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I had a Passat for 11 months. It broke regulary, the interior rattled constantly and the dealers were awful and expensive. I was so looking forward to owning a 'rock solid' VW. What a disappointment!
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Both good cars, but personally I find the Mondeo to be a more agile car - it feels a lot small than it is. The VW is a bit stodgy. Ford is likely to be cheaper to run once out of warranty and their reliability is now looking better than VW. Only reservation is that the odd TDCi seems to have engine hesitancy - as in well documented in the BR!
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AdrianM, I was waiting for you to suggest waiting for the 407! Can't be too far away now.
Me thinks this will be THE diesel mid-range model to beat.
Won't it get new Ford/Pug power units??
Otherwise, my £$£$£ would go to the Mondeo.
VB
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I would agree with majority view here - go for the Mondeo.
I drove a Passat TDI PD130 SE estate on a 51 plate for 7 months and have been now been driving a Mondeo TDCi 130 Estate since June 03. The Passat SE was very wallowy but may be a little better with the sport suspension. The dynamics of the Mondeo are excellent, even for the large estate with a good drving position. Feels a much smaller car than it is, especially when going around corners. Passat had some annoying dashboard creaks and sqeaks early on but nothing untoward with the Mondeo (yet).
Mondeo acceleration seems to be more measured compared to Passat which is quite savage when the turbo cuts in (and not always as advantage) but I always seem to have a little difficulty getting away in first gear smoothly in the Mondeo. I always seem to have to dip the clutch when moving off normally to avoid stalling the engine and have actually stalled several times. (A common problem - Is this because of a small flywheel or something else - anyone know?). Mondeo mixed driving is giving about 44 to 46 during the cold weather whereas it was 46 to 48 in the summer (brim to brim).
Mondeo estate does'nt seem to suffer from the wind noise around driver side B pillar that can occur on the saloon/hatchabck.
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Just done 2000 miles in a new 2.0 diesel (130) Ghia x in Decemeber 2003.
Its a solid build with no rattles. You must keep the revs up all the time or it resembles a tortoise. Rerurned 46 mpg because of motorway speed.
Internal spec is high. The drivers mat held down by useless and laughable pins requires an adverse comment.
The passat se proved to dear for my company at any bhp.
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" I always seem to have a little difficulty getting away in first gear smoothly in the Mondeo. I always seem to have to dip the clutch when moving off normally to avoid stalling the engine and have actually stalled several times. (A common problem - Is this because of a small flywheel or something else - anyone know?). "
I encountered the same thing on two different Mondeo diesel hire cars. I thought the car just lacked low RPM torque as they needed at least 1500 rpm showing for a smooth pull away in first. I find that to be ridiculously high RPM for a diesel car and was enough to put me off buying one. A shame really, as I rather liked the sported up Zetec S models. I haven't driven a Passat TDI, but a friend's non-PD (90hp?)diesel Golf was much more pleasurable to drive than those Mondeo diesels.
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Regarding stalling, I stalled several times on my first trip but never since. Its just a case of getting used to the way the fly by wire throttle set up works. I have to say that I find nothing unnatural in the way this works.
I drive the TDCI, friend & relative drive the Passats so I've experience of both. I think both cars are exceptional but I find the Mondeo quieter and a more refined drive. I wouldn't swap my TDCI for a Passat if the prices were the same. Given that the Passat is much more expensive, there's no competition! MPG is more variable on the Mondeo than other diesels and generally not quite as high as I would like, but its not outrageous - now averaging 45-47.
Its good to read contributors to this thread being more measured in their response to the TDCI than others in the BR. Yes, the engine may have had its teething problems and, for some, that has been a headache but that's no reason to panic. Just look at the numbers of TDCIs on the road these days - the proportion with problems must be very small. Also, technical is always full of Passat problems yet no-one tarnishes that car with an "untrustworthy" tag.
So well done. The TDCI is a marvellous car...I've often said that these cars are not far behind the BMW/Audi market in terms of quality and drive. Go through the car supermarkets and it makes outstanding value for money. Buy one!
Splodgeface
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I had a Passat 115bhp PD for 30 months and 80,000 miles. Nothing went wrong with it, looked like new when I sold it but it really does cost a lot of money to service and look after a new VW. If you go VW, my experience is that you should expect poor service and arrogance from the dealers which grates when you're spending your own hard earned. We have leased 4 Mondeo TDCi 130s in our firm and IMHO they are a better car for all the reasons stated in these replies. I couldn?t believe how much smoother and quieter they are than the VW diesels. Ford dealers are better, there are more of them competing for your service business. Ivor E Tower is right, take a long test drive or hire one for a days driving before taking the plunge.
