Also agree entirely but to say that Renault also own Nissan, which is where some of their profit comes from. Where as Renaults are characterful cars, sometime quirky though full of personality, Nissans are generally boringly antiseptic in nature, the complete opposite, perhaps the success is down to appealing to all tastes.
Re Renault being state owned, they are one of the few succesful nationalised companies in Europe, take the airlines in comparison. BA as PLC now contributes many times the income to the state in taxes that it ever did when it was nationalised, on the other hand state owned Air France is a drain on the French government. In the telecoms industry it is the same story.
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>>Nissans are generally boringly antiseptic in nature
I don't think you can accuse the designers of either the current Primera or the Micra of being unadventurous. They may not have got it right, but they did make a statement...(I agree that past cars have been indifferent in style, but then look at some past Renaults).
Splodgeface
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I don't think you can accuse the designers of either the current Primera or the Micra of being unadventurous.
Agree re Micra though it is the way they drive as much as the way they look, the general impression one gets, the overall experience.
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Carlos Ghosn Renault CEO said last night the priority was style and design. He is right - It sells cars.
Renault have been good at creating market. The Scenic, the Espace, ok some failures like Aventime, but they are not frightened to inovate.
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Nissan sell by the bucketload (as does their Lexus-equivalent, Acura) in the US and Canada, as witnessed on a recent biz trip to Montreal. Great looking things too, the Acuras, they should bring ´em over to Europe.
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Isn't Acura an off-shoot of Honda, and Infiniti is Nissan's luxury arm?
Style/looks is important yeah, but my priority is reliability, which is why I'd never buy a Renault, Peugeot etc.
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Surely it's hardly very patriotic at the moment to own a French car? ;+)
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No such thing as Patriotic anymore!
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I totally agree with the innovation and design flair. It's one of the reasons why I buy Renault. I hope the company continue with this. They seem to have taken over from where Citroen left off, although the new C4 would show that Citroen have returned to the fold.
I bought my Megane for two reasons, firstly I've had three previous Renaults and a few little things apart, have been very pleased with them. Secondly, I love the styling and all the gadgets they provide. My previous Renault was a Laguna V6, a real Q car and I did 180K in that car. I would have kept it on but the fuel bills were getting a bit steep. Did that thing shift though...
The other point worth noting is that with New Megane, I have noticed a huge improvement in overall quality, particularly on the interior where the fit and finish is very good indeed. We also have a VW in our household, the quality difference is much closer than you might think.
No they are not perfect, but few cars, if any, are. I would like Renault to make certain jobs a bit easier to do, such as replacing the front bulbs; and the oil filter is quite well hidden as well.
But overall I'm a pleased owner, I would certainly buy another - but only if they keep pushing the boundaries of conventional design.
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Isn't Acura an off-shoot of Honda, and Infiniti is Nissan's luxury arm?
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Quite right.
Style/looks is important yeah, but my priority is reliability, which is why I'd never buy a Renault, Peugeot etc.
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Wife's '98 Clio is great.
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Had a Laguna 2.0 as company car in 1996 and did 80k miles with no problems. Parted with our own dosh for replacement Scenic and did 75k miles over 4 years again no problems. Replacement Passat Tdi (new) 2 breakdowns in 39k miles.
Conclusion: Don't believe all that you read about reliability.
PS: Just about to order a Grand Scenic.
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"PS: Just about to order a Grand Scenic. "
Hopefully the 1.9 version?
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Hopefully the 1.9 version?>>
Nope, the 1.6. Admittedly it's a bit gutless but test drove one over 5 days and we think it will do the job. Plan is for this to become the MrsS motor/family runner allowing me to look for something more male menopausal.
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The 1.6 is the Megane is fine, fun to drive, crisp and free revving though it will have much more weight to carry around in the Grand Scenic, a 1.9 or 1.5 (100) DCi might be better as well as more economical.
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Oops, sorry, got my Infinitis and Acuras muddled up!
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That's how they gained market share in the first place R5, R16 were selling well and it took until 77 for Ford to produce the Fiesta and even longer for BL to make the Metro. R16 was a great car for its day.
One of the most important cars for them was the R18, because it gave them access to the company car market.
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One of the most important cars for them was the R18, because it gave them access to the company car market.
Or where I lived, the Taxi and Private Hire Market!
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And from my experience it helped the rust treatment people and Isopon filler lot!! Never mind, the old R18 got us to Greece and back towing a caravan a couple of times and also helped us to enjoy the experience of being towed by a French fire engine (caravan towed by a friendly car driver) to a local garage for a major overhaul of the caburettor for which we were charged ...................a bottle of beer!!
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Please note British public is equally devoted to inhouse manufactured cars. At least 60% of cars on British roads are Vauxhalls and Fords, both produced on the island. Rover had to go not because Brits don't care for domestic cars, but because they were of ancient design and unrealistically priced at that.
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Please note British public is equally devoted to inhouse manufactured cars. At least 60% of cars on British roads are Vauxhalls and Fords, both produced on the island. Rover had to go not because Brits don't care for domestic cars, but because they were of ancient design and unrealistically priced at that.
Your stats are about as good as your talking about KIA specification by looking at the pictures. Ford and Vauxhall have less than 30% of the UK market, no Ford badged car is made in the UK and very few Vauxhalls. Only Jaguars, Land Rovers, Transit vans and engines are made here by the Ford Motor Company.
