Having promised daughter a pony next year (mad!), I'm thinking I may have to do some towing....
I can borrow a 4x4 and trailer for when the horse isn't liveried, but I'm thinking if I do want to move the pony (bear in mind a pony isn't the weight of a big horse) with trailer, would a good 4wd car do ? I'm thinking along the lines of the Passat 130tdi 4Motion four wheel drive, rather than a Subaru (need a diesel).
Presumably, roads won't be such an issue as fields, especially wet, I expect !
Can you get good off-road, or at least dual-use, tyres for cars ?
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I'd say a car would cope OK - assuming a decent (single) horse trailer is around 1000Kg (unladen) plus lets say 300Kg for your pony, the weight isn't going to be a huge issue.
You don't need to tow the trailer across muddy fields - just ride the pony across them! ;-)
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I'm not convinced that a 4WD drive car has that much of an advantage over a rear wheel drive 2WD car when towing across a field. Normal road tyres don't offer that much traction on wet grass.
What is worth considering is the ground clearance, the all up weight of the towed trailer, and the weight of the towing vehicle. With 1300kg trailer weight inc pony, you'd need to make sure that your vehicle is > 1900 kg - (trailer weight must not >70% of vehicle weight). An Ifor Williams HB505 weighs 905 kg, and a 13.2" pony about 300-330 kg.
Don't bother with single horse trailers - no 2nd H market for them, and they are not as stable to tow.
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-(trailer weight must not >70% of vehicle weight).
That's a recommendation, not a rule. The only rule is that the total train weight must not exceed the figure stated on the car somewhere.
Don't bother with single horse trailers - no 2nd H market for them, and they are not as stable to tow.
Unless cheap for that very reason.
If you are only going to be doing it very occasionally, and not very far, I'd have thought an ordinary big car would do.
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Agree with comments regarding a single box. Also some horses plain refuse to get into them. A double also gives the flexibility for when darling sprog wants her friend to go somewhere as well.
Many folk do tow with Passats but I personaly refuse with anything less than a chunky 4x4. If you consider the weight of any laden horse box you are pushing it and if you get a fancy one with a front ramp for easy unloading you are well over the limit.
Also consider the ammount of shavings, hay etc that will be trampled through the car... much more befitting of a 4x4 than a nice passat.
Don't get me wrong I have lots of good experiences in the field (no pun intended) but you can say goodbye to keeping your car nice, so you may as well bite the bullet and go 4x4.
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What you really need, of course, is a Subaru Legacy diesel estate. Shame they don't exist.
Failing that, a Nissan X-Trail diesel is an excellent compromise for this purpose, being car-like to drive, spacious, practical, economical and having all the towing ability you need.
Very strong residuals, too.
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Audi Allroad diesel perhaps?
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Max towing weight for the MY99 Legacy/Outback was 1400Kg, so fully laden horse box is pushing it a little. Agree it is a shame that Subaru lost the diesel from the Legacy range a long time ago.
StarGazer
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Question for Stargazer. When was there a Legacy diesel? HJ
HJ
I am sorry to admit that I was wrong but with mitigating circumstances! I have in front of me an australian car magazine from about 1998 which I bought as I was about to buy a Subaru Outback. It had an article on buying and running old Subarus of which there are a great many in Oz. There is a table of models from the 1600 and 1800 4WD, Brumby, throught to the original Legacy DL which it states is a diesel now discontinued. I assumed that this was correct and that the journalist had done some homework....sadly I didnt do mine all that thoroughly as I was interested in a much more recent car. The DL is in fact a petrol engine.
However while searching this out this afternoon I found so many incorrect websites....fancy a Justy 1.3 multipoint diesel? There is one on a spanish website!
Lots of rumours of development work for an upcoming Subaru Diesel though.
Apologies again for incorrect info.
StarGazer
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Aren't Subaru owned/part owned by GM now?
IIRC they were doing some work for SAAB on a 4WD 9-3 model. If they are part GM, perhaps it's only a matter of time before a GM diesel is offered in a Subaru car?
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"If they are part GM, perhaps it's only a matter of time before a GM diesel is offered in a Subaru car?"
I was reading somewhere that the problem is the shallow engine bay in many Subarus, a conventional engine won't fit. To design a flat-four diesel was considered too costly.
