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Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - P3t3r

I've noticed some highway code changes that may happen. One of the changes seems to be a 'simple' rule where you have priority if you're going straight ahead. Here's a youtube video that explains it youtu.be/nCU-cDOcRIE. I'm wondering whether it really is 'simple' and whether it's a completely crazy idea.

Based on my understanding, we'll be asking cyclists to undertake cars when they are about to turn left ??. I don't cycle, but if I did then I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that.

If this is a simple rule then it would also apply equally to motorcyclists. So a motorcyclist would be expected to overtake a car when it's waiting to turn right? Surely this can't be right?

I can see these changes leading to a lot of collisions, but maybe I've misunderstood it (but that would mean it's not as 'simple' as they say). Does anybody think it's a good idea?

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Bolt

I've noticed some highway code changes that may happen. One of the changes seems to be a 'simple' rule where you have priority if you're going straight ahead. Here's a youtube video that explains it youtu.be/nCU-cDOcRIE. I'm wondering whether it really is 'simple' and whether it's a completely crazy idea.

Based on my understanding, we'll be asking cyclists to undertake cars when they are about to turn left ??. I don't cycle, but if I did then I wouldn't feel comfortable doing that.

If this is a simple rule then it would also apply equally to motorcyclists. So a motorcyclist would be expected to overtake a car when it's waiting to turn right? Surely this can't be right?

I can see these changes leading to a lot of collisions, but maybe I've misunderstood it (but that would mean it's not as 'simple' as they say). Does anybody think it's a good idea?

What a daft idea, not many stick to the rules/highway code as it is and imo this will cause accidents , I wonder who thought this one up?

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - brum

Last time I looked at the highway code was just before I passed my test in 1971.

When my kids were learning, they critised my use of changing down the gears to use engine braking as I approach a junction or roundabout, apparently they were taught to dip the clutch and decrease speed using the footbrake alone. Not sure if this is driving school or highway code twaddle, but I haven't changed my habits as I still remember cars in the 70's with less than brilliant brakes.

Several years ago I got pulled in Poland for driving with foglights on at night, it was raining and visibility was very poor on the smooth surface road which had virtually no discernable white lining and as usual for a Polish minor road no defined side kerb/marking, just a ditch. I pleaded ignorance of Polish highway code (kodex drogowa) claiming in the UK it was allowed in poor visibility (tongue in cheek). He also didnt like why I had part of my headlights masked off, no idea we drive on the left in the UK. In the end, at a loss what to do, he just told me to get a copy of the polish highway code and perhaps read it while lying in bed next to my darling wife.

Which I did not before you ask......

When turning right/left, I adapt to my surroundings, read the minds of other road users and then decide which of the 4 or 5 options to take. Look ahead, mirror, signal, check blindspots, mirror, look ahead (repeat if necessary) finally manouver or something like that.

Highway code may be backed in places by law, but it is not law, and doesn't trump common sense.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - daveyjp
It’s already the case, which is probably why the code is being updated.

If you are turning left at lights and cut across and hit a cyclist on your inside who is going straight ahead, you may be the one facing prosecution for driving without due care and attention.
Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Engineer Andy
It’s already the case, which is probably why the code is being updated. If you are turning left at lights and cut across and hit a cyclist on your inside who is going straight ahead, you may be the one facing prosecution for driving without due care and attention.

About time, too.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - bathtub tom
It’s already the case, which is probably why the code is being updated. If you are turning left at lights and cut across and hit a cyclist on your inside who is going straight ahead, you may be the one facing prosecution for driving without due care and attention.

I'm a cyclist and would never go down the LH side of the front vehicle at a junction (it may be a BMW/Merc/Audi). I've survived (so far) my three score and ten. I also never use the boxes the give cyclists the priority at the front at traffic lights in case the front vehicle (BMW/Merc/ Audi) may be turning left and hasn't noticed me - I'd like to live a few more years.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Sofa Spud

There should be a distinction here. If there is an unambiguously marked cycle lane on the left, then the a cyclist going straight ahead should have priority over a vehicle turning left across the cycle lane. If there's no marked cycle lane, then they shouldn't.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Bromptonaut

There should be a distinction here. If there is an unambiguously marked cycle lane on the left, then the a cyclist going straight ahead should have priority over a vehicle turning left across the cycle lane. If there's no marked cycle lane, then they shouldn't.

