Is it just me or is anyone else frustrated by the propensity for virtually every car magazine to test the 'usual subjects' against each other without putting in an interesting alternative.
I have just ordered a new Volvo S60 and I have tried to find it realistically compared with it's competition. It has a diesel engine widely praised and size / price-wise it should be up against 3 series BMW / C Class Merc / Audi A4 / Jag X-Type. But when we see group tests they only have the four cars above.
Surely it would be good to see the SAAB 9-3, Alfa 156, Honda Accord, even high specced Mondeo's for example thrown into the mix. Having just the 4 main cars tested and not showing the real alternatives is frustrating. OK the BM is probably one of the best driving cars on the road, but is cramped, slow (unless you pay a fortune for the bigger engines) and poorly equipped (again, unless you get the wallet out).
The Volvo is amazingly well specced (Basic 'S' spec has Alloys, Climate Control, Dynamic Stability Control, Fogs, CD etc, etc) as are many alternatives but the general readership don't often see these alternatives. It is just like their concentration on using a disproportionate ammount of pages on £100,000+ cars that sell in tiny tiny numbers............
Maybe I am just turning into a grumpy old man........:0)
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i agree, for instance i think the ignis sport is a great little sports car, but its always slated by the press if mentioned at all, and usually the usual suspects are reviewed time and again in this sector, ive driven a few of the usual suspects and would recommend the ignis sport every time
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You are right. The thing is that if these less well reported cars had a higher profile they would probably sell in larger numbers and also retain their values better. At least if they were reviewed in depth against a wider range of cars rather than being veiwed in isolation, the general public would at least be able to make an informed choice.
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Not unusual to see variations is spec / price between the cars on test as well, so test not truly a level playing field (ie base spec A4 against SE spec 3 series).
In recent monthly magazines annual awards saw the Mazda 6 estate won its class, yet in a group test 2 months earlier came third to Vectra and C5.
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Another common thing is to show photos of SE spec cars with Sat Nav etc when they are apparently testing a base model for example.
It is obvious that this is because of the car the manufacturer would prefer to see pictures of is not the base model and therefore they only have better versions 'available' for the press. It makes me suspect that the car mag does not actually test the basic car so their views could be unjustly biased? I'm not being too cynical am I?
Still, it would be nice to have a test done of some of the less usual suspects.
For example set a price limit of say £20,000 and have 4 or 5 cars of various specs at that price. i.e: is a base spec BMW really a better buying proposition that a top-of-the-range Mondeo / Avensis and consider also that for different customers resale value and it's importance varies.
Yes, of course a Vectra will lose value quicker than a Merc but for a company car driver this is irrelevant as they will probably stick 100k miles on it and get it replaced automatically at 2-3 years.
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Agree with all of the above. In the real world, people look in a more varied way, for example:
Cars from both the Focus and Modeo segmants
Cars from both the "repmobile" and "compact exec" segments
Cars from the executive and off-roader segments
However the thing I find most offensive is that there's a clear winner and that one car must be "top dog". I'll never forget a What Car special a few years ago featuring 3 Series vs. A4 vs. C Class Vs. IS200 - I think the A4 won, but it was pretty evident that they were all good cars and that most people would be delighted with any of them.
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New S60 due out in 2006 - magazines probably consider current one a "bit long in the tooth", despite 2004 update.
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Not as pathetic as the Group Test I read about the Focus Estate.
They tested..
Focus Estate
Astra Estate
Something else
Mazda 6 Estate.
The Mazda6 Estate won becuase it offered more boot space. Well no **** sherlock, of course it did given its a Mondeo class car! If you wanted a Mazda6 you'd be looking at a Mondeo and Vectra not a Focus or Astra.
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You are quite right Michael, I wonder if Mazda leave any 'gifts' in the car when they drop them of for testing?............
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Another one I saw had an SE spec 3 Series against a basic spec (and much cheaper) X-Type and the jag was critised for less equipment.....................
Interestingly I understand that the 3 series was the best selling car in the UK last year (even beating the Focus et al). This must have something to do with all these tests including them at the expense of every other maybe more quirky car........
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Really? They only facelifted it a few months ago and there are hardly any on the roads of the new shape. Still I got such a good price (nearly £5,000 off) and it is so well kitted out I am happy not waiting. Plus it has the Volvo D5 engine rather than one of the Ford engines that seem a bit harsher to me.........
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Always the case. After the launch of the BMW 1 series I read one article that said " the only real competition is the Audi A3" Convienently forgetting that the 147 is obvious competition apart from being cheaper and better spec'd! And the shape apes the 1 series in a lot of angles.
Apparently in a Foreign test the Alfa 147 wiped the floor with the Bimmer. But in the UK it seems to be a German bias, advertising income under danger or badge buyers who have to have their choice reinforced.
See the same thing with Fords test in the Mail on Sunday tested the 155BHP Mondeo ST TDCI and after extolling the virtues of its ballistic performance etc. then said would any pay £ 22K for a Ford. Answer why do they pay more for lesser spec'd Audi, Bimmer, Merc etc! Aside from the fact that the Mondeo is extremely unlikely to sell at list.
The basic reason why I've given up reading Car mags.
Jim
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Quite right Jim.
