - she has been satisfied with it, this is a company car but she coped with a Punto until 6 months ago.
As soon as our neighbour found out his wife was pregnant they went out and bought a Vectra purely because this is the only car their huge (not yet purchased) three wheeled off road pram/travel system would fit in! Unfortunately his Vectra won't fit in his garage.
We are in a similar position and will have a baby next year - we are buying a pram which will fit in my A3!!
|
|
One of my friends has also recently become a new dad.Due to struggling to fit in a child seat in his car,he last month sold his Ferrari 550 Maranello and has purchased a new Bentley Continental GT !!!!!!.Child seat fits perfectly in the back.Not sure how well the leather will stand up to baby puke though?.
|
|
Another option in the same line as MPV's are van derived cars such as the FIat Doblo ans PSA's Partner Berlingo duo. Sliding doors make getting baby in and out easy. Several of us in here well satisfied with a Berlingo.
|
|
48k miles, 4 years, the sunroof stuck once. Car? Scenic moosh - you were extremely unlucky, not the other way round,. -- RF - Da DAA. < changes in phone box > Its TOURVAN man
I beg to differ...
Funnily enough, all the reliability surveys tend to place Renault towards the bottom of the list...
(or are they all "extremely unlucky" too?!)
|
Agree that surveys are a good indicator so long as a good sample is taken.
However, can only speak as you find and as stated before, 160k miles no probs with the Rennies. By the time I'd done 20k in a new Passat, I'd suffered 2 breakdowns.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
We had a similar choice to make a few years ago. MPV was not an option in Oz but estates (wagons) much more popular there anyway.
I nor my wife found removing the removable part of the rearward facing car seat a problem, but make sure you do a trial fit as not all cars have a long enough rear seat space to fit the car seat in easily and also take an adult front passenger. (We didnt even consider having babyseat in the front and I never would).
We ended up with a subaru Outback for many other reasons as well, but note that its rear seat was slightly raised compared to the front making entrance and exit easier.
The boot was big enough to take a stroller either front to back or sideways.
When we moved back to the UK bought a Volvo V40 at short notice, daughter was bigger (18 months) and in a forward facing seat, no problems getting her in or out, but boot much smaller and stroller would only just fit across the boot.
StarGazer
|
Sparky, Honest John raves about the Ford Focus C-max, so that could be worth a go.
Finances dictate that we remain with our Astra estate for the imminent arrival of BabyBarchetta (19 days and counting). Good job I´m on good terms with my chiropracter.
|
19 days and counting
Babies are like new cars from dealers. They never arrive when promised. Unlike new car dealers they are sometimes early.
----------------------------------------
TourVanMan < yes its RF reborn >
|
|
Crikey. I hope not. Although with my reputation for timekeeping, the chances of it coming out late are pretty high. Mrs B. would prefer an early arrival, unsurprisingly, as she´s the size of a marine mammal at the mo´.
|
barchettaman -
in planning your motoring accessories for the baby, note from www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_g2602/is_0002/a...2 :
The human gestation period--the period of time between conception and labour--is approximately forty weeks (280 days), measured from the first day of the mother's last menstrual period. A gestation period of thirty-eight weeks (266 days) is calculated for women who are pregnant by a procedure such as in vitro fertilization or artificial insemination that allows them to know their exact date of conception.
Due dates for women who conceive naturally are only approximations and are precisely accurate for only one pregnancy out of twenty.
there is also a known approximate relationship between average pre-conception weight of mother and due date of baby.
|
Cheers D. We are aware that the due date is a mere approximation.
It´s all academic really, this countdown to the end of life and sleep as we know it.
Will a bay carrier go on the Barchetta boot rack?
|
|
|
|
I've got a Galaxy - its the most boring, uninspiring, unsporty, mundane thing you can imagine - however with two young children I would not be without it.
It has 7 seats. We keep 5 in the car. Max would be 2 front, 3 middle, 2 back - we have 2F, 2M, 1R.
Not only are the seats higher and easier to get kids into and out of - having two in the middle instead of three means loads of room around them for "stuff" - having one in the back still allows loads of luggage space, but means another seat in case of surprise passengers.
One issue with the Glaaxy is that you cannot really carry seats you're not using, so you kind of need to know how many seats you need before you go out.
The front seats swivel 180 degrees to face backwards for "picnics" or breaks. All the other seats flod flat wiht a table type back to them furthering the picnic effect.
There is enough room within the car for the kids to wander around from seat to sit or window to window when parked and/or waiting somewhere.
They're full of cubby holes and pockets for putting stuff in - in the front, in the middle and in the back.
They have independant air con / heating in the back so you can control the kids temperature separate from your own.
4 adults and 2 kids travel in perfect comfort - that 7th seat can detract from that although 5 kids is ok.
They have kid-seats built into the back seats negating the constant insertion/removal of additional seats.
Don't get the diesel unless you're really worried about the economy - and for goodness sakes don't get the diesel automatic, its a rubbish combination.