How does that work?

Cyclists tend to ride (too?) close to the kerb. The fact they're doing so does not legitimise 'left hooking' them at a T junction or cross roads.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - south wirral cyclist

The new rule is making things simpler by removing that distinction. You are correct that a cyclist would currently have priority if they were in a cyclelane, but only if the cyclelane continues across the junction and often they end at te junction and then resume on the other side. By making the rule that cyclists (like pedestrians already do) always have priority when going straight ahead over turning traffic, it eliminates the need for the driver (and cyclist) to determine exactly where a cycle lnae ends or if there is one. Drivers will simply be required to check they aren't turning in front of any ther road user (pedestrian, cyclist or motor vehicle).

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Bromptonaut

I'm a cyclist and would never go down the LH side of the front vehicle at a junction (it may be a BMW/Merc/Audi). I've survived (so far) my three score and ten. I also never use the boxes the give cyclists the priority at the front at traffic lights in case the front vehicle (BMW/Merc/ Audi) may be turning left and hasn't noticed me - I'd like to live a few more years.

In the absence of an Advance Stop Line (box) I'd tend to wait behind the front vehicle.

If there is an Advanced Stop Line (box) I'd put myself directly in front of the front vehicle, even if it is a BMW/Merc/Audi. Danger of them not noticing eliminated.

In fact, if I can get in front of them without an Advanced Stop Line (box) and sit directly in front I'll do so.

Got roundly abused by the driver of a Routemaster bus for doing that where Euston Station's bus stands exit into Eversholt Street 20+ years ago. As I was turning right towards Upper Woburn Place and he was driving a 73 straight on towards Kings Cross we were not even potentially conflicted.

Muppet

Edited by Bromptonaut on 31/07/2021 at 22:54

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - south wirral cyclist

I find it worrying that you've not looked at the highway code since 1971! A lot has changed since then. Although only some parts of the code ('must' rules) are backed up by law, if you are involved in an accidents and have breached a 'should' rule, then you could still be liable for prosecution for driving without due care and attention or dangerous driving.

I was also taught to go down through the gears when slowing down. It's not part of the highway code. Modern disc brakes usually power assisted are far more effective than the old drum brakes and as brake pads are much cheaper to replace than a gearbox it's now advised to use your brakes rather than your engine/gearbox.

When I was teaching my kids to drive I also found I had forgotten some of the basics. In particular the correct 'hand shuffle' method for steering.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - focussed

I find it worrying that you've not looked at the highway code since 1971! A lot has changed since then. Although only some parts of the code ('must' rules) are backed up by law, if you are involved in an accidents and have breached a 'should' rule, then you could still be liable for prosecution for driving without due care and attention or dangerous driving.

I was also taught to go down through the gears when slowing down. It's not part of the highway code. Modern disc brakes usually power assisted are far more effective than the old drum brakes and as brake pads are much cheaper to replace than a gearbox it's now advised to use your brakes rather than your engine/gearbox.

When I was teaching my kids to drive I also found I had forgotten some of the basics. In particular the correct 'hand shuffle' method for steering.

The reason that "brakes to slow - gears to go" was introduced into driver training was twofold.

1 - Using brakes to slow down signals to following traffic that you are slowing down via your brake lights, changing down to slow down doesn't.

2 - When teaching beginners to drive it's easier for them to brake to the speed they need and then select the gear they need, block changing 5th to 3rd or 4th to 2nd as necessary without having to change down through every gear.

More time for observation, less stress on the learner.

Nothing to do with wear on brakes or gearboxes!

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - galileo

When I was teaching my kids to drive I also found I had forgotten some of the basics. In particular the correct 'hand shuffle' method for steering.

Apart from "Roadcraft", the Police driving manual, who says it is the correct method for steering, especially as almost all vehicles now have power assisted steering?

Many "brakes to slow" followers tend to ride the brakes all the way down long gradients instead of dropping a gear or two.

Disc brakes are less subject to fade than drums but when necessary to stop at lights after a long descent, if the car is held on footbrake with hot discs this can lead to warped discs.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - focussed

"Many "brakes to slow" followers tend to ride the brakes all the way down long gradients"

That shows that you don't understand the difference between "Brakes to slow - gears to go" and being in the right gear for the circumstances in the first place!