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My experience of (irinically enough) working in the past for a Ford car and combined VW van dealer is that the Mondeo is a pretty good car. An interesting observation is that on the VW 1.9 TDi and Sdi engines, changing the cambelts at the specified time is crucial - saw no end of Transporter vans come in with pink fluffy dice engines due to cambelt failure caused by the cheap plastic tensioning wheel shattering thereby allowing the belt to come off
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Hi all,
Does anybody have a view on the TDCi auto?
Regards.
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Have a look here on the forums for some views on the TDCI, you can register for free and ask whatever you want to.
www.fordmondeo.org
I drive a 1997 petrol Mondeo at present so cannot really comment.
Good luck!
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I drive a E320 CDI which is very powerfull for a diesel but when I borrowed a freinds Mondeo TDCI a few weeks ago I was amazed. Stepping out of my car I expected the Ford to be a total dog but it wasn't. The power was great and suited the car perfectly, it was quiet, smooth and handled really well. I drove a Passat a while ago and found that good but the Mondeo seemed a lot better and surprisingly well built.
As said above Ford dealers on the whole seem pretty good, especially compared to our local VW dealer.
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Ford lent me a TDCi130 auto last summer. 40mpg but the autobox hung onto the lower gears and took ages to go into top gear. Having driven the the manual I think on balance it preferable however I too noticed the stalling at low rpm which of course was absent in the auto.
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To be quite honest, I would rather have a VW badge than a Ford one. Yes, you might pay for the privalege for this. When you trade your VW Passat in, you will get a lot more than you would for the same spec Mondeo. Someone above stated it was more expensive to maintain a VW Passat, well, If you look at the reliability index, you will find the VW Passat has the better overall scoring.
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Borafeck wrote: 'When you trade your Passat in, you will get more than you will for the Mondeo.'
Given the original costs (15k versus 13.1k) then you'll have to be certain of getting more than 1,900 more for your Passat than your Mondeo.
Now, I have absolutely no idea what the answer to that is.
Borafeck also wrote: 'more expensive to maintain a VW Passat, well, If you look at the reliability index, you will find the VW Passat has the better overall scoring.'
Again, you have to multiply number of fails by average cost of fails. Passat = fewer fails x more expensive; Mondeo = more fails x cheaper.
If you're buying it on finance, then the answer is always the cheaper car. In fact, if you're buying it on finance, then you should be looking for an older car, as otherwise you're just paying the bank. But then I'm just an old curmudgeon. Go for the Skoda!
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" Given the original costs (15k versus 13.1k) then you'll have to be certain of getting more than 1,900 more for your Passat than your Mondeo|" mapmaker
Also depend on where you purchase your vehicle, If you are a shrewd cookie like myself, you will purchase your VW with as much discount as possible. At the moment you can purchase a VW Passat sport at £15,200 from new-car-discount.com remembering the sport model is one of the top models. If you went for the equivelent model in Mondeo you would want a 2.0TDCI Ghia X , 130BHP,which would cost you approx. Ford Mondeo 2.0 TDCi Ghia X 130 2004 MY, Diesel, 2004 53 Reg, Estate, 10 miles, this has been taken from autotrader and also from new-car-discount.com, retailing at, wait for it, a whopping £17,700
Are we quoting like for like here or playing of weaker models against each other. Personally I would rather pay that bit extra for quality as I know in the long run I will be better off.
Remembering that drive and handling experience can only be maintained if you know how to drive your car correctly and as not many UK drivers have attained an Advanced pass a lot of experience as wasted on us. lol
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I've no doubt that you're right. But I think a shrewder cookie would look for something 6 months older. But please don't, we want you to keep cheap second hand cars running down to us!
However he has the choice between paying 15k and 13.1k - he has already decided that he thinks those two cars are equivalent. The sum he needs to (be a psychic to) do is:
(Cost when purchased) + (Cost of maintenance during ownership period) + (running costs: mpg etc.) - (trade in value).
If it's on finance, then the extra cost of financing the 1,900 needs to be brought into the equation as well.
But I'm only a parsimonious old curmudgeon and I don't care what it looks like so long as it's got a wheel in each corner.
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Based on my experience with an Audi A4 TDI 110 ( a trated up Passat) I will never buy another VW car again: VERY expensive servicing , poor reliability and frankly dull as ditchwater handling..
Having driven the mondeo I would buy it (but second hand of course.. let someone else take the deprciation).
VW/Audi are smug, arrogant and overpriced - well finished but you pay through the nose.. (and I'm a Scot)
madf
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Passat with sports suspension still doesn't touch the Mondeo for handling - it does bottom out frequently though.
I've already got through one engine pan cover.
Agree about the turbo boost - fine in dry weather but a more linear torque curve would benefit the car in less than perfect traction conditions.
I've taken to disabling ASR (Traction control) in carp weather, I don't mind wheelspin but I don't like the rather agricultural engine control that traction control gives you.
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