2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel

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Mon 9 Sep 2019 23:58
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Sulphur Man

A long while ago, I promised/threatened to give regular updates on buying and running a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel. Coming up to the 2yr anniversary now, so this is long overdue.

The following is the facts, purely objective.

What did I buy? 2008 Renault Koleos 2.0dci 4WD manual - 173bhp version, Privilege trim. Black. Additional front silver sump guard/bumper thing - factory-fitted. Registered new May 2008

When and where did I buy it? Sep 2017 - 2nd hand dealer in Swindon. Mileage on purchase: 84482

Provenance: Two previous owners - 1st was Renault West London dealership for a matter of weeks (assume demo, staff car) then one private owner. All main dealer servicing, including all invoices and work breakdowns, even the previous owners till receipts.

Condition on purchase: Immaculate, except for 1) small split in the front passenger seat leather stitching between left bolster join and seat base leather - only noticeable if you dug your fingers in there 2) a small supermarket ding near the rear fuel filler, no paintwork damage - very minor.

Price paid: £3800. (listed at £3995) It had been on the forecourt for 3 days, 'a trade in' said the dealer. No reason to doubt that having seen the paperwork.

VED - Band K £325/yr. Insurance - £280 pa fully comp (Aviva) 49yr old male, 12yrs NCB, parked off road. 15K mileage per annum

Now...before getting to the ownership experience, it's vital to present my 'use case' - as this directly influenced the choice of vehicle

Where do I live: North East Hants - Farnborough

Where do I need to drive: Mon-Fri daily commute to SW London (Richmond) - 50 miles round trip. Occasional longer drives per month - family visits, days out etc. Infrequent short drives under 5 miles. I enjoy cycling so always reach for a bicycle for short journeys unless its impractical. Rough estimate of overall use - 75% extra-urban, 25% urban.

Any off-roading? None yet.

How do I drive? Economically - use the engine torque (decent) to get up to speed and make sure it gets a healthy dose of sustained 2000-2500rpm for you know what. 6th gear at 70mph pulls 2200rpm.

What do I feed it? Shell V-Power diesel 95% of time, unless there's a reason I cant get hold of it (unlikely)MPG - I'm getting 39-41mpg very consistently, as it's official fuel consumption claims.

Mileage as of 0900 9th Sep 2019 - 110852

So....what has it cost thus far?All servicing and repairs by local independent garage, a Renault specialist.

Jan 2018 Service - Major - including brake fluid replacement - £352.40. Mileage 89640

Feb 2018 - after a hard overnight frost (the car is not garaged) I naively went to lower the passenger window. With the glass frozen into the frame, the internal door regulator arm ripped itself away from the glass. Initially, the window seemed to hold solid, but as the weather warmed it slipped down into the door itself. The repair was to replace the glass and refix to the still working regulator - £179 parts and labour.

Oct 2018 - on drive down to Devon for a half-term break, dash engine management light comes on. Car behaviour seemingly unaffected. Light remains on during stay, but clears on way home. Light then reappears on commute a few days later. Diagnosed as failed Proportional Richness Sensor. Garage advises car can be driven safely until next service. £216 parts and labour.

Nov 2018 Service - minor - £226. No issues. Mileage 100860

Aug 2019 - Rattle starts, coming from engine front driver's side, when under load or revved. Worst at cold, less worse when engine running at temperature. I thought timing chain and took to garage. Diagnosed as aux drive belt and crankshaft pulley. The pulley wheel had degraded with age. Aux drive belt kit and pulley replaced - Parts & labour £411

Aug 2019 - Service Intermediate - £302. New rear brakepads parts and labour £172. Mileage 110849

Replacement tyres - not yet needed. It came with almost new rubber. Fronts are matched, rears are different brand, also matched. Not overly concerned as this is not a 'quattro' 4WD - it's FWD unless provoked into 4WD. There is no rust that either I or my garage have found.

In summary....Purchase Price £3800

Servicing and consumables - £1052

Unforseen repairs of failed items, including avoidable frozen window - £806

Mileage covered since purchase - 26500

TOTAL COST - 2 yrs of motoring, exc fuel, insurance and VED - £5658

Finally, some subjective comments on the car itself.I targetted this model specifically, drawn to the fact it's Nissan developed and Korean built. Having owned a W124 Mercedes E280 and various Honda's this car compares favourably to those in terms of perceived build quality.

As of today, everything works. The a/c is a bit whistly, but blows cold. There are no rattles at all.

Things of particular merit...

Good ride quality. Generally refined at speed. Excellent visibility. Engine revs well, torque band wide. Comfortable over distance.

The leather upholstery is excellent quality - thick and very well fitted. Hardly any wear and tear, rear seats look like new. Much better than the black 'Dakota' leather in a previous BMW 120D I had. Comparable to W124 leather.

