Yes I put in RadWeld, just to get me home. It helped a little, but it was still leaking. That was just an emergency measure. Even if it did stop the leak, I wouldn't be happy as it would probably start leaking in a few months time.
Luckily, I've got the use of my Dads car and garage whilst he is away on holiday, so I'm taking it easy (an hour in the evening when convenient). Made a start last night, so far so good.
I have been changing antifreeze every 2 years, I guess 10 years and 128K is reasonable wear and tear for a heater matrix. I've heard of others who have been through 3 of these in the same period.
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What type of heater matrix have you bought to replace it with Solara? From what i can find on the net, the Pug 405 has either a valeo or a behr matrix available while the 306 has only valeo.
The behr retails a few pounds more than the valeo so i was wondering if it's any different...
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The Behr is for air-conditioned cars.
The bog standard one is the valeo one.
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My ZX 1.9D has the exact same problem at the moment. It went in to Citroen for another problem and they told me the stale smell emanating from the interior was the heater matrix "weeping", but couldn't say from where.
My local independent looked and reckons it's so slight it's probably leaking into the heater tray and evaporating.
Started to dismantle the dash myself so they could just fit the matrix, got as far as the centre console bits out then found riveted framework behind so gave up.
If you find any hints I'd be grateful.
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Try Forte "stop leak" product.
Expensive (£12/bottle)but used by my local Cit indie on Xantia matricies to good effect.
Failing that, work on around a day and a half's work for replacement (about what it took with my Pug 405). It's not such a bad job if you are methodical, patient, and take it easy!
rg
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Should have the dash and matrix out tonight, all ancilliary components removed (steering wheel+column, cassette, clock, instrument panel, wiper motor+linkages,scuttle panel+fascia nuts,central facia). Just the interior fixing bolts to remove.
The only thing puzzling me at the moment is the speedo cable which should be pulled out of the bulkhead wall into the engine bay (just slightly). Cant understand how that will help as you dont need to completely pull the cable out. Anyway, Im sure I'll find out later tonight. They make it look easy in the manual, but If I need to do it, I think Im going to have remove the intercooler and plastic airducts to get proper access to it. I could tug it from below, but Im gonna have problems pushing it back in. See if I can get away with it.
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Got the matrix out last night (no not the film!).
About the speedo cable through the bulkhead... no need to pull it out.
However, I did have problems trying to remove the matrix pipes from the bulkhead wall (mainly due to poor access in engine compartment) as recommended by Haynes. Then I noticed that the pipes on the other side of the bulkhead (drivers compartment) were fixed to the matrix via two screws. This proved to be much easier. Hopefully I will be able to screw on the new matrix to the pipes from here. If it works, it will have saved alot of hassle.
Other minor hitches were trying to remove the nuts fixing the matrix enclosure to the bulkhead wall. Again this was due to poor access due to turbo intercooler ducts getting in the way. Luckily I had a long reach deep ring spanner (used for glow plugs) which did the trick. Also helps if you have a helping hand pulling out the dash, not so easy finding volunteers close to midnight!
Hey and guess what, if you're brake light switch ever fails, you're going to need to take the whole dash out! Its hidden in the metal bracket enclosing the steering column.
So far its taken me approx 5 hrs in total to get to the culprit. I was expecting it to be badly corroded, but it was as clean as a whistle (on the exterior) but obviously wet from a leak somewhere. When I haven't got anything better to do, I'll do an autopsy on it.
Took some pics last night (not for the faint-hearted), will try and add links this weekend.
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Sounds like you have made pretty light work of it! (so far) Is it a job you would recommend to DIYer with limited experience or best left as a paid job?
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I'd reserve judgement until the job is complete :-)
As long as you dont rush it, I think it can be a DIYers job.
I just got my hands on the replacement valeo matrix, and my shortcut with the matrix disconnection from pipes looks promising. That should make things alot easier, otherwise you have the usual problems associated with old hose connections and clips cracking when pulling apart.
Its all a question of time/money/resale value/sentiment. I could have paid a garage 200-400 quid to do it, but would I trust the quality of work? Personally Id rather spend £35 quid on a new matrix, and know I've done a proper job. I guess with me, sentiment is the overriding factor.
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I too would rather do the job myself for piece of mind that it has been done properly.But a thing like this does require a certain degree of confidence, experience and probably a bit of ingenuity. I have my doubts that i have enough of these!
I must admit you sound as if you have found it rather straightforward, not at all like the nightmare job some other posters have described.
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Hi, run a 95 306xrdt with 106,000 on the clock, done most of the maintenance myself,two cambelts plus water pump and pulleys, two radiators and power steering pump.This sites great for knowing whats round the corner maintenance wise,but sometimes I get a bit paranoid waiting for the head gasket to go! Now I've got the matrix to worry about!The way I see it is the car is worth about 12to 15 hundred , and I reckon as long as its got a full test it'll still be worth a grand in a couple of years time,because young lads and girls like them becuase they look great and are a low insurance group.The main reason for keeping one though, is that they are still a great drive, supposed to be better than the 307 by all accounts.Makes those skinned knuckle jobs seem worth it.Could get into talking about forming a relationship with the car ,because you've spent time working on it, but I think thats a bit heavy for this site. Best of luck with your re- assembly.
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Two radiators? Wow you must love those bayonet connections!
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groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
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Just a quick thought....
Does the PUG have the same clutch cable set up as Citroens of the same age? They require dashboard out because the frequent failure of a small plastic component. Is it worth changing at the same time? Or will you use your newly found skills to have dashboard out again next week?????
