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Strangely, this week's Autocar road test of the Model 3 reports a lot of road noise audible inside the cabin, where you'd think refinement would be one of an EV's strengths. They also say that the steering is heavy, which seems surprising.
It looks as if not only the heating and AC, but also the wipers are controlled by the touchscreen. Being temporarily 'blinded' by sudden spray from a lorry doesn't bear thinkng about.
I hope someone will come on here having had a drive in one. It may have virtues that compensate for the above.
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Anybody know why the SMMT lists all the cars on the August sales top ten apart from the Tesla which is just labelled "other"? Is it because Tesla don't have a dealer network?
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Tesla have "dealer stores". All purchases are on line.
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Strangely, this week's Autocar road test of the Model 3 reports a lot of road noise audible inside the cabin, where you'd think refinement would be one of an EV's strengths. They also say that the steering is heavy, which seems surprising.
It looks as if not only the heating and AC, but also the wipers are controlled by the touchscreen. Being temporarily 'blinded' by sudden spray from a lorry doesn't bear thinkng about.
I hope someone will come on here having had a drive in one. It may have virtues that compensate for the above.
Having driven a car with AC controlled by the touchscreen, IMO it’s downright dangerous or unusable. Having wipers the same is horrendous. A touchscreen is much cheaper than a touchscreen plus buttons. Ho hum. Save those pennies, count those beans.
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If one of the arguments about producing battery cars is about saving the planet then what is the point of making these cars into performance cars. Surely the same principles apply as with petrol or diesel cars more speed equals more fuel burnt and more emissions. So put your foot down in your performance Tesla and you have less range and more co2 coming out of the power station. Government should not be subsidising these things to the tune of £3500 but charging a realistic price for the electricity used
Porsche have made a new electric sports car the Taycan, 2 battery motors 0-62 in 2.8 secs are we really going the right way?
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Porsche have made a new electric sports car the Taycan, 2 battery motors 0-62 in 2.8 secs are we really going the right way?
Isn't that the same way internal combustion engined cars started out, only available to the wealthy until the technology became more conventional and filtered down to the masses.
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Porsche have made a new electric sports car the Taycan, 2 battery motors 0-62 in 2.8 secs are we really going the right way?
Isn't that the same way internal combustion engined cars started out, only available to the wealthy until the technology became more conventional and filtered down to the masses.
The difference back then was that general taxation didn't subsidise the buying of Rolls-Royces, unlike with expensive EVs have been. I wouldn't have had so much of an issue if subsidies had only gone on basic cars that were cheap to start with. I don't see why people who can already afford such luxury cars should get a taxpayer subsidised discount.
The same goes for cycles, where people got the VAT and tax taken off the purchase price if you bought them through your employer. They should have been for basic ones only, or done lease deals so they can be re-used, not for £2k racing road bikes that won't be used for commuting at all.
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I wouldn't trust any auto MSM magazine these days. One day testing or just comparing performance figures or time round a track is meaningless. Long term testing via ownership is far better, including when problems arise. Funny how reliability and faults are not mentioned ONCE in the report.
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I'm pretty sure the Model 3 as other Teslas still has a conventional stalk for indicators and wipers on the left.
Adjustments for the rain sensor etc. may be on the touchscreen.
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I wouldn't trust any auto MSM magazine these days. One day testing or just comparing performance figures or time round a track is meaningless. Long term testing via ownership is far better, including when problems arise. Funny how reliability and faults are not mentioned ONCE in the report.
Unless it is a long term test what test does? And how are they to judge long term reliability on what is essentially a new (to the UK) car anyway?
Who says the cars (either of them) had any faults on a road test?
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I wouldn't trust any auto MSM magazine these days. One day testing or just comparing performance figures or time round a track is meaningless. Long term testing via ownership is far better, including when problems arise. Funny how reliability and faults are not mentioned ONCE in the report.
Unless it is a long term test what test does? And how are they to judge long term reliability on what is essentially a new (to the UK) car anyway?
Who says the cars (either of them) had any faults on a road test?
This is my entire point - a brand new car is likely to not have faults, yet we continually read that owners of Teslas regularly have lots of faults that need fixing in the first year of ownership. A proper test in a long-term one over several weeks or even months. Some newspapers and this website do that for some cars, where problems show up.