I read the same article. You can bet your bottom dollar that when they put that great 2.2 diesel engine into the X Type Jag later this year they will not do a back-to-back value test! OK the Jag will be worth more money after a year but you would offset that by buying the Ford at a huge discount in the first place.
I remember seeing Top Gear a couple of years ago where they ran a range of cars arround their test track and timed a lap in each one. The Mondeo beat the 4 wheel drive Jag, the Beemer, the Merc, well, it beat every car there. Nuf said....
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i would think the average backroomer knows more about cars than the average motoring journo?
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Hi,
The top gear test was a 2.0ltr saloon from every company involved in F1, so the Jag was in fact the 2WD 2.0 (2.1 V6), from memory the Mondeo Zetec 2.0 was nearly 2 secs faster than any of the others inc the BMW 318i (2.0) Merc C180k (1.8 supercharged)!
Regards.
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Get on to www.whatcar.com and you can choose any 4 cars for direct comparison.
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Thanks for the tip. I have just had a look and if you do compare it gives an OK result. A full road test side-by-side would still be better but it was interesting to read the readers reviews of the cars in question.
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Update on my comments above - the latest issue of the magazine (Autofacil - Spain) on which I based my comments, now states the S60 change will be in 2008. Given the recent revisions to the car, this makes more sense. Sorry about that.
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To Colin H,
You have set my mind at rest a bit. A change that soon would have worried me!!! :0)
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would love to know how you got £5k off list of S60? What's list - £22k? So you got one for £17k? That's an amazing deal...
Rich
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Hi Rich,
Yep, Getting a S60 D5 S (2.4 TD - 163hp) new, 05 reg (not pre-reg) from a Volvo dealer (a 4 hour train trip away up North!!!!) for £17,100 against the list price of £21,513 + £500 for metallic(saving £4913). Bear in mind this is the new face-lifted 2005 version.
Long story, but involved one of the big 'Online' retailers with whom I initially placed an order. I will give more info when I have the keys in 4 weeks time! Don't want to jeopardise my delivery!
In the meantime, www.motorpoint.co.uk (NOT the company aluded to above) have Volvo D5 S 2.4 TD's with metallic for £16,999, better than my deal but probably needing you to add a bit for registration, etc. I only saw this a few weeks into my order and to be frank the dealer has been marvellous. Worth checking out though.
Check out the spec on the 'S' and you will see why this is such a good deal. Better that the 1999 Mondeo Ghia X I have as, quite frankly, I don't want Leather any more, CD Changer rarely used, Climate on the Volvo better than the Aircon I have and Volvo's image a little better. Saves me £500 a year in Company Car Tax as well! :0)
For a private buyer, the saving on new will also dramatically effect % resale value come trade in time. Who says the BMW 3 series is best?
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Hi,
Agree five grand off a "prestige" saloon like an S60 is a good deal however ref the comparison with a Mondeo, and to put it into perspective as a company car buy, £17000 from a broker can get you a Mondeo Ghia X 2.0 TDCi SIV or 2.2 TDCi SIII in metalic. The former offers comparible on-road performance to the Volvo via more torque (350nm v 340nm) plus a big saving in BIK not to mention MPG, the latter has a stonking 400nm torque and lower CO2 than the Volvo. Both have leather, CD changer, climate etc etc etc.
Regards.
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You are quite right of course.
The thing is that I have a Mondeo Ghia X (2.0 Petrol admittedly), at the moment and want a change. The thing is, if I am completely honest, I want to stand out a bit from the crowd.
How many Mondeos are out there? Tens of Thousands. The Volvo? Well they sold just over 7,000 last year in the UK. I know it will cost more to service but I love it's looks, performance and it is well kitted out. The seats are fab for long journeys (never quite got comfy in the Ford leather seats) .
I agree, the Mondeo is a truly great car but I just fancy something different. And if I can get that in a Volvo for the same price as a Mondeo I think that really is a bargain.
Going back to the subject quickly I saw one of the car mags this month has a test BMW, Audi etc v a Volvo S40! Hang on, that is a class below the Compact exec's and the article even says clearly that Volvo make it clear it is to compete with the Audi A3, BMW 1 Series! Suprise, suprise they critise it for lack of space and boot size.
Is it just me that thinks this is crazy?!
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The only magazine to do what you ask is CAR.
They tested the new A- Class and 1-series against the Focus, C4, Astra and something else (?). The C4 won!
--
Espada III - well if you have a family and need a Lamborghini, what else do you drive?
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According to the forum vvspy.com the S60 will be fitted with a revised V5 engine with 185bhp later this year. They speculate that this engine will be fitted to the XC90 and XC70 first because they are considered underpowered. There is also talk of a six speed gearbox.
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Thanks for the tip Svelte,
Interesting that it looks like mid-2005 there will be 185hp and in 2007 a 225hp version. Sounds like fun. Never mind, 163 will do me fine for now!
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Cheddar: was intersted in the 2.2 torque, but according to my check, the 4 cylinder 2.2 engine has peak of 265 lb ft, which converts to 359 Nm. The Volvo 5-cylinder D5 currently has 251ft lb, or 340 Nm. Not a lot in it really. Or are my figures wrong? its quite possible!
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Nortones2 - I think you will find it has some new fangles 'over-boost' when up and running topping it up by a significant margin.
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