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - galileo

"Many "brakes to slow" followers tend to ride the brakes all the way down long gradients"

That shows that you don't understand the difference between "Brakes to slow - gears to go" and being in the right gear for the circumstances in the first place!

On the contrary, I do understand the concept of being in the right gear, it s those who don't who use brakes instead, either because they were not taught, didn't understand or can't be bothered to change gear.

I've driven vehicle with 'crash' gearboxes, manuals, automatics, passed advanced driving tests and test driven development cars, I just despair at the standard of driving of many on the roads. Do I need to list the prevalence of tailgating, a major cause of the daily RTCs on motorways, poor positioning , failures of observation, driving distracted by mobile phone use?

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Andrew-T

When I was teaching my kids to drive I also found I had forgotten some of the basics. In particular the correct 'hand shuffle' method for steering.

Apart from "Roadcraft", the Police driving manual, who says it is the correct method for steering, especially as almost all vehicles now have power assisted steering?

In this context it's amusing to watch those TV programmes which follow the escapades of Police Interceptors, mostly in the north Midlands. Some steer like they would a fork-lift truck.

But of course they are under some time pressure ...

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Warning

The highway code does get updated time to time. Someone told me you can register for email updates.

www.highwaycodeuk.co.uk/changes-and-answers/the-hi...s

There is a downloadable copy of the Highway code (dated 2019).

(I don't know if this is an official web site, as it is n't .gov.uk).

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - daveyjp

As mentioned in this video, the presenter took 3 points or hitting a cyclist whilst turning left - 30 years ago!

https://youtu.be/EgAUAb3W0vA

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Bromptonaut

As mentioned in this video, the presenter took 3 points or hitting a cyclist whilst turning left - 30 years ago!

https://youtu.be/EgAUAb3W0vA

He seems to be saying that the cyclist, approaching from the rear, is at fault for not heeding the car's indicator and slowing.

Defensive riding would mean it is prudent to ease pedalling and dab the brake to stay behind. That however is not a defence for the driver's liability either in a civil claim or to a careless driving charge.

Let's suppose that instead of a cycle lane (or just a cyclist) our driver was in the outer lane of a an urban street and turned left across the bows of a car in his nearside blind spot and gets T-boned. Is the T boning driver at fault?

Having said that cycling up the nearside of queuing or slow moving traffic carries quite a lot of risk of which the left hook is just one. You're vulnerable to nearside passengers bailing out, pedestrians stepping off the kerb, joining drivers who look and don't see plus drains, grit/debris and slippery thermoplastic yellow/white line paint.

Better to overtake on the outside where drivers expect passing traffic to be.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Warning

What would happen if instead of the car, it turned out to be an HGV driver?

When I learned to drive, I was taught about blind spots. I would have never known how to read the road (even though I believed I knew everything). Some cyclists have paid with their lives. Cycling groups are hostile to any compulsory training.

Now the solution, is to put signs on the back of vans and lorries, don't pass them when they are turning left.

A cyclist has better visibility of the car, then the driver of has of the cyclist.

The above example is very simplistic.

What about a more complex situation such as this one?

www.cyclescheme.co.uk/files/Cyclists-at-traffic-li...g

Edited by Warning on 01/08/2021 at 14:58

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Engineer Andy

As mentioned in this video, the presenter took 3 points or hitting a cyclist whilst turning left - 30 years ago!

https://youtu.be/EgAUAb3W0vA

He seems to be saying that the cyclist, approaching from the rear, is at fault for not heeding the car's indicator and slowing.

Defensive riding would mean it is prudent to ease pedalling and dab the brake to stay behind. That however is not a defence for the driver's liability either in a civil claim or to a careless driving charge.

Let's suppose that instead of a cycle lane (or just a cyclist) our driver was in the outer lane of a an urban street and turned left across the bows of a car in his nearside blind spot and gets T-boned. Is the T boning driver at fault?

Quite right, and that almost happened to me (I reported it here many years ago) when an i**** overtook me and turned left onto the M25 at the roundabout with the A41 north of Walford. Scared the living **** out of me, so Lord knows what a cyclist would think of it, given how little protection they have against accidents.

