What is life like with your car? Let us know and win £500 in John Lewis vouchers | No thanks
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - DL
Taken from the excellent car-by-car breakdown section of this most excellent site.....

\"Spate of conrod failures on 1997-1998 R and S reg 1.9 XUTD diesels; one case of a late reg T: too many to attribute merely to running with low oil levels. Seems only to affect cars built from April 1997 with DHY (not DHX) serial number engines.\"


Please see the pics here ~ groups.msn.com/honestjohn/interestingshots.msnw?Pa...2


Exactly what we were faced with on Monday morning from the engine bay of a T registered 306 Turbo Diesel.

The pictures speak for themselves. Only way out is another engine.
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Andrew-T
DL - a 305 (sic)?
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - dieselhead
Just wonder if these conrod failures have all been caused by poor maintenance by the vehicle owners (missed oil changes) and not any manufacturing fault.
All DHY engines built after 96 are fitted with exhaust gas recirculation which does considerably increases the soot loading on the engine oil and hence it's tendency to thicken and form sludge. Therefore the later engines are less tolerant of poor maintenance than the earlier type and are likely to be more prone to suffering blocked oil feeds etc. if the 6k/6months oil change schedule is ignored.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - DL
305.....should read 306 - where\'s that edit button!? {Allow me - done. DD.}

Surely if it was a wear issue, there would be a tell tale big end knock well before the failure?
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - P 2501
Did you service this car yourself, or is this the first time you have seen it DL?

Is it possible to find out how often/well the owner serviced it before the engine self destructed?

How many miles?

So many questions!

Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - DL
Car has full dealer history from new - it had covered 112,000 miles....negating any maintenence issues.

All back and running now, with a used motor from a crash damaged car.

Cost the thick end of £1200 to sort it out.
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - P 2501
At first i thought these engines were throwing rods because of bad maintenance, but it increasingly looks like faulty manufacturing now.

Why at 112K i wonder? I recall someone saying on this forum that if a con rod was going to go due to bad manufacture then it would go sooner than that.Or am i mistaken?

I suppose that 112k on a T reg will have been alot of motorway miles, so in theory the oil should have stayed in good condition between services.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - RichardW
The original 'batch' went at around 30k miles, and I have not heard much about it for a while, but now cars of that age are getting to 100k there seems to be another batch coming through - I have heard of a few. There are many XUDTs that have suffered severe abuse, and knock rumble and smoke, but just throwing a con road out of the block is unusual. There must have been a bad batch of rods or big end bolts. I see from DL's photos that the crank journal is exposed, so either the bottom part of the rod has gone, or the bolts have sheared, allowing the big end to separate. Nasty, either way. Other one I heard about, there were no pre-symptoms, just a bang followed by no oil pressure...


--
RichardW

Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - dieselhead
Kind of damage in the picture looks similar to that when a con rod seizes onto crank when oil supply is stopped ie low oil level but if last few oil services were done seems unlikely unless engine had a bad oil leak. In one photo it looks like there is some blueing on the crank journal and on another it looks ok. DL was there any sign of scuffing/blueing on the crank journal or fragments of bearing shell ?.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - autumnboy
This has been noted before about these engines blowing their conrods for no reason and its not down to poor maintenance.

I can't remember where I read about this last year, but it does not happen on the older engines. And Peugeot who build these engines will not admit that there is a fault with them.

Best to do a search on 'Google' about this.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - DL
Dieselhead - there was no bluing or surafce damage to the journal (except for shrapnel damage)

The big end cap was almost flat, signifying a major failure in this area. I reckon it just cracked.
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Ross_D
Scary! Mine is coming up for 110K miles, but its the older D8A XUD9TE type with no EGR or cat. Fingers crossed all will be ok.
I think it is a pretty rare event for these to fail so badly, think of the 5 million XUD's that were made and these failures now seem a bit rare. It may be possible to find the source, the 306 has a build number on the NS suspension turret, I wonder if the build numbers of the failed cars are within a short sequence of each other (or even the same) it could be possible to determine if its a manufacturing/assembly fault. If not it could be down to neglected services and sludging of the oil as previously mentioned?
Also, I'm not sure if it would have any significance, but my Peugeot parts CD's show two different types of crankshaft for this engine, an 'undercut' type crank and one that is not 'undercut'.
(Just checked the CD again, from build number 7602 they changed the big end shells, I know its speculation...)