Paintwork seems of a high quality. Cubby holes everywhere, hidden ones, sliding drawers etc. Useful

Excellent BOSE stereo. Double sunroof is good. Rolling sunblinds in rear doors very handy with the children. Split tailgate great - takes 200kg load when lowered, superb for loading and changing wellies or sitting for a cuppa.

It's not a wide car, by SUV standards. Easy to thread.

Rear a/c vents raised up in B-pillars are great for rear passengers

Excellent Xenon lights - really wide dispersement

Nice to have an auto-dimming rear view mirror again, missed that.

Less impressive things.....

Bad ergonomics. The stop/start button, the cruise/limiter toggle, and the 4WD lock switch set closely next to each other at the bottom of the centre console, tucked behind the gearstick. I use cruise regularly and always have to look down to make sure I dont accidentally lock the 4WD at 70mph..

The gearchange is on the agricultural end of the scale. Clutch is fine, but the stick action is not precise. Not awful, but not up to the refinement of the rest of the car.

Will I keep it? Of course, until beyond economic repair. The purpose of raising this thread is invite comparison with PCP/new cash purchases, or newer 2nd hand purchases etc. It's also to throw some actual data at the DPF-equipped used car minefield.

Over to you forum members

SM

Edited by Sulphur Man on 10/09/2019 at 00:06

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 00:42
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - SLO76
Not one I would’ve recommended but you certainly didn’t overpay for it and it’s done you well thanks largely to you looking after it properly. It’s been a very cheap SUV with costs including depreciation but not including fuel, road tax and insurance of less than £2,000 a year which is good for a used SUV. I’m basing this on a realistic value of around £1,800 today assuming it’s in good order. It’s cost you £160 a month which is less than half of the cost of a new equivalently sized SUV.

By comparison my 2010 Toyota Avensis over the last year has cost me £130 for a service and £45 for an Mot. Depreciation assuming I’d sell it myself is around £650 so I figure it’s cost me £825 for years motoring excluding fuel, tax and insurance all of which I’d say will be similar to the big Renault. £68.75 a month for a large family car that’s to date been utterly reliable.

I love motoring on a budget. The thought of throwing away hundreds of pounds a month on a costly PCP or contract lease fills me with dread.

Edited by SLO76 on 10/09/2019 at 00:45

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 09:48
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - sandy56

My seven year old Honda CRV just had a major service, and keeps on trucking. All the toys work and it is still quiet and composed cruising on the motorway or on the country roads. The boot is huge and I have it full regularly.

Yes I will be keeping it for a while yet. No PCP, no loans, just normal maintenance.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 11:11
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Pica

My Honda CRV 2.2 iDtec EX auto is coming up to 10 years old now and 90K. The only thing that has gone wrong was the EGR pipe that developed a split and was replaced for free (after the warranty expired.) The car still drives like it did when new, no rattles or anything.

I bought the car new and It spent 6 years doing short 5 mile each way journeys to the office with the occasional longer run I have not yet had the DPF warning light on and try to only fuel it with Shell Nitro+ diesel. Also, I don't let it go more than 10000 miles without an oil change. WBAC says its worth only £5000 so I plan to keep it running until it expires I really do hope it will do another 90K without too much hassle or gets banned for being too dirty.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 13:46
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Andrew-T

.... or gets banned for being too dirty.

You don't live in Russia, do you ? :-)

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 10:25
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Andrew-T

<< The gearchange is on the agricultural end of the scale. Clutch is fine, but the stick action is not precise. Not awful, but not up to the refinement of the rest of the car. >>

Have you tried asking your indie to lubricate the gear linkages - I assume it doesn't have a direct gearchange? I had that done to my recently-obtained 24-y-o 306, made a noticeable difference.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 10:37
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Sulphur Man

I'll mention it at next service, if it gets appreciably worse. It's not awful, just vague and 'stirry'. I dont miss a gear or crunch. Perhaps I've been spoilt by years of Honda manuals.

One important note missed on my OP. There is no charge or mention in the paperwork of any DPF or EGR issue for the previous owner. Therefore I assume these are all the originals and untouched.

Another subjective note, it has excellent brakes, perhaps the best I've encountered. Why? It has large discs and pads. Because it's tall, narrow, and softly sprung, Renault fitted hefty brakes. Good thinking.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 10:40
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Andrew-T

I'll mention it at next service, if it gets appreciably worse. It's not awful, just vague and 'stirry'. I dont miss a gear or crunch. Perhaps I've been spoilt by years of Honda manuals.

I didn't miss any changes, the slots simply felt a little out of position, as it were. All fine now.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 11:10
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - CHarkin

Interesting post SM. Just for comparison I did a quick calculation on my own car bought new five years ago, cash purchase with no trade in. Previous car sold privately and £7500 discount of new car, a VW Sharan SEL 2.0 TDi. list price £34000 with a few options. Everything I can think of is included, depreciation, tax, insurance, maintenance, tyres, repairs and MOTs. Fuel and breakdown assist not included. I did include the cost of extra oil changes I did myself.

