Adam,
well, either (A)to avoid the route or (B) to try it out.
Nutty,
Its a volvo, despite claims to the contrary they still dont handle.
(And I'm a v70 owner).
Iirc there is a list of suspension problems on the s80/v70/s60. Certainly the drop links go, and I think there are issues with bushes.
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Iirc there is a list of suspension problems on the s80/v70/s60. Certainly the drop links go, and I think there are issues with bushes.
That's right. You'll need a box full of bushes and half a day's labour to replace them all.
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Ah, but your Ebay banger was a Primera, wasn't it? They really do handle well, even at high mileage. I've seen a few of these Volvos with well worn suspension - that'll be the problem. Long term owners tend not to notice how bad they get because they're driving the car every day and 'adjust' to it. I never like driving old Omegas either - they always feel very twitchy and 'unglued' on corners.
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Can't believe how tight the Primera was despite having rusty control arms and being 10 years old. It's sold now for just 30 quid. Heavy depreciation in just 7 weeks from 160 to 30!
Regarding driving down country lanes at 65mph, my route actually involves a mix of country lanes and straight A roads. I wasn't truthful earlier, I would get up to 65mph on the long straights, and 40-50 max on the country lanes. However, this Volvo has to stay closer to 30 as it's jumping around all over the road, if there is any imperfection in the road (which covers most roads).
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Aprilia,
So you reckon it's likely to be as simple as some bushes to fix on my car? It's at a Volvo dealer right now being inspected.
Is it worth pushing for a full refund or do I just accept it being fixed up? IMHO, a car that's got faults so soon after purchase, is likely to have all sorts of issues during the course of ownership.
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It seems to me that the bushes are known faults on the S80 or at least from what everyone else has said.
Do you like the car? I've always found the S80 quite a nice looker for such a big car. It would seem a shame if you had a goodun' but got rid after a relatively minor fault.
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It seems to me that the bushes are known faults on the S80 or at least from what everyone else has said. Do you like the car? I've always found the S80 quite a nice looker for such a big car. It would seem a shame if you had a goodun' but got rid after a relatively minor fault.
Yes, apart from the roadholding problems I like the car. I assume since it's been owned by a national leasing company since new, maintainance would not have been skipped.
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Mark99,
How often do these bushes on Volvos wear out? Is it something I'm gonna have to change every year?
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Without the opportunity to actually drive the car it is difficult to offer anything other than conjecture. The Volvo S80 has lots of fairly large rubber bushes in its suspension and they do become compliant as the miles rack up. What is happening is that you are getting excessive lateral deflection of the suspension when in a corner. This changes the toe angles (esp the rear toe angle) making the car feel a bit unstable. This is what makes older cars feels less secure on the road. Coupled with some deterioration in damper performance, a little wear in the rack etc. it all leads to that 'high mileage' feel.
The P11 Primera has quite a sophiticated suspension set-up that keeps the tyre perpendicular to the road and maintains the rear toe when sideways forces are applied. The only weak spot is the wear in the front upper link bushes - but QH now sell replacement upper links for about £25 and they're a doddle to fit.
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Let's simplify things a little. First of all did you check that the tyre pressures were OK ? Secondly, you said it looked like it had new tyres all round, how many miles since the new tyres were fitted ? they need a good 200-400 miles to bed in. Also are the tyres a reputable brand.
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Yep, all tyres are at the recommended pressure and are the right size. Three are Pirelli P6000, one is Firestone. According to the history, Firestone tire was put on in April. Others put on last year. Don't get me wrong, on a perfectly smooth road, the car drives ok. Introduce any kind of bump, corner, ridge or rough surface into the equation and the car's roadholding becomes all over the place.
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Volvo have called back and told me they can't find anything wrong. Perhaps I got used to the Primera's handling and ride? I dunno. I asked them to double check the bushes again before they write a final report.
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I stand corrected. Driveshafts need modifying, rear sway bushes to be replaced, front top strut bearing, 4 wheel alignment and all wheels to be balanced. Cost of 800 odd quid.
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Dad has had a 1998 S80 2.4 since new. It rides nicely but driving it (i.e with gusto) is like taking part in a video game; detached is the word.
