The new issue of the IAM mag has some info on use of cars in private/supermarket car parks. As this has come up here before I thought it worth sharing.
They say the law is complex and give some examples:
Although road signs do not have the same authority as signs on the highway, and cannot be enforced under highway law, evidence of contravention of a sign in a private car park could be used in support of a prosecution for, say, careless driving.
A driving licence or MOT is NOT required in a supermarket car park as it is not a road
Motor insurance IS required as it is a public place
A vehicle excise licence is NOT required as the road is not repairable at public expense
If an accident occurs the same obligations to stop and exchange details apply as on a road
Rules relating to drink or drugs and driving are the same as on a road
a driver could be prosecuted for dangerous or careless driving but could not be prosecuted for using a mobile phone while driving
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A vehicle excise licence is NOT required as the road is not repairable at public expense
So that would apply to toll roads and bridges, and public car parks where the parking charges cover the maintenance costs?
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This particular legislation applying to private/off-road areas which are regularly used by the public such as supermarket car parks came into force about 12 years ago.
The basic premise was that drivers were not immune from prosecution if they were involved in more serious types of offences whilst on such land.
I used to have a book detailing the legislation but, unfortunately, have mislaid it.
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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The big problem is Smokie is that to get to your public place I am 100% sure that you will drive on A ROAD to get there.
Gottcha.....
DVD
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a driver could be prosecuted for dangerous or careless driving but could not be prosecuted for using a mobile phone while driving
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Using a mobile phone whilst driving is not dangerous or careless? If it is not safe (which it isn't), it must be one of the above.
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I would just like for someone to clarify something for me which relates to this.
My ex has, in my opinion, very recklessly given my son lessons in a carpark at the age of about 13/14.
Obviously there was no driving license, and I'm pretty sure no insurance - surely not for someone underage? Can insurance be obtained for someone under 17? And were they therefore commiting a criminal offence?
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If the car park was one to which the public have access then he must be insured, and unless he managed to obtain cover for a fourteen year old (unlikely) they were comitting an offence.
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Using supermarket car parks for driving lessons used to be widespread - the difficulties have arisen because so many are now open 24 hours a day.
My local Tesco Extra always has quite a number of cars parked even in the early hours of the morning. It's amazing just how many people do their shopping at such times of the day, although some of the vehicles belong to the staff and overnight shelf fillers.
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What\'s for you won\'t pass you by
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Thanks for that, Tom, and Stu (hope you don't mind me calling you that, it is time for me to start rambling).
Really hard to know whether to confront ex, or not. All my insides tell me to say something. Sorry, gonna leave it there because I seriously do not know what to do.
Night night all xxx
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HF - what kind of car park? If he had permission from the landowner, and it was closed, then there's no legal issue, although obviously you have your own parenting concerns. If it's a public car park then you do have legal issues that arise (i.e., use of the car on the road with no insurance and no licence) but of course the same risk of personal injury to your child.
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Look at your Certificate of Insurance HF.
Is there not a clause in it which states that the Insurance is only valid provided the driver:
holds or has held a Driving Licence. ?
As far as I am aware this is standard throughout so as a 14 yr old cannot get a Driving licence he will not be covered.
The Car Park episode is fraught with danger and could lead to Button Jnr being taken to Juvenile Court for being in breach of driving licence conditions (used to be drive disq by reason of age) and No Insurance. Person with him may end up at adult Court for aid abet.
Seek out a friendly farmer to use one of his private flat fields and for this maybe a broken could arrange cover.
DVD
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A car mad mate has been nurturing his interest in his son since he was a nipper. At 14 they bought a Beetle to do up. He also starting driving, in legal places.
However this clearly wasn't enough for the lad, at 15 he was pressuring his father immensely to let him drive on the road and at 16 he was doing so, without consent and illegally.
So in that respect I think teaching the skills too early can have a negative effect.
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