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I wouldn't trust any auto MSM magazine these days. One day testing or just comparing performance figures or time round a track is meaningless. Long term testing via ownership is far better, including when problems arise. Funny how reliability and faults are not mentioned ONCE in the report.
Unless it is a long term test what test does? And how are they to judge long term reliability on what is essentially a new (to the UK) car anyway?
Who says the cars (either of them) had any faults on a road test?
This is my entire point - a brand new car is likely to not have faults, yet we continually read that owners of Teslas regularly have lots of faults that need fixing in the first year of ownership. A proper test in a long-term one over several weeks or even months. Some newspapers and this website do that for some cars, where problems show up.
You said it was strange they were not mentioned - I was asking how it could be mentioned when they are new cars - it's just a review between the 2 cars with pros and cons - it's not meant to be discussing reliability as they can't and expect they would have mentioned niggles had there been any.
You'll need to wait for long term tests to check reliability
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I wouldn't trust any auto MSM magazine these days. One day testing or just comparing performance figures or time round a track is meaningless. Long term testing via ownership is far better, including when problems arise. Funny how reliability and faults are not mentioned ONCE in the report.
Unless it is a long term test what test does? And how are they to judge long term reliability on what is essentially a new (to the UK) car anyway?
Who says the cars (either of them) had any faults on a road test?
This is my entire point - a brand new car is likely to not have faults, yet we continually read that owners of Teslas regularly have lots of faults that need fixing in the first year of ownership. A proper test in a long-term one over several weeks or even months. Some newspapers and this website do that for some cars, where problems show up.
You said it was strange they were not mentioned - I was asking how it could be mentioned when they are new cars - it's just a review between the 2 cars with pros and cons - it's not meant to be discussing reliability as they can't and expect they would have mentioned niggles had there been any.
You'll need to wait for long term tests to check reliability
That's the problem - most car mags and newspapers don't do long term tests across the board - its mostly performance and handling based tests on brand new cars as part of the manufacturers' marketing campaigns, them often (in my view) being overly friendly to the car manufacturers in reviews, especially those that pay for cushy all-expenses-paid testing days in nice places.
No different in my view to the access media and the entertainment industry. Lots of scratching of backs going on, save for a few truly independent media outlets (like HJ).
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Funny how reliability and faults are not mentioned ONCE in the report.
What is there were no faults? Would you want them to write that there were none?
And on a short test like this and with a new model like the Tesla how would you expect them to talk about the reliability when it won't be know?
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Ultimately the only cars that should pay zero VED should be economical electric cars, based partly on the maximum rate the motor(s) can drain the battery. All other cars, whether electric, petrol or diesel, should pay. At the moment, though, while we're still at the early adopter stage for electrics, I agree with the tax incentives for all. But it shouldn't last forever.
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Why should any vehicle pay zero VED they're still wearing the roads out using all the facilities the rest of us pay for and causing the same traffic issues, just as the recent changes though this is purely a honeymoon freebie period to get the numbers moving, once the fuel tax and VED revenue from wet fuel engined cars drops enough they'll put things back to a more level playing field...unless there's yet another brainwave that needs some more smoke and mirrors financial jiggery pokery to get taken up.
Govts have form for this.
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With both vehicles retailing at over £36k I think the owners can afford to pay VED and any other taxes!
Must be out of touch: am shocked that the BMW 320d costs that much! I guess people don’t care as long as they can afford the monthly payments...
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With both vehicles retailing at over £36k I think the owners can afford to pay VED and any other taxes! Must be out of touch: am shocked that the BMW 320d costs that much! I guess people don’t care as long as they can afford the monthly payments...
A mid-range Focus lists for nearly £25k these days so it isn't out of this world compared with anything else.
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With both vehicles retailing at over £36k I think the owners can afford to pay VED and any other taxes! Must be out of touch: am shocked that the BMW 320d costs that much! I guess people don’t care as long as they can afford the monthly payments...
A mid-range Focus lists for nearly £25k these days so it isn't out of this world compared with anything else.
I doubt if you'll get much in the way of a discount off a Tesla; a Focus, on the other hand can easily attract between 20 and 25% off the list price. It would take some time to get back the £16k saved by buying the Focus if you bought a Tesla instead, by which time, the Tesla's battery pack would not be in the same shape as it was when new, and well out of warranty.
No thanks.