To keep on topic, Renault have done very well in the last few years in the UK, seems that many people like the looks and prices, they are 3rd best brand have Ford and Vauxhall so they must be doing something right.
It doesn't really made where a car is made, if it looks right and has good price people will buy it.
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The UK is probably the least "devoted to home built brands" market in the world.
Where did the japanese firsy ship cars too? The UK. Where did VW first ship beetles to? The UK.
Anyone wants to export cars, the UK is the first and easiest market to crack. Why?
Because for years we were fed terrible terrible dross from the likes of austin/bmc/BL/and laterly austin rover.
Tha is why Rover has gone, Ford & Vauxhall have pulled uk manufacturing. Dont matter where its made, if its good enough, if its interesting enough, if its loaded with goodies, the uk public will buy it.
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> Your stats are about as good as your talking about KIA
> specification by looking at the pictures. Ford and Vauxhall
> have less than 30% of the UK market, no Ford badged car is made
> in the UK and very few Vauxhalls. Only Jaguars, Land Rovers,
> Transit vans and engines are made here by the Ford Motor Company.
Nice. How long have you kept that Kia oneliner loaded and ready? Hehe.
Well, just like I was right about Kia, Carla, forget what new car sales stats say and look beyond Renault's claims that their Megane is selling better than Focus - go to the nearest supermarket parking lot and look at your little motorised Britian - between old Escorts, Fiestas, Focii, Mondeos, Transits, Astras and Vectras there is astonishingly little space for anything else. Doesn't matter if they're now produced elsewhere. Concept and perception remains.
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go to thenearest supermarket parking lot and look at your little motorised Britian - between old Escorts, Fiestas, Focii, Mondeos, Transits, Astras and Vectras there is astonishingly little space for anything else. Doesn't matter if they're now produced elsewhere. Concept and perception remains.
Sorry to butt in, but i can't agree that Ford and Vauxhall still predominate the road, although of course it may depend where you are in the country.
Quick look out my front window reveals...
2 x Renault Espace
1 x Skoda Favorit
1 x Fiat Croma
1 x Citroen C3
1 x Rover 214
and
1 x Vauxhall Frontera
1 x Ford Escort
Day to day, i see as many Renaults, Hondas and Toyota's as Fords and Vauxhalls.
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out of interest, out of my window I can see 10 cars parked in the village including 2 vauxhalls and 2 Fords.
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out of interest, out of my window I can see 10 cars parked in the village including 2 vauxhalls and 2 Fords.
Out of my window, I can't see to the end of the drive..........
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Out of my window I can see two cars, both Renaults. Therefore 100% of the cars on the road are French
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> Day to day, i see as many Renaults, Hondas and Toyota's as Fords
> and Vauxhalls.
Just for the record, here are the SMMT sales figures for Jan-May this year:
Ford 14.8%
Vauxhall 13.7%
Renault 7.4%
Volkswagen 7%
Peugeot 6%
Toyota 5.2%
Honda 4.1%
Citroen 4.1%
Skoda and Seat are way down on < 1.5%
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We are still talking new cars. That's not the whole picture. Using the same source - SMMT - some stats for whole 2004. 10 most often purchased used cars in 2004:
1. Ford Escort MK4 536,329
2. Ford Focus 427,094
3. Ford Mondeo (CDW27/162) 417,188
4. Ford Fiesta MK3 399,402
5.Vauxhall Vectra 271,422
6.Vauxhall Cavalier MK3 249,468
7.Vauxhall Astra MK4 240,931
8. Ford Fiesta MK4 218,738
9.Vauxhall Astra MK3 213,032
10.Vauxhall Corsa 184,643
Please note the used market pattern emerging from the figures above. Let's compare it now to best selling new car that year - Ford Focus - 141,021 cars sold in 2004. Same year - over half a million old Escorts changed hands. Used market top 10 belongs entirely to Ford and Vauxhall and every year of this decade roughly 1/3rd of newly registered cars were made by those two makers as well.
Dagenham Motors and Network Q. That's where most Brits go to buy cars...
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Out of my front window I can see a Toyota, two Renaults, a Ford, a Land Rover, a Massey Ferguson and two John Deeres.
Re my earlier comments about Nissan, the 350z is one exception, I could live with one of those on the drive next to a Scenic, C-Max or (new) Focus estate. To me though the 350z would have more appeal if it had a Renault badge.
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The 350Z is a lovely looking car and by all accounts a great drive. How could you possibly let a badge get in the way of that? For me it would be the other way around - I am more likely to buy a Nissan 350Z than a Renault 350Z due to reliability reputation.
--
Mattster
Boycott shoddy build and reliability.
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The 350Z is a lovely looking car and by all accounts a great drive. How could you possibly let a badge get in the way of that? >>
Nissan = antiseptic character, bland nature, boring.
Renault = chic, charaterful, inspiring, innovative.
I honestly would rather drive a car that had the odd relaibility blip though was fun and charaterful than a boring box that never went wrong.
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> Renault = chic, charaterful, inspiring, innovative.
Inspiring? Innovative? Never thought of them otherwise than as highly unreliable, daft looking and of weird design. If you said "quirky" then maybe, but "characterful"? I don't think so...
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Thats the beauty of opinions!
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opinions are like bottoms - everyones got one.
the clean version
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"Quick look out my front window reveals..."
zulus. thousands of em.
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would that be Zulu XL's or Zulu GTI's?
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