I have no bad word to say for it - and since the other vehicles are a Landcruiser and a Merc. SL, believe me I'd get shot of it if I could - its really, really, boring but I wouldn't be without it.
|
Sparky, I am now on my third Scenic and would sing their praises, especially from your angle of carrying baby. The following features are not necessarily only available in the Scenic but they do prove worthwhile:
- Car has 3 individual seats in back, these can all be moved fore and aft, or individually removed. Middle seat can come out and 2 outer seats moved in slightly to give more physical room round the seat. Moving seats can also be useful when trying to clip car seats in or to facilitate an adult sitting next to the child seat.
- It has plenty of hidden cubby holes which are easily accessible. we used to always keep spare nappies, wipes, jar of food etc in one of these just in case we got caught short due to weather, traffic delays etc.
- High seats, as mentioned earlier, are much easier to access for removal / fitting of car seats and child gets better views out the window,
- Boot is a good big square shape, not long and shallow that you might find in some cars, so any shape of pram should fit in.
Also, you can lie baby in it to change their nappy!
- If you go for the latest shape Scenic, the passenger seat folds flat. This is ideal if needing space to prepare baby bottle etc. Also, if only you and baby in car, you can leave seat flat and baby gets a good view (assuming forward facing) and you can have reasonably easy access to baby without being a contorsionist!
The only thing I would be wary on, is with it having 3 individual seats, if you get a big baby seat it might not fit as the seats have a moulded shape. But any decent shop would let you take one out and try it.
If you don't mind the bland image and looks, I would also recommend a Berlingo / Kangoo type of vehicle due to the sliding doors. You will soon learn how difficult it can be getting baby into seat whilst door can only open half way due to the car parked next to you!
Good luck and let us know what you decide on!
|
Two very good points...
>>you can lie baby in it to change their nappy
>>Berlingo / Kangoo type of vehicle due to the sliding doors.
|
Try a Berlingo - I know it's van derived and has little street cred etc but they are comfotable, practical, HDi engine is a good'un, sliding doors, 3 proper seats in back (with those Isofix thingys,) big boot that will take buggy plus loads extra, Modutop provides loads of storage for all those extra baby things you need - and they are relatively cheap! Even Clarkson liked them!(oops, last might put you off!)
Phil
|
|
Berlingo looks good value new, but seems to hold its value rather too well to be an attractive s/h buy.
|
well, when i was due for a car change and child no 1 was due I bought a Hyundai Terracan - go anywhere, can stack it full of shopping, child, wife, dog and still have space!
Admittedly not that economical at 27mpg avg - and my fuel bill runs to about £350pcm!!
|
|
|
"seems to hold its value rather too well to be an attractive s/h buy"
I'm glad to hear it - first nearly new car I've ever bought - though I have benefitted from the rapid depreciation of BXs and Xantias in the past by buying 3 yr old ones!
Can't wait for the C6 to lose 50% of its value in 1 year!!
Phil
|
|
|
|
|
|
Finally nice to see someone put in a good word about the Galaxy. I agree with all you say, good and bad, and could not be without ours. For versatility and practicality it can't be beaten - it covers all bases. We have 3 kids, a dog, regular visits to/by Grandparents. It copes with any of these scenarios. SWMBO is also an avid fan of all the DIY/makeover programs so you can guess how I spend most of my weekends - when required, take out the seats and you've got a mini Transit for all those trips to B&Q and the tip.
|
|
At the auction the other day, a Berlingo Multispace 1868cc diesel (think thats the non HDi one?), with 19,379 miles went for 3810. It was Nov 02 and direct from Motability.
|
|
The 1868 diesel is an IDI unit derived from the XUD, but with some electronic control of injection, presumably to meet emission standards. Won't win any grand prix and needs the gearbox stirring when laden/climbing, but it's quite happy at eighty all day on the Autoroute and at a steady 3000rpm (about 65mph in top) it's downright relaxed. Breeze block aerodynamics mean consumption suffers at higher speeds, but the 3000rpm trick gives 50+ to the gallon in the cruise.
|
|
|
|
We have a picasso at the moment which we are just about to change, but it has been excelent with 2 small kids, and it has 3 full size rear seats so you can get 3 child seat in if you need to. We also have a huge off road style double puschair and that fits in the boot pretty easily. We have clocked up 40K in 2.5 years in our - its been to France 4 times, and other than servicing and a few tyres I have not spent anthing on it, although the brake pads are almost out now. It has not been faultless, but the few things that have gone wrong have not left me stranded on the road side, and have been fixed under warranty. If it wasnt for the arrival of number 3 plus the need to transport the first 2's friends then we would be keeping it.
We are considering a Galaxy / Alhambra / Sharan, and at the monet the Sharan wins on price. The spec is a bit better than the Galaxy, and the price is largly the same - I have seen some pre reg / up to 12 month models on the VW used car site for about 13995 which I think is cracking value - the Galaxy's looked to be slightly more. The other reason to lean towards the Sharan is the possible lower depreciation plus the fact that all the running gear in the three models is VW so warranty / repair should be easier - I have heard of people with Galaxy's struggling with Ford repairs due to VW not wanting to give to much away.
|
|
|
|
|
Babies.
A desperately bad bargain:
- 9-month waiting list.
- Only 2 models and you can't choose which.
- No warranty....
- ....and they go wrong.
Why *did* we have 4 of them?
|
"Why *did* we have 4 of them?"
same reason we had a "Cars you adored despite problems" thread here a few days ago?????
Phil
|
|
|
|