The total cost for five years is £16900 or £3380 per year which to me seems pretty good for a large fairly expensive car. The car still looks and drives like new. Over my ownership I have grown to respect this lump of a car, its quiet and relaxed to drive and a nice place to be. The DSG and electric handbrake are things I would be reluctant to do without now, they add to the relaxed easy going nature. Next car will be a Toyota Corolla estate when they sort out the security on the keyless entry.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 13:31
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Senexdriver
I did too many years of driving on a wing and a prayer to want to risk long-term ownership any more, but I do admire those who manage to keep a car going well into its old age as I hate the throwaway society we have become.

Yesterday evening as we were sitting on the sofa after dinner, my wife read out a text message she had received from one of her good friends. The background is that she and her husband both drive to work every day, in fact they are peripatetic teachers so they drive around between various educational institutions all day. She has a 59 plate Focus and he has an 07 plate Qashqai, both of which are petrol engined. The Qashqai has “died” which I take to mean has become beyond economic repair so they are trading it in for a new Fiesta under the Ford scrappage scheme. She will have the new Fiesta and he will continue with the Focus which now has 170,000 on the clock and is still going strong!

I have no idea how conscientious they are about servicing and what their running costs have been over the years, but they are certainly not wasting their money on fancy new cars for the sake of it. I can’t say the same for myself.
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Tue 10 Sep 2019 13:45
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Andrew-T
... they are certainly not wasting their money on fancy new cars for the sake of it.

I have never 'wasted' money on a new car - the closest I have been is an 8-month-old ex-demo runout-model Prairie which was useful while the kids were at uni, and my present Pug, also 8 months old, bought at Christmas at the bottom of the credit-crunch trough. Most of my other purchases have been 2 or 3 years old. Before I became a Pug devotee I used to change every couple of years, which was the standard thinking in those days, when buyers were easily found for used cars.

Now, our cars are 11 and 24 years old respectively - the older one has just replaced one approaching 30 ....

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 14:23
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Leif
I did too many years of driving on a wing and a prayer to want to risk long-term ownership any more, but I do admire those who manage to keep a car going well into its old age as I hate the throwaway society we have become. Yesterday evening as we were sitting on the sofa after dinner, my wife read out a text message she had received from one of her good friends. The background is that she and her husband both drive to work every day, in fact they are peripatetic teachers so they drive around between various educational institutions all day. She has a 59 plate Focus and he has an 07 plate Qashqai, both of which are petrol engined. The Qashqai has “died” which I take to mean has become beyond economic repair so they are trading it in for a new Fiesta under the Ford scrappage scheme. She will have the new Fiesta and he will continue with the Focus which now has 170,000 on the clock and is still going strong! I have no idea how conscientious they are about servicing and what their running costs have been over the years, but they are certainly not wasting their money on fancy new cars for the sake of it. I can’t say the same for myself.

They may well have done very well indeed. My experience has been that near the end of its life a car can become expensive to maintain, and it is cheaper to sell it on before it reaches that stage. That however is based on owning small cars, bigger ones may be better screwed together and/or designed.

As for new cars, one advantage of a new car is that you know it hasn't been thrashed, which can lead to expensive repairs later on. Each to their own, there is no right way to buy a car, and we all have our own particular needs.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 15:04
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - Engineer Andy

They may well have done very well indeed. My experience has been that near the end of its life a car can become expensive to maintain, and it is cheaper to sell it on before it reaches that stage. That however is based on owning small cars, bigger ones may be better screwed together and/or designed.

As for new cars, one advantage of a new car is that you know it hasn't been thrashed, which can lead to expensive repairs later on. Each to their own, there is no right way to buy a car, and we all have our own particular needs.

I suppose it depends on the original car and the new one - a well-designed car with relatively inexpensive parts and a bullet-proof engine/major parts can still be economical over a long period, right up until the day the rust consumes it.

Shelling out well over £10k, and now probably over £20k for a new car will likely more than cover years of maintenance and parts replacements - it's more often done because people don't want the hassle of having to take the car in for repairs and/or the chance of a breakdown if reliability is really important, job or personally-wise.

No problem with that, but if it's just looked at on cost (and I can fully appreciate this for some 'premium' and sports cars/makes, especially German ones [who charge a lot for parts and labour], or those not renowned for long-term reliability/longevity of ther cars), those reliable/dependable makes can offer the long-term buyer a very cost-effective ownership experience.

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Tue 10 Sep 2019 15:18
2yrs on from buying a 9yr old dpf-equipped diesel - gordonbennet

An interesting read Sulphur Man, another thread proving Renault are past their dire days of Laguna 2 and others of the period, but the initial depreciation still appears high on the products presumably due to now undeserved reputation?, and that depreciation has provided you with a good car that was excellent value, well played.

Proof also that looking after things and not neglecting them works.

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