In contrast my 2003 V70 with 17" wheels and the sports and self levelling suspension is much more glued to the road but at the expense of a firmer ride, though it is still to some degree inert and is no flickable Lotus Elise. Once learned it can still be hustled though, and outright grip is superb (Eagle GSD3 F1 equipped at present).
When it comes to bushes, hardly a year goes by without Dad replacing at least one front bush on his S80. Drop links are the favourite as already mentioned. THe first bush replacement was inside the first year from new and he also had a related warranty recall. No rear bushes have failed yet. However, I have not replaced any on my V70 despite the potentially greater hammering from stiffer suspension and lower profile tyres, and tyre wear has been and remains perfect; rotated half way through their life, the OEM P6000s wore out exactly together and with perfectly even wear across each carcass. My brother has not replaced any bushes on his 2003 V70 D5 auto either so perhaps the rumours that 2003+ S60/V70/S80s don't suffer abnormal bush wear is correct.
Hope you get yours sorted.
The S80 is a great luxo barge.
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Where do you live, Nutty Nissan?
I have personal good experience from the Volvo independent HLM in Bromsgrove (web site www.volvotuning.co.uk ) and know others who speak with very high praise about another Volvo independent Phil Whitaker cars in Slough (web site www.pwcars.co.uk ). In both cases workmanship is top notch (and OEM parts often used) but without the Volvo hourly labour rates that were recently shown to be the highest of all mainstream dealers.
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I've rejected the car under sale of goods act, and have asked for a refund. Let's see whether they respond. The letter is also going to BBC Watchdog, my local trading standards and citizen's advice bureax.
I'll prob get a 1 year old Mondeo TDCi now!
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I'll prob get a 1 year old Mondeo TDCi now!
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You could do a lot worse, my 2002 TDCi Ghia X still drives as new at 97k miles, great handling and feedback, rewarding to drive.
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I've rejected the car under sale of goods act, and have asked for a refund. Let's see whether they respond. The letter is also going to BBC Watchdog, my local trading standards and citizen's advice bureax. I'll prob get a 1 year old Mondeo TDCi now!
Why go to all the usual sources of PITA now when you haven't given the dealer a chance to respond? The likes of watchdog (shudder)should be a last resort if problems can't be fixed. By going in all-guns blazing you are likely to put the dealers back up rather than get a sympathetic hearing.
As for rejecting the car, have you spoken to the dealer and informed them of this and made arrangements to immediately return the car and cease to use it? Because if you've just popped a letter in the post and continue driving around in the car you haven't rejected it.
If you think it's acceptable to continue driving the "rejected "car for your convenience, there's also the small matter of whether the car is roadworthy with the faults you list. You need to establish if the car is safe to drive.
The sale of goods act allows a retailer to take reasonable steps to resolve matters. You haven't given the dealer the chance to cary out the repairs.
I can understand your frustration and disappointment that your new car hasn't proved to be quite what you expected, I've been there myself, but you need to take a deep breath before firing off missives to all and sundry.
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Why go to all the usual sources of PITA now when you haven't given the dealer a chance to respond? The likes of watchdog (shudder)should be a last resort if problems can't be fixed. By going in all-guns blazing you are likely to put the dealers back up rather than get a sympathetic hearing. As for rejecting the car, have you spoken to the dealer and informed them of this and made arrangements to immediately return the car and cease to use it? Because if you've just popped a letter in the post and continue driving around in the car you haven't rejected it. If you think it's acceptable to continue driving the "rejected "car for your convenience, there's also the small matter of whether the car is roadworthy with the faults you list. You need to establish if the car is safe to drive. The sale of goods act allows a retailer to take reasonable steps to resolve matters. You haven't given the dealer the chance to cary out the repairs. I can understand your frustration and disappointment that your new car hasn't proved to be quite what you expected, I've been there myself, but you need to take a deep breath before firing off missives to all and sundry.
I've informed them by phone and fax of my rejection now that the report has come through from Volvo. I've told them the car is out of use (I'm hiring a car for 3 days), and they are welcome to pick it up any time. Since it's only been 1 week, the law entitles me to reject it. I don't have to have it repaired if I don't want it since it's defective.
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But there's a world of difference between something that's 'defective' and something on which normal wear and tear items need replacement.