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With both vehicles retailing at over £36k I think the owners can afford to pay VED and any other taxes! Must be out of touch: am shocked that the BMW 320d costs that much! I guess people don’t care as long as they can afford the monthly payments...
A mid-range Focus lists for nearly £25k these days so it isn't out of this world compared with anything else.
I doubt if you'll get much in the way of a discount off a Tesla; a Focus, on the other hand can easily attract between 20 and 25% off the list price. It would take some time to get back the £16k saved by buying the Focus if you bought a Tesla instead, by which time, the Tesla's battery pack would not be in the same shape as it was when new, and well out of warranty.
No thanks.
But does show common cars are not far off the price of the Tesla...Toyota CHR is £20 to £25k and they don't like discounting as they can sell them well. When you add the cost of the electric motor and a bit of profit premium they are not crazily priced.
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With both vehicles retailing at over £36k I think the owners can afford to pay VED and any other taxes! Must be out of touch: am shocked that the BMW 320d costs that much! I guess people don’t care as long as they can afford the monthly payments...
A mid-range Focus lists for nearly £25k these days so it isn't out of this world compared with anything else.
I doubt if you'll get much in the way of a discount off a Tesla; a Focus, on the other hand can easily attract between 20 and 25% off the list price. It would take some time to get back the £16k saved by buying the Focus if you bought a Tesla instead, by which time, the Tesla's battery pack would not be in the same shape as it was when new, and well out of warranty.
No thanks.
But does show common cars are not far off the price of the Tesla...Toyota CHR is £20 to £25k and they don't like discounting as they can sell them well. When you add the cost of the electric motor and a bit of profit premium they are not crazily priced.
The difference is that I would suspect that the Toyota will be around well after the tesla finds itself on the scrapheap, not becuase its an ICE engined car, but because its far better built. But even if discounts were small, that's still £10k - £15k saving which would take a LONG time to claw back, plus the ICE car has far greater range. The Tesla might have a great 0-60 time, but they can only do the speed limit.
I just think they are over-rated.
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The residuals on current Teslas are superb. They Model S for example holds it's price way better than anything equivalent in size and new price.
Thus far they seem to be holding up very well. The Model 3 may be a different animal and it remains to be seen how the market reacts to it but in the short term at least I bet it will have much better residuals than a Focus or a 320d for that matter which mitigates the new price to a certain extent.
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The residuals on current Teslas are superb. They Model S for example holds it's price way better than anything equivalent in size and new price.
Thus far they seem to be holding up very well. The Model 3 may be a different animal and it remains to be seen how the market reacts to it but in the short term at least I bet it will have much better residuals than a Focus or a 320d for that matter which mitigates the new price to a certain extent.
Largely becuase up to date, very few for sale in anything but Tesla outlets.
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With both vehicles retailing at over £36k I think the owners can afford to pay VED and any other taxes! Must be out of touch: am shocked that the BMW 320d costs that much! I guess people don’t care as long as they can afford the monthly payments...
A mid-range Focus lists for nearly £25k these days so it isn't out of this world compared with anything else.
I doubt if you'll get much in the way of a discount off a Tesla; a Focus, on the other hand can easily attract between 20 and 25% off the list price. It would take some time to get back the £16k saved by buying the Focus if you bought a Tesla instead, by which time, the Tesla's battery pack would not be in the same shape as it was when new, and well out of warranty.
No thanks.
But does show common cars are not far off the price of the Tesla...Toyota CHR is £20 to £25k and they don't like discounting as they can sell them well. When you add the cost of the electric motor and a bit of profit premium they are not crazily priced.
The difference is that I would suspect that the Toyota will be around well after the tesla finds itself on the scrapheap, not becuase its an ICE engined car, but because its far better built. But even if discounts were small, that's still £10k - £15k saving which would take a LONG time to claw back, plus the ICE car has far greater range. The Tesla might have a great 0-60 time, but they can only do the speed limit.
I just think they are over-rated.
I think they are overrated - but just don't think they are overpriced for the market that they are in. There are plenty of other cars of a similar price on the roads so people are buying them.
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Tesla did not feature In Septembers' s top 10 - apparently
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Tesla did not feature In Septembers' s top 10 - apparently
Imagine my surprise.
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I've seen several reviews of the Model 3 by people who were doubters but, in every case, after trying the car they thought it was amazing.
Edited by Sofa Spud on 04/10/2019 at 16:03
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