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Certainly does sound ignition system related . Not seen ignition switch faults on these , although some models from 20 years ago did suffer switch problems and were subject to a recall. I would check engine bay fuse box for any connector issues . Don’t be put off by a brown greasy substance on the terminal blocks , this is anti corrosion paste .
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@SLO76 ...I initially thought that, but I tried the ignition on/off about 30 times, and it failed to replicate the issue.
I do wonder if it's relay related as Ive read about some CRV's suffering with dry solder joint issues in the PGM-FI relays. and unable to start the car when the engine is hot.
I'll take a look at the fuse box and relays to make sure there's no loose connections.
Edited by pdaly12 on 10/02/2020 at 14:52
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Have you noticed any other electrical functions that don’t work ? Windows , wipers , heater etc?
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No. All electrics appear perfectly fine. The only anomaly is immediately after the 'crank, no start' has happened, the car will then start and the SRS airbag light stays on until the ignition is turned off. Then all is fine for a while.
I have an ELM327 OBD2 scanner, I'll plug it in when I arrive home and see if there's any error codes.
Edited by pdaly12 on 10/02/2020 at 15:44
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I recall that according to information on Civinfo years ago there could occur a problem with the fuel rail pressure relief valve/pressure regulator(can't remember which it was) on 2.2 cdti diesel, same symptoms - crank no start, does not achieve minimum rail pressure to enable start. Part could be sourced from Bosch if needed.
Edited by focussed on 10/02/2020 at 16:17
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I recall that according to information on Civinfo years ago there could occur a problem with the fuel rail pressure relief valve/pressure regulator(can't remember which it was) on 2.2 cdti diesel, same symptoms - crank no start, does not achieve minimum rail pressure to enable start. Part could be sourced from Bosch if needed.
CPS is a common failure when they get hot and causes that problem, had it on mine though didnt replace it as it only happened when too hot
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The op states the dash does not illuminate. Nothing to do with the fuel injection system .
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Just arrived home and checked for error codes. There were no codes showing. Then when I finally managed to get the ignition on with the missing dash lights, It displayed a stored code of P0602 which suggests the ECU is failing.
From what I’ve read, Honda charge £1500 for a new ECU, maybe I need to chance a second hand one and see if Honda can reprogram the immobiliser chip in it.
Edited by pdaly12 on 10/02/2020 at 18:47
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Not so sure the Ecu is failing. I would think more likely the power or earth supply to it would be a possible problem .
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The issue is only on start up. There’s no issues when driving. I would’ve thought that if it was a faulty power feed or grounding then I’d have other issues whilst driving such as cutting out, power loss, etc.
Not sure if this is related, but the Honda doesn’t allow me to erase the error code. Likewise it does not store the DTC when the car is working normally (it seems to erase any codes previously read)
Edited by pdaly12 on 10/02/2020 at 19:05
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I wonder if it is one of the injection relays initially dropping out . Don’t forget with engine running , system is working with a higher voltage of around 14.5 volts . Can’t recall ever seeing an Ecu fail on one of these , but I guess there is always a first time .
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Thanks For the info.
I’ve checked the voltage with the ODB scanner and it’s reading 12.0v and with ignition on (not started) it then drops to 11.6. I’ll grab a voltmeter and check the battery across the terminals as the ODB is reading the voltage minus volt drops in the harness. The battery is only a year old so it shouldn’t be low on volts.
I’ve disconnected the battery for an hour tonight to see if it might help reboot the ECU. Then once Storm Ciara b*****s off I’ll then take an inspection of the harness, relays and fuses for oxidisation or corrosion.
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What you could do that may isolate the problem, is to remove each fuel injection relay in turn,(think they are located in the engine bay fuse box) ,then switch on ignition ,to see if this simulates the fault . Worth a try .
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my first thought would be a squirt of WD40 down the keyhole.
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Trying to locate the relays are problematic. There’s only a headlamp washer relay, glow plug, power windows, air con and one other (lack of documentation to work out, but when pulled, it ignition related.
only 4 under the hood, 1 interior. Looks like they’ve moved them on the 2007-10 cdti model
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Sorry, previous reply meant to say it’s NOT ignition key related as when pulled car starts normally with all lights illuminated. but i'll give it a squirt of WD-40 anyway.
WD-40 down the keyhole... not switch related as SRS, VSA, MIL, TSA, Brake lights all illuminate which are dependent on the position II ignition switch. So contact is fine.
