What is life like with your car? Let us know and win £500 in John Lewis vouchers | No thanks
SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

I've been in the market for a used SUV - family friendly, but with a good mix of premium feel and economy. I'm not looking for other options really, as it's been done to death thus far; I've narrowed it down to the following:

- Volvo XC60 (D5244T* engine, but potentially a DRIVe in the right spec)

- Ford Kuga 2.0 TDi Titanium X (or Sport Pack, spec is a bit hard to follow in the ads)

- Mazda CX-7 2.2D

These are based on being models available for under £7k (more I save, the more I can spend on the house), with heated seats and potentially nav-level spec, yet having the potential for over 40mpg on a run (real mpg figures are positive on this aspect).

The CX-7 is simple, as there isn't really any spec at all - the only choice in the diesel years seemed to be the paint colour. The Kuga seems to be difficult to find with heated seats, but they exist, and the XC60 seems hard to find in D5 type spec, whilst still retaining the DRIVe simplicity (FWD, lower tuned higher economy engine etc).

I used to work for Ford, and later Volvo, and drove plenty of XC60s and have a good technical service knowledge of them, but I didn't really pay much attention to the drive on the pre-2014 models, and I don't really have any knowledge of foibles/weaknesses. I know very little about the CX-7, but I guess there's probably some part sharing across them all.

Anyone have any opinions/experience on any of the three?

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - FiestaOwner

I don't have personal experience of any of these cars.

However the advice given on this forum consistently is don't touch a diesel Mazda! They have a reputation for expensive engine failures!

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

From what I can figure out, there appear to be two separate issues.

The 2.0 MZR-CD regenerates by diesel injection, which can cause oil dilution issues like the Volvo D5 engine used to suffer with - this eventually causes issues and spun BE Bearings and so on.

The 2.2 MZR-CD (in the CX-7) suffers from injector seal leaks, which then cause the same oil dilution, carbon-coking the oil pickup strainer, then causing oil starvation and the same potentially terminal issues.

I'm not sure if the 'answer' to avoiding the issue would be to replace/check the strainer, then keep an eye on the injector seals.

I think I'm also worried about the holy trinity of issues (injectors, flywheel, fuel pump) that at least seemed prevalent with the older applications (in the Mondeo and so on). It seems like you simply couldn't do anything but hope it wouldn't happen, although I've not read anything to suggest the Kuga suffers?

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - Avant

Does it have tio be a diesel? Yoiur budget suggests you're looking at something several years old, and at the stage where diesels - not only Mazdas - can fail very expensively.

That said, a diesel will be much easier to find, as when cars of this vintage were new, we were being encouraged to buy diesel. Ford's 2.0 CDTI has a fairly good reputation, so if it needs to be a diesel this could be your best bet, as Fords are likely to be cheaper than Volvos of the same age.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

Petrol engines can also fail expensively though - you have plugs to service, coil packs to be concerned about, plus a plethora of additional emissions components (cat(s), O2 sensors, EGRs) - especially the current 1.8 shed which offers a combination of underwhelming power, economy and reliability.

What doesn't help is that none of the models I'm looking at are readily available with petrol engines - not unless you choose, for example, the ultimately expensive, poorly spec'd and older turbo CX-7.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - SLO76
I won’t recommend any of these three on such a limited budget. All of them will have the potential to c****** you via hugely expensive failures. DPF, DMF, turbo etc etc etc etc. If you want something reliable and economically viable then forget buying a complex diesel SUV until your budget will allow a good one. If you absolutely must have an SUV for under £7k then get a petrol Honda CRV or Toyota RAV4.
SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

Is that based on any experience, or simply the "don't buy a used car" rhetoric?

As mentioned, I worked at Volvo and can confirm with utmost confidence that DPF, DMF and Turbo problems on the D5244 are incredibly uncommon.

Every car has its flaws, and they exist regardless of whether they are 2 weeks old or 10 years old, so I'm not sure how the blanket approach is constructive, even though I appreciate the time you took to reply.

