Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 17:05
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - Narfboy
I’ve been asked by Freind for suggestions for a replacement to an ageing Daihatsu Copen. They love their Copen which they have had from new but it’s getting harder to get parts. The challenge being they don’t want to go any bigger. The best I could come up with is a Fiat 500e which is still a fair bit bigger.
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Wed 18 Aug 2021 17:25
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - SLO76
What’s the budget?
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Wed 18 Aug 2021 17:50
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - badbusdriver

Trouble is, you don't get kei car sized cars in the UK. Also, the Copen is a tiny two seat sports car with a retractable hardtop. The smallest two seat sports car you can buy new is an MX5, and while not big, it is some way larger than the Copen. Retractable hardtops are also no longer popular, they are just too complex and compromise the proportions of the car too much.

So you need to find out a lot more about what your friends want, as there is literally nothing like a Copen available in the UK(*).

Do they just want a really small car?. If so, excluding the Smart Fortwo (currently electric only), the smallest cars available are the Citroen C1, Peugeot 108 and Toyota Aygo. Some of them have been available with a large sliding canvas sunroof but I'm not sure if that is still the case. The Aygo is available with a variety of bright colours (I know this because a customer of mine has one in bright orange). They are fun to drive, nippy and reliable but don't really have much in common with the Copen. Also very small, though a bit more refined than the C1/108/Aygo is the Kia Picanto. This is also available in some funky trim levels and colours.

(*)To be honest, the closest replacement to their Copen would in fact be a current Copen. This would involve going through a Japanese import specialist, but there are plenty of them around.

Daihatsu_COPEN_Robe_(L400K)_front.JPG

Without budget, and knowing a bit more about what they want, it is difficult to offer suggestions.

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 20:08
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - Narfboy
The key requirement was size above all, they have mainly had Austin/Rover Minis perviously with their biggest car being a Mk2 (K11) Nissan Micra. I think the removable roof is a nice to have, I suspect it’s the light weight, wheel in each corner, planted feel that’s the important factor. I’m not sure I’m explaining it well.

I’ve not discussed budget but I suspect it will be a cash purchase from new if that helps.

I’m trying to suggest an EV as they do lots of short trips from cold and constantly have battery issues as a result. Had a quick look at the Smart EQ Fortwo cabrio but the lack of rapid charger would appear to limit the car somewhat.
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Wed 18 Aug 2021 20:17
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - Terry W

If small rather than convertible is the issue, almost any current city car will fill the brief - lots to choose from, my favourite would be a Hyundai i10, but cars from VW, Peugeot, Toyota, Skoda, Kia etc would all do the job.

Compared to a Copen they will all seem bigger (wider), far better equipped, more refined and probably faster. The choice is probably down to "do I like the colour", standard kit, price and personal comfort.

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 20:47
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - badbusdriver

I’m trying to suggest an EV as they do lots of short trips from cold and constantly have battery issues as a result.

Not sure what you mean by this?, do they live somewhere cold?. Lots of short journeys is exactly what EV's are best at, and if they have a driveway, the lack of fast charging is not going to be an issue, just plug it in at night.

However, the Smart Fortwo was available with the convertible roof petrol engine right up till 2019. Obviously not brand new, but a couple of years old might be acceptable?.

Also, the new Fiat e500 is available with a convertible roof, decent battery range and fast charging.

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 21:04
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - Narfboy

I’m trying to suggest an EV as they do lots of short trips from cold and constantly have battery issues as a result.

Not sure what you mean by this?, do they live somewhere cold?. Lots of short journeys is exactly what EV's are best at, and if they have a driveway, the lack of fast charging is not going to be an issue, just plug it in at night.

Sorry if I’m not being clear. They never warm up their petrol engine by doing lots of short runs so never recharge the battery. I think they go through two 12v batteries a year. Hence I’m suggesting they get an EV as it would be more reliable for them.

However, the Smart Fortwo was available with the convertible roof petrol engine right up till 2019. Obviously not brand new, but a couple of years old might be acceptable?.

Also, the new Fiat e500 is available with a convertible roof, decent battery range and fast charging.

Currently Fiat e500 seems the best bet.