Edited by pdaly12 on 12/02/2020 at 11:42
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Update: new battery fitted as old one was reading 11.9v when left overnight.
I have now discovered that the engine coolant temperature sensor is not behaving correctly.
The digital gauge is not rising, then all of a sudden it jumps up to approx 70’C However on the OBD tool, I can see the correct reading.
Also when the car refuses to start, and half the dash lights are missing, if I leave the ignition on, 2 mins later the lights reappear, glow plug lights up and car will start. However the coolant temperature sensor takes ages to climb up to the correct temp (even when the car is already hot).
Could this temperature sensor be causing an issue for the ECU, hence causing the Crank, No Starts?
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This is a tricky one . Honda electrics are pretty bomb proof, so this sort of problem can be difficult to trace . A faulty coolant temp sensor may cause bad or poor starting , but would not cause a complete no go . Engine temp on the Obd and displayed on the dash may show differently, it does on most cars . Something that did spring to mind . I guess this car has a crash / inertia switch that interrupts the injection system in the event of a bump . Perhaps you have a bad connection here . I think it’s located up behind the dash , above the pedals . The handbook should show it . You could by pass it as a test .
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Thanks. I did see a sensor above the pedals, bolted onto the chassis. I’ll take a look at that.
I’ve tested both ECT sensors and both open and closed circuits definitely doesn’t affect the Ignition. So good to rule that out as the engine block sensor send a signal to the ECU for fuel mix and I was had wondered if an open/closed circuit would tell the ECU to not start if the temps are at the extremities or even overloaded the ECU (unlikely, but was worth testing).
I’ve had problems trying to locate the key ignition related relays. All documentation, images on the web and the workshop manual appear to be petrol model related and show fuel pump, main relay, PGM-FI, and injector relays on the external fuse box, but this diesel model only has 3 relays on the fuel boxes (power windows, headlamp washer, aircon), a separate headlamp relay and glow plug control unit, there’s no other relays visible. So I’ve still not been able to test those key ignition related relays until I find them (hopefully it’s not built into the ECU) But when looking at the crash inertia sensor, I noticed 3 other sensors higher above it, randomly positioned between the bulk head and dash. These might be the missing relays I’ve been looking for. When I get a spare hour (rain arrived as I was finishing testing the ECT, I’ll see if I can get to them and check what they’re for and test if they’re engine related.
I’ll check them, then drop a line with the feedback. Hunting for these missing relays is like finding my virginity! ....it’s nowhere to be found! ??????
just as an update, I’ve always had a hunch it’s the main relay/pgmfi. After watching this, https://youtu.be/QVxOQTSPyGY I’m 99% certain it’s the relay as all the components that’s failing to power up are on the load side of the switch... it’s as if the solenoid is not powering up which brings me back to my original theory of a dry solder joint in the relay. ...I just need to find it as It’s going to be in the foot wells/behind the dash (somewhere! Lol)
btw thanks for your patience!
Edited by pdaly12 on 14/02/2020 at 21:10
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Fixed it with a refurbished ECU (with the data copied from the old ECU) and it only cost £180 which was much cheaper than I’d expected.
The issue had become so bad, I was sat in the car for 15 mins waiting for it to start, the last month its been impossible to start the car, the ignition lights refused to come on.
Even though I was looking for the or pgmfi relay, the symptoms were also showing that the ECU was not talking to the OBD tool. So when you search for problems with the CR-V‘s ECU, one of the common complaints is the ECU not communicating. I spoke to a few ECU specialists and they also confirmed that a cloned ECU should fix the starting issue.
I eventually found the location of the ECU... it was on the sidewall of the passenger footwell. First you need to remove glovebox, blower motor harnesses and the whole air blower housing unit (one nut holding it onto the bulkhead was a nightmare to gain access to). At one point you have to cut part of the lower dash in order to get the blower motor out, but don’t worry, it screws back in and it’s under the glovebox door.
instructions are on post #8 on here www.crvownersclub.com/threads/blower-air-con-fan-h.../
Then the ECU was easily accessible and easy to remove.
I sent the ECU off to these guys in Plymouth: www.cartechelectronics.com/ they cloned the ECU to a refurb one and and sent it back, all for £180. ...it arrived 30 mins ago, so I plugged in the ECU and the car starts normally once again. all ignition lights are showing ,it’s started 10 times in a row and I’m over the moon with it!
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