Ross
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - brianrh
A company I worked for up to a few years ago were doing an engine development project for Peugeot and there were a few surprises if my memory serves me correct.

When they measured up batches of engine components supplied direct from Peugoet, many were not within tolerance when compared to Peugeot drawings.

They also had several standard spec engine failures with engines running in test cells. It was found that if the engine revs were dropped from high rpm with light or no load from the dyno, large amounts of oil were drawn into the engine. It was said that fitted to a car these engines would normally have the inertia of the car to slow down engine de-acceleration which would prevent this happening. Peugeot always denied any knowledge of this, but a visiting French engineer sort of admitted that he had heard of it before.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Ross_D
"It was found that if the engine revs were dropped from high rpm with light or no load from the dyno, large amounts of oil were drawn into the engine."

So, I wonder if the MOT smoke test would trigger this?
Full revs, no load and then quickly back to idle speed.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - brianrh
I should have said that this was a 2 litre petrol engine developement. However no doubt certain technologies and practices are shared.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - dieselhead
Just a thought, wonder if it could be an over revving issue ie 2nd gear selected instead of 4th now as amount of damage shown in DL's photo would suggest engine was doing major revs when the con rod failed. Faulty or incorrectly set rev governor.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Edward
Disconnected my EGR when this problem first came up. According to a French website at the time, they thought that excessive thermal cycling caused by EGR during stop start driving caused part of the precombustion chamber to disintigrate into the cylinder, taking out the piston and / or conrod.
Seems strange that the problem is most common on 306s give the number of other PSA group cars with engines of this vintage.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - DL
The EGR theory does fit Edward, but the engine in question exhibited no piston crown damage. I still have the remains of the piston crown somewhere, I will try to get a picture of it, out of interest.

This failure WAS NOT attributable to a missed or incorrect gear selection - I spoke to the owner, first hand. Was driving along the A4 Portway in towards Bristol City Centre @ 40mph in 3rd gear, accelerating.
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Edward
Way ahead of me there! I guess a manufacturing fault then. Anybody want to by a 98R 306DT with 59994 miles?
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - ribby
Sorry for double posting - I just posted this on another older thread, but it looks like its better placed here. Oh - and I did an oil change 2 weeks ago, earlier than specified, so this engine was not neglected oil-wise.

+--------------+

I've just had my 1999 Pug 306 Engine blow up this afternoon. As you have all said, it's a Turbo Diesel with a number starting DHY600... No.4 Con-Rod through the block and sump. Car just approaching 60,000 miles, 2 hours into my journey, doing 70mpg on the M5 at the time :-(

Has anyone had any joy with pursuing Peugeot for what is most certainly a design or manufacturing fault??

I'm going to try and find an older engine to re-build and fit. I also have a 1995 306TD (my car, the '99 is my wife's) which has done 140,000 miles and that engine is nothing short of fantastic!!

Many thanks to those who set up this forum ...

Best wishes,

Simon
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - no more diesel
Hello
I am sorry to hear about what you have been through.Sadly I had to endure an engine failure this week while i was travelling on the M3 at 70miles/hour.The no3 con rod came through the engine destroying the engine,radiator and the gearbox bell housing. I drive a 306 td 1998. it was serviced the previous week and had a cam belt change also what a waste of money???????
the car has only done 51000miles. I will never buy a peugeot"french crap" again. I appreciate if any body can provide info on where I can buy a second hand engine from a reputable supplyer. I would like to highlight that ebngine code is dhy and xudte also

Many thanks

Dieselpug
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - autumnboy
My 96 1.9td ZX has done 127k and still life. Touch wood !!

It uses the same engine although they modified them about 97/98 for emission controls.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - 659FBE
Firstly, my condolences to all that have suffered from this problem. PSA have treated their customers very badly in not admitting to the problem. But for the fact that they produce by far the best small affordable diesel engines, they would not get any more of my money.

I have been told (I can't remember by whom) that this problem was caused by an engine build error, and that con-rods for the naturally aspirated diesel were fitted to some of the turbocharged engines. As this latter engine requires stronger rods, the failures were almost inevitable. If this is the case, then the failure mode would probably be one of fatigue. It's very difficult to correlate this type of problem with engine mileage, but one possibility is that rods will fail earlier in engines which accelerate and decelerate frequently (town use), and later on vehicles used at constant speed on motorways.