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Go for a 4x4, they are mostly designed for this.
If you get a Passat, try for a manual as although maufacturers say the car can pull it I don't think it does autos a power of good.
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If you would consider a proper 4x4, theres always the Nissan Terrano II with the 2.7 diesel engine. These can probably be picked up relatively cheaply nowadays, and would be ideal for a horsebox. You haven't mentioned a budget by the way!
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Nah - only vehicle for towing a horse trailer is a soft-top SWB Series 1/2 Land Rover.
Seriously, a well maintained Defender is realistic to buy, would find the job easy, and only needs washing before you sell it in 10 years time.
Discos are cheap, but for a reason, but they can tow up to 3500kg
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hmmm, well the Audi Allroad diesel is an option.. not cheap even s/h though.. although I'm thinking if I can get a Defender cheap enough just to keep it for this sort of thing... where's the cheapest place to buy a Defender from - ex MOD ?
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In your postition I would be thinking of combining uses into one vehicle if I could.
DO you have a 2nd car? If not then your 2nd hand Defender sounds OK if you're not also going to use it for lots of motorway driving. A lot of people around me have a serious off road vehicle and a normal runabout.
If you want something that serves as a good road car as well as a trailer hack, most large RWD cars will be surprisingly good at this, though obviously you will lose the 4WD advantage. You also have the option of a 4WD car, such as the Impreza estate etc.
I have a k reg Discovery that tows very well.
As for the trailer, there are stacks of 2nd hand at good prices but be careful to guard against buying stolen.
Ifor Williams have a register of chassis numbers and owners. You should be able to contact the company to check the correct name and address agaisn the chassis number. If the chassis plate is missing or has been tampered with, walk away.
H
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a defender in reasonable condition wont be good to get,I sold an h reg with rotten chassis and no unbashed panels for £1200 for spares.old discoverys are actually easier to buy as more of them about and cheaper.if its only to tow on the road an old volvo 940 fitted with chunky tyres is a very cheap alternative and a handy second car which apart from fuel should cost little to run.
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meant to add that nordfrost or gislivad are exellent tyres for this job,might be handled in uk by viking tyres,cant remember if theres a web site for them.
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I towed a double box (Ifor Williams HB505) from the South Coast to Carlisle and back last weekend, empty going, one biggish pony on way back with my VW Sharan TDI (115 BHP).
The box is a twin axle setup, tows lovely, no snaking at all.
The journey was fine, managed to keep to 60 MPH for most of the journey, except for steep inclines and when held up by slow moving cars, never a problem with trucks, the truckers were very courteous, just sloooooow cars that caused the problems, espaecially the middle lane hoggers.
HTH
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here's a point - where's the best place to get a tow-bar fitted, and are there different sorts ... ?
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where's the best place to get a tow-bar fitted,
At the rear of the vehicle ;-)
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darn, I was going to push it ....
:-O
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The two main types are fixed and detachable ones. Fixed is your standard towbar and detachable is usually more discrete and the neck of the towbar can be removed when it's not in use. Obviously this is the more expensive option.
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Is it legal to two a double axle trailer or caravan with a car? I thought I read something some years ago which made it law that these had to be towed by a 4X4?
Leon
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There is no restriction on the twin-axle part behind a car. What you do need to take care of is that car + passengers + kit + trailer + horse do not exceed the maximum train weight of the vehicle. (and car + paseengers + kit is less than gross vehicle weight)
If you look on the caravanning websites (or in your handbook) you can check the weights :
For example (grabbing handbooks to hand!)
Renault Master 3.5 Tonne van.
Has Kerb Weight : 1900kg
Max Gross Vehicle Weight : 3500kg
Max Train Weight : 5500kg
(So you can carry 1600kg of kit inc passengers and tow two tonnes!)
But on the other end of the scale
Peugeot 106 xsi
Kerb Weight : 860kg
Max Gross Vehicle Weight : 1300kg
Gross Train Weight : 1800kg
(So can only carry 440kg of passengers and kit, makes one think when you are four up doesn't it?) and tow 500kg.
My guess is that the police will start cracking down on this big time in the near future, as we all start to get wise to the speed cameras. I can name about half a dozen people who have been pulled recently for overloading vans.
James
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