Edited by Narfboy on 18/08/2021 at 21:06

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Thu 19 Aug 2021 15:51
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - JonestHon

Am I read it right?!

The Fiat EV is priced at £24.5k to £30k?!

Who in their right mindset will go and order a new one at this price?

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 20:46
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - SLO76
I’d have a new model MX5 1.5. For such low mileage users a new car would be a waste of money.

www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202108146248262


How about this? It’s a tonne of money for a 12yr old Copen but it’s probably the best one left in the country if it’s half as nice as it’s described. Join the owners club and Facebook page (if one exists) and advice will be given and parts will be found.



www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202107215272145

Nissan Figaro is based on a Micra. They’re really dated to drive but keep it nice and it’s depreciation free.

www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202108186373070




The Fiat 500 1.2 is another worthy small car.





Edited by SLO76 on 18/08/2021 at 20:55

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 20:58
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - badbusdriver

Join the owners club and Facebook page (if one exists) and advice will be given and parts will be found.

I was going to mention that while parts for a Copen might be hard to come by from the usual sources, I wouldn't have thought they'd be hard to come by should you really want them. Owners clubs as you mention, but also a Japanese car specialist would be able to get parts from Japan. Will be quite expensive no doubt, and of course it will take some time to get the parts shipped here, but if they really love the car?

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Wed 18 Aug 2021 21:47
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - SLO76
I’ve just joined the Daihatsu Copen UK Facebook page. Seem a friendly lot with plenty of Copen related chat and dealing. I’m sure parts advice would be easy to find here.
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Thu 19 Aug 2021 06:40
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - badbusdriver

Going by how you describe their useage, an EV would certainly seem to be the best option for a new car. But, not everyone likes the idea of EV's, and not everyone wants a 'two pedal' car. You said earlier you thought they loved the Copen because of its lightweight feel, but I suspect for the driver, the gear change will also be a factor. If so, no EV is going to be the 'best bet'.

From my own experience, a Citroen C1 with the big canvas sunroof would offer the closest feel to the Copen. Being very small and light, wheel at each corner, not especially refined, nippy and eager.

Doing lots of short journeys, unless literally round the corner, shouldn't knacker the battery. So maybe that is being caused by an alternator or electrical issue. But buying one of those solar trickle chargers and keeping it sitting on the dashboard when the car isn't in use might help.

But ultimately, unless some other major underlying issue, I'd be tempted to keep the Copen.

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Thu 19 Aug 2021 08:02
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - SLO76
Citroen C1/Pug 108 soft top is a fun wee car that’s reliable and cheap to run. Not sure if Toyota offered it on the Aygo but if so include it too.
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Thu 19 Aug 2021 12:51
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - Heidfirst

Offered as Aygo X-wave from 2015. So even oldest would still fall well within the age limit of the new Toyota Relax warranty.

Edited by Heidfirst on 19/08/2021 at 12:51

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Thu 19 Aug 2021 15:04
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - Rerepo

Another vote for the C1/108/Aygo. I think the C1s look particularly nice with the soft top.

Rugged and reliable engines and dead easy and cheap to service and repair. Only thing I have against them is a numb clutch pedal that lacks progression.

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Thu 19 Aug 2021 16:48
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - badbusdriver

Am I read it right?!

The Fiat EV is priced at £24.5k to £30k?!

Who in their right mindset will go and order a new one at this price?

The same people who will order one of its rivals (electric Mini, Honda e, Mazda MX-30) for the same or more. But lets be clear, the percentage of 'buyers' who will 'buy' these cars is tiny. All that matters is the monthly payment.

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Thu 19 Aug 2021 17:36
Daihatsu Copen - Looking for a small car (Kei size) UK - SLO76
The leasing rates are surprisingly reasonable. The ridiculous list prices serve only to push people into the never-ending PCP or lease life. It’s really the only realistic way to run an electric car. Buying is far too expensive, a subsidised PCP or lease is cheaper but you could always lap up the PCP subsidy and repay the loan if you’ve the credit or the means. To buy a used one means you’ll probably run into battery degradation and crippling depreciation as it reaches the stage where it becomes useless.

Edited by SLO76 on 19/08/2021 at 17:39

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