Having said that cycling up the nearside of queuing or slow moving traffic carries quite a lot of risk of which the left hook is just one. You're vulnerable to nearside passengers bailing out, pedestrians stepping off the kerb, joining drivers who look and don't see plus drains, grit/debris and slippery thermoplastic yellow/white line paint.

Better to overtake on the outside where drivers expect passing traffic to be.

I followed that method when I was out cycling around my town in some traffic. In that circumstance I was turning right at a roundabout later on. Unfortunately many other road users don't like cyclists staying out on the RHS of a lane because it prevents the vehicle overtaking in heavy, but moving traffic (despite the difference being just a few meters for the most part).

HGVs in particular, plus they have a significant blind spot area, which often means cyclist have to just wait or risk 'overtaking' on the wrong side of the road. Ironically, roads with cycle lanes acutally make this particular problem worse, as it reduces the overall road width, making overtaking in heavy traffic either difficult or very risky indeed.

Negotiating the kerb area when many have not been swept in the past 18 months (even less so than usual) mean that it's even more hazardous than the normal avoiding damaged/sunken drains, potholes and suchlike.

Let's hope that the changes have a positive effect.

Edited by Engineer Andy on 01/08/2021 at 20:34

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - focussed

I note that in all of the previous replies on this topic there is no recognition of the fact that there is no obligation for pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders to read the Highway Code, unlike the drivers of motorised vehicles when passing their test, so how do these non-motorised users know how they are supposed to behave on the road?

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Xileno

There isn't but with the exception of youngsters I suspect quite a high percentage of the other groups also drive or have driven in the past.

I doubt many motorists even look at the Highway code after passing their test - unless they need to do a speed awareness course and they might want to refresh their memory before attending :-0

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Andrew-T

I note that in all of the previous replies on this topic there is no recognition of the fact that there is no obligation for pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders to read the Highway Code,

You've implied the answer to your question - those groups don't take a test (at least I don't think horse riders do). Perhaps they should, but it would be tricky to administer.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Engineer Andy

I note that in all of the previous replies on this topic there is no recognition of the fact that there is no obligation for pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders to read the Highway Code, unlike the drivers of motorised vehicles when passing their test, so how do these non-motorised users know how they are supposed to behave on the road?

Many of us who did their cycling proficiency at (primary) school definitely read the Highway Code well before learning to drive. In my area, there also was a inter-school team competition for knowing the Code as well.

The problem comes that most people, as Xileno pointed out, study The Highway Code in order to pass their driving test, then never look at it (including when parts get updated) ever again.

Whilst (hopefully) a good deal of what's in there is common sense and can be remembered, some is more involved or isn't something you come across on a regular basis, so it's a good idea to have a read through the Code every now and then to keep up to date. I probably should do so more than I have.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - south wirral cyclist

Over 80% of cyclists have driving licences, but I accept that there are a few cyclists on the road who may not have read the highway code. Many schools run bikeability courses which teach children how to ride on the roads and what the rules are.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Manatee

That's a terrible video from CyclingUK. I can't believe anybody intends that the cyclist should undertake the left-turning car while it waits for the ped to cross.

There is also repeated use of the term "right of way". There is really no such thing in this context, only "priority", and the HC doesn't use the term IIRC.

There is an ongoing consultation which I suggest is what to look at for anybody who wants to go to the source. You can also have your say.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/upload...f

Even the consultation uses "right of way" although not in the proposed HC wording which was probably written by somebody who actually knows what it means.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Alby Back
I've been a driver, a cyclist and a pedestrian all my adult life, and two of those for as long as I can remember. Grew up in a large city and cycled through it to and from school from the age of 9.

I genuinely can't recall any scenario where I've come into conflict with other road users, no matter what was my chosen method of propulsion, except on the rare occasions when I've been foolish enough to engage with that conflict. It almost always takes two to tango, and if you simply don't allow yourself to join in with the dance, most "situations" just fade away in moments.

My grandfather was a very early motorist, getting his first car before the First World War, my dad started driving in the 1920s, and I began driving in the mid '70s. Three generations with no "accidents" at all, ever. All, I think anyway, not least due to my grandfather's advice to assume that everyone else is possibly a fool or a psychopath or even both, and to avoid engaging with them at all costs.

;-)
Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Middleman

In fact, if I can get in front of them without an Advanced Stop Line (box) and sit directly in front I'll do so.