Has anyone else heard of the "wrong con-rods" theory? 659.

Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - vmturbo

Similar has happened with a famous German brand and their model nicknamed "The rod bender and head buster". Fortunately the car owner was given a new engine on the guarantee.

The dealer was very tight-lipped about what the problem was but they did ask "Have you been driving through water?" AFAIK the car is still running well so one can surmise that the replacement engine has stronger rods.

Good quality rods are forged from vanadium steel. The Vanadium powder usually comes from Russia in wooden barrels. Skilful alloying and forging can produce rods that have an extremely low failure rate.

When bad batches of rods fail in large numbers one does have to wonder whether they were made from recycled rebar.

Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Bromptonaut

The dealer was very tight-lipped about what the problem was but they did ask "Have you been driving through water?" AFAIK the car is still running well so one can surmise that the replacement engine has stronger rods.

Good quality rods are forged from vanadium steel. The Vanadium powder usually comes from Russia in wooden barrels. Skilful alloying and forging can produce rods that have an extremely low failure rate.

When bad batches of rods fail in large numbers one does have to wonder whether they were made from recycled rebar.

'Wading' through floods risks submerging the engine's air intake and drawing water into the cylinders and being subject to the compression stroke. Water being, for practical purposes, incompressible this results in something giving way.

Conrod as likely as anything.

Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Andrew-T
>the car has only done 51000miles. I will never buy a peugeot "french crap" again<.

While this is a normal and understandable reaction, please remember that it is based on a statistically insignificant sample of one (or at most a few). Lots of drivers (including me) have owned many Pugs without any major problems. You can switch to another maker and have just the same luck as before!
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - P 2501
Yes, i have heard of the faulty batch of con rods theory. It sounds possible, but are they actually interchangeable?

I would like to know just how many xuds have met their end in this way.I have to agree with Andrew T though and say i have never had these sorts of problems, i think they must be rare and those unfortunate enough to be affected seem to go straight to internet forums and let the world know, while the millions of satisfied people keep quiet!

I am anticipating that my friends 306 will meet the same end soon as it is a 98 306 with a dhy build code and it has now gone 18k without an oil change! asking for trouble.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - DL
Blimey - and it's still happening.....surely there will come a point when all the bad ones will be weeded out?

Whatever PSA have done to keep a lid on this, it's worked.

So it seems the MG Rover (Bury our heads in the sand and deny all whilst Land Rover admit the problem....) "We don't have a problem with our K Series engine blowing head gaskets" CAN work?!
--
groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - martine1081
Last thursday at 80mph on the M55 my engine did this.

Unfortuneatly the guy who was driving behind me at the time is claiming off my insurance because the parts that shot out damaged his car. So not only did the car write itself off but I'm losing all my NCB over it. Just spent a fortune on sorting out bits and bobs on it too fuel pump, timing belt, suspension etc etc

It was on 71K at the time, regular serving, mainly motorway miles. I'd only owned it 6 months in fact still paying off the loan for it!!
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Martin1981
Considering there are several cars of the Peugeot and Citroen range which are powered by this engine, I only seem ho hear about this happening to 306 TDs, other than one 406 on another site. I've never heard about it happening to the likes of the Xantia, ZX, Xsara or Pug 806's of the same age. Is this because most of the DHY coded engines are fitted to the 306?

Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Ross_D
The Xantia, 406 and 806 etc had the DHX engine and not the DHY. Also the ZX was only fitted with the D8A engine too I think. That leaves the Xsara, which definatly had a DHY, so anybody with a failed Xsara out there??
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Martin1981
That would explain it. So if ever buy (doubt I will) a 306TD of that age, I'll check first to see if the engine is a DHY and if so I'll walk away. Couldn't be doing with conrod failure- sounds awful from what I've read and worse still, Peugeot dealers don't seem interested. Fortunately my 1994 306 XRdt seems to be chugging along nicely at the moment (touch wood) so I've no worries about conrod failure.
Peugeot 306 XUD9TE Conrod failure - Ross_D
The DHY engine replaced the D8A engine in about 1996 / 1997, main differences being EGR and a cat. Also, the earlier (and slightly more powerful) D8A engine could have a Bosch or Lucas injection pump, whereas the DHY only had a Lucas pump. Your 1994 car will most probably have the D8A lump so you will be safe I expect!!