Richard W or MM will probably have the answer.
pmh (was peter)
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Ah....the good old pedal to cable connecting collar again!
It is fiddly to change but I'm not aware the dash has to come out to do so..?
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groups.msn.com/honestjohn - Pictures say a thousand words.....
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I managed to replace the matrix without disconnecting the hose pipes in the
engine bay.
Heres the steps for my workaround, once you have the facia off:
Firstly undo all fixings for the fan/matrix enclosure (2 nuts in engine bay,
1 in central floor pillar.
Disconnect the matrix from the connection in the drivers compartment (simply
undo the two 7mm bolts) and it just pops apart.
You obviously need to disconnect the new matrix at this same joint.
Dont forget to swap the old rubber o-rings with the new ones.
Then slide in the new matrix into enclosure casing.
Dont pop it all the way in yet.
Keep it about a centimetre above fully seated position.
Then mate the matrix with the old connector. A bit of grease on the o-rings
will help.
Tighten the two 7mm bolts home.
Then slide the matrix down into fully seated position (snaps shut).
Now shuffle the enclosure until both threaded inserts pop through the
bulkhead wall into engine compartment.
Tighten nuts in engine bay and floor pillar.
The floor pillar nut fixing has a cheap plastic insert which can come out of
place, leaving bolt to spin, so take care. There is very little hand
clearance behind this bolt. Spent almost an hour trying to undo, re-seat and
tighten this thing.
Then follow Haynes instructions to re-install facia.
I did a quick autopsy on the old matrix (see pic link). On prising open the plastic head of
the matrix, I could see 5 of the 8 u-tubes filled with crud. No wonder the RadWeld didn\'t do much, as there was no way it was going to get through the finely packed crud. This also answers a query I had on an earlier thread I had on \"how quick does your pug 306 td heat up?\",
and why I thought mines was slower than usual in heating up.
This is a very poor bit of design, as both the inlet and outlet pipes are at
the top of the matrix, with parallel u-bend pipes going down and back up.
Basically, all the silt/crud in the coolant collects at the bottom of the
u-bends, blocking them, and eventually corroding through the pipes. If they
had kept to the conventional rad design of inlet at top and outlet at
bottom, it wouldn\'t be a problem. But then again it keeps the dealerships in
business! Even more reason to flush/change coolant every 2 years.
While I had the coolant out, I decided to change the thermostat, and tacho tdc sensor at the same time. Was going to also change the fast idle wax stat, but didnt have a big enough spanner, and poor access again!. Oh well that will have to wait till next time.
My main radiator still looks in good shape (3-4 years old), hopefully the water pump will last until the next timing belt change. Does anyone know what the typical lifetime is of the water pump on one of these?
Car is now back on the road, heated up in a jiffy this morning, and no misty windscreen.
Here\'s a link to my pics:
uk.f2.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/solarapics/album?.dir...7
Hope this helps someone.
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Having only just got a ZX, I don't know if they suffer from the same plastic link breakage as the Xantia - I don't think so I have never heard about it (but Haynes indicates they do have a plstic link!), nor whether changing it is such a 'mare.
The Xantia one can be changed without removing the dash - but I think that was the 'official' response from Cit dealers when they began breaking. It's a bad job made truly awful by the positioning of the bolt such that it more often than not has to to be sawn off to remove the pedal (mind you, an air powered saw would help here!). 3 Hours to change a £5 component that immobilises the car - that must be a record??
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RichardW
Is it illogical? It must be Citroen....
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Thanks for those interesting pics solara. If (when!) the time comes for my matrix to be replaced, i might well have a go at it using your instructions.
Just out of interest, how often did you change your coolant? and did you ever flush the engine/rad with a hosepipe or a flushing agent?
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Coolant was changed every 2 years. Only flushed with water (not a hose jet). Probably a good idea though. Ideally you would want to flush the matrix (isolated), but that may too much work to bother.
Overall rating: certainly can be a diyers job (with my workaround), but take your time. Should be able to squeeze it in a weekend, but wife/kids may rebel! Also takes 2 people to pull-out and re-seat fascia.
Hopefully you wont need this advice.
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best not to use radweld!!
modern radiators are not designed for it,engine cooling will be compromised,if a radiator has had this treatment it want's throwing away..... diesel demon
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Hey, your link to the pics did not work, are you able to send me them? Cheers
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No the dash does not need to come out, as clutch mechanism is fully visible from below, if you can get yourself into that position (yoga lessons come in handy).
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hi there....
i'm Ian from surrey,i have just bought a peugeot 306 xrdt 1996 n 125,000 miles,it need,s some attention,also has the matrix "hot" smell,i did a 405 matrix recently without removing the entire dash but having looked at haynes manual tonight,looks like dash out,
any particular reason why i shouldn't elect to do this in my spare time? it has driver airbag,no aircon
i otherwise like the car but cannot stand the smell,
i know exactly what has happened,(porous matrix vaporising coolant when hot..bad for health as this is poison)
many thank's
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Book time for a 306 matrix is approx 10 hours - it's not a whole dash out job but you need to undo all the dash and move it up and forwards a few inches. It's not particularly difficult just laborious so you should be able to do it DIY.
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Take it from me, it is a dash-out job. I've done it twice!
Dash in situ, only makes job more difficult, if near impossible.
OK as DIY jobs go, 10 hours is probably top limit, should be able to do it in a few evening slots, or one whole day.
Any q's feel free to ask.
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PS give the coolant a good flush several times before taking out the old matrix. Prevents any crud from sitting in the new matrix, if you do it after replacing.
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thankyou sir,moving on with the job next.....
shall be reporting as i go diesel demon
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