So does that involve your crossing the “stop” line when the lights are red?

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Brit_in_Germany

So does that involve your crossing the “stop” line when the lights are red?

Are you also offended when bikers do this?

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - south wirral cyclist

The new rule isn't 'asking' cyclists to pass vehicles indicting left on the left or motorcyclists to pass vehicles indicating right on the right. Should a cyclist or motorcyclist do this however, the driver would be expected to give way. It's all ready the case that pedestrians going straight ahead across a side road have prioirty over any vehicles turning into the side road and this is just extending that priority to cyclists. It's already the rule in most of Europe.

I do agree though that for a cyclist to pass a vehicle (particularly an HGV) which is indicating to turn and is about to do so would be foolhardy. It's much safer to always pass vehicles on the opposite side to the direction they are indicating. Sometimes drivers don't indicate until the last seond (or not at all) though!

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - sammy1

I think part of the Advanced driving code is called defensive driving and Advanced driver or not is something most sensible drivers adapt to.

I only wish that most cyclists adapt some form of looking out for themselves on our busy roads. For a cyclist to risk passing a car or an HGV on the inside when it is turning left is a suicidal action highway code or not

On another note, on Sunday morning there was a cyclist time trial on the A449 which is 20miles of duel carriageway with fast exit and joining junctions layby areas and a service junction. There were no signs posted to warn drivers that this was taking place and in the years that I have been driving I had never before seen a cyclist using this route. Yes it is legal but the road is almost the same as a motorway in the speeds that drivers use and in my opinion totally unsuitable for cyclists.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Andrew-T

Yes it is legal but the road is almost the same as a motorway in the speeds that drivers use and in my opinion totally unsuitable for cyclists.

I drive the Shropshire part of the A449 occasionally so I know what you refer to. However it is 2-lane everywhere IIRC, so there should always be space to see and avoid cyclists. Narrow lanes with blind corners are considered OK for cyclists but they have their own dangers.

Riders (and pedestrians) have equal rights on A-roads, so suggesting that they might be excluded is unfair. It's up to them to assess the risks and behave accordingly.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Bilboman

IMHO the driver of the "stronger" vehicle has a moral duty to watch out for the "weaker" one and try not to squash them like a fly. The lorry driver vis a vis the car driver, motorist - cyclist, cyclist - pedestrian. I have never turned left or (in Europe) right at a junction without first glancing over my shoulder to look out for cyclists. I remember kicking myself during my driving test when I once pulled away with a glance in the mirror and only a cursory look behind to check the road is clear, rather than a full swivel, and I made a mental note never to omit that again, as long as my neck muscles continue to work!
The motorcyclist's "lifesaver" is absolutely essential, as no amount of mirrors or blind spot warning devices or anything else can possibly see as well as a human eye. There's no excuse for a "SMIDSY"!
There are some interesting "default" driving rules here in Spain, and one of those is that at a junction, the vehicle going straight has priority over the one turning, and the right turner has priority over the left turner (opposite to the UK) when two cars are both turning into a perpendicular road. Similarly, at any unmarked junction, priority is to the vehicle on the right by default. A curious rule is that failure to indicate a turning or overtaking manoeuvre, even on an apparently empty road, is a fineable offence and most people outside Madrid follow that one.

Edited by Bilboman on 28/08/2021 at 19:25

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - bathtub tom

I recall, on my driving test, a cyclist pulled out of a footpath behind me as I was pulling away.

I suspect the examiner didn't see them, or ignored them.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - madf

I treat all cyclists as complete i****s with no common sense and suicidal tendencies.

That attitude has served me well as I have not hit one yet despite their proclivity to inane antics.

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - alan1302

I treat all cyclists as complete i****s with no common sense and suicidal tendencies.

That attitude has served me well as I have not hit one yet despite their proclivity to inane antics.

I treat everyone on the road like it..treats everyone equal!

Highway code changes - straight ahead priority - Bilboman

Darwin was hard at work here and nearly claimed another one on the streets of Barcelona. The obvious point is that the skater whizzed through a red light, so the fact that the bus was "going straight" and the skater "round a/the bend" was neither here nor there. But as heart stopping moments go, this one is pretty scary! bit.ly/2WLdKpN

Edited by Bilboman on 01/09/2021 at 20:17