If handled differently and with an amicable agreement to replace the worn out items, you may have ended up with a peach of a motor.
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I've informed them by phone and fax of my rejection now that the report has come through from Volvo. I've told them the car is out of use (I'm hiring a car for 3 days), and they are welcome to pick it up any time. Since it's only been 1 week, the law entitles me to reject it. I don't have to have it repaired if I don't want it since it's defective.
Excellent job. You'd be surprised how many people reject but keep using. Sorry for jumping to conclusions there.
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The sale of goods act allows a retailer to take reasonable steps to resolve matters. You haven't given the dealer the chance to cary out the repairs.
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not in all cases. see
summary: www.dti.gov.uk/ccp/topics1/guide/saleshort.pdf
full: www.dti.gov.uk/ccp/topics1/saleandsupply.htm
Remedies
If a product that was faulty at the time of sale is returned to the retailer, the consumer is legally entitled to:
? a full refund, if this is within a reasonable time of the sale (?reasonable time? is not defined in law but is often quite short); or
? a reasonable amount of compensation (or ?damages?) for up to six years from the date of sale (five years after discovery of the problem in Scotland).
....
Under the Regulations, consumers can choose to request instead:
? a repair or replacement.
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>>I never like driving old Omegas either - they always feel very twitchy and 'unglued' on corners.
Fair point; the 94 Omega I've just pensioned off handled like a drunken hippo on roller skates, the 95 one I've replaced it with has just had the lower suspension control arms & dual layer bushes replaced, and is much better, relatively speaking at least.
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Nutty Nissan,i will be very intrested to hear how you get on rejecting the car,you dont seem to have given the dealer an opportunity to fix the car,unless of course Marks&Spencer have recently started trading in used cars and are quite happy to take it back.
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you dont seem to have given the dealer an opportunity to fix the car,
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it is not necessary to give dealer that opportunity; see
www.dti.gov.uk/ccp/topics1/saleandsupply.htm
Under the Sale of Goods Act 1979 traders must sell goods that are as described and of satisfactory quality.
If consumers discover that products do not meet these requirements they can reject them and ask for their money back providing they do so quickly. Alternatively, they can request a repair or replacement or claim compensation.
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I had a Volvo S80 2.9 for 18 months - great car but had a very crashy ride and would not go so fast over windy roads. Suspect nothing wrong with the car, other than its not a Primera.
--
Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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To be honest there doesn't sound a lot wrong with it other than fair wear and tear. I doubt that any other 80k+ S80 would come out any better. The strut top mount is the only 'fault'. Rear stabiliser bushes are par for the course at this sort of mileage. Driveshaft mod is from a Volvo TSB, I suspect, and alignment and balance is normal after suspension work.
I think the honest truth is that an S80 is not the car for you (I don't rate them much either). I don't know what you paid for the car, but an 80k mile S80 at book retail price is not my idea of used car value. A newer Mondeo or Mazda6 would probably be more to your taste.
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Well, the car was definitely unstable to drive on bends, at well within normal speed limits. I took my sister out in it, and she felt the back swing out a bit.
Fair enough, it may be wear and tear for 80k miles, but the supermarket advertises quality cars blah blah blah, it's not like I'm buying from auction where I expect to spend some money fixing it up. If the bushes are worn, they should have stated it when selling it. Plus, the test drive they allow you is 5 minutes round the block where you can't get past more than 30mph on urban roads, so hard to tell what might be wrong.
Trading Standards told me I'm entitled to reject it since it had only been a week since I had it.
Anyway, within 10 minutes of the fax going through telling them I have rejected the car, they called to say I can have a refund, as long as I bring the car back immediately, which I did. They also refunded the cost of getting it inspected it at Volvo.
They did so with no fuss, and the after sales man was very nice indeed. However, there was a queue of dissatisfied customers who had bought nearly new cars from them (albeit with highish mileage) who were demanding refunds, but alas, they were unsure of the law. Most of the folks had allowed the supermarket to repair the car early on, not realising that they could have rejected the car within the first 28 days (1000 miles).
Thanks for the comments and advice. You are probably right that the S80 is just not the kind of car I actually want.
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Thanks for updating us. Keep us posted on your next car purchase?
$$
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