Edited by engine on 07/11/2018 at 23:42

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - badbusdriver

But the flaws in a petrol engined RAV-4 are limited to being a little thirstier than you'd like coupled with an engine which needs to be worked hard compared to a torque rich turbo diesel. The flaws on the Mazda 2.2 diesel is quite likely to cost you thousands of pounds. And there have been quite a few posts in the 2 years I have been a member of the forum on just that subject. As for the other two, if you have so much technical and driving experience of them I'm not really sure what you are asking for?. Personally I'd take the advice of an ex motor trader (SLO)

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

"if you have so much technical and driving experience of them I'm not really sure what you are asking for?"

Because driving and knowing the technical and servicing routine is a completely different experience to owning a car on a daily basis.

Just the same as a Trader will only know the quality of a car based on the quality of his stock (i.e. a trader who tries to make money on the cheap and leggy cars at auction will have a poor opinion of certain models, as opposed to one who exclusively buys well serviced/lower mileage ones).

"The flaws on the Mazda 2.2 diesel is quite likely to cost you thousands of pounds."

All I'm asking for is a bit of information on what things go wrong, so an informed judgement can be made. If you spend time on any forum, you'd never buy any second hand car if you assumed that what happens to one, happens to all.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - badbusdriver

If you spend time on any forum, you'd never buy any second hand car if you assumed that what happens to one, happens to all.

That is just not the case, you may not want the kind of car being recommended, but that is a seperate issue. You are free to buy whatever car takes your fancy, including a Mazda CX-7 with the 2.2 diesel. But if you come on a forum asking for advice without being willing to accept what you are advised then there is little point in asking.

As i've said, there have been quite a few threads re the failure of the Mazda engine during the 2 years i have been a forum member, including one where i found and posted a link to an Ebay advert for a company doing re-con Mazda diesels, but i have neither the time or inclination to look for them in order to convince you. Personally, i would not be willing to take the risk unless buying new and getting rid of before the warranty is up.

As for your comments about traders, firstly, the only ones selling cheap leggy cars at auction are just trying to get rid of tat as opposed to making money, otherwise the cars would be on a forecourt. It may well be the case that any slightly dodgy trader will not know or care which cars are reliable, because they will know how to wriggle out of any major claim for repairs. But any long term reputable trader most definately is going to have a very good knowledge of which cars are reliable or not because any problems will result in the customer complaining and expecting the problem to be fixed.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - drd63
Well yes and I hope it helps. I ran an 09 plate Kuga from new for just over 3 years and 95k miles. It was a Titanium fwd 2.0d with 138 (I think bhp). Averaged about 42mpg. I thought it was great and apart from blowing near side headlight bulbs was faultless, comfortable and always felt quicker than on paper figures. Lovely ride but also handled well. Good manual gearbox. It did great day to day service on long commute and also did 3, 4 up ski trips to the Alps and another 4 up trip to SW France in the summer. Although only fwd the ride height allowed some pretty serious off-roading in the Pyrenees on a caving expedition, nice dry rocky tracks so grip not a problem and snow chains dealt with deep snow on one skiing trip. Overall it had a pretty active and quite tough life, I only changed it because I fancied a change! It was a great car. Just had a quick look on autotrader and 2010/11 models seem to be available with c70k miles. I don’t see that as a risky purchase, rather great value if mine was anything to go by. Let me know if any more specific info needed
SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - sandy56

Anyone looking to buy an old cheap diesel is asking for trouble. There is a huge amount of info available on the costs of running an old diesel, including on this site. Car owners forums and your own experience will tell you all you need to know.

It is your call. Good luck.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - daveyjp

I'm not surprised you had no problems. 30k+ miles a year is exactly what diesels thrive on.

A 2010 with 70k has done far less than this and may be being sold due to issues which won't be fully revealed to a purchaser.

Speaking to my Subaru dealer last week he for one won't be sorry to see the back of the diesels due to the headaches they can cause for him and customers at 6-8 years old.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - SLO76
“Is that based on any experience, or simply the "don't buy a used car" rhetoric?”

Just two decades or so of being in the motor trade as a salesman and later a home trader. I’ve bought and sold thousands of cars over that time and advised many people on what to buy and how to buy it and this isn’t the first time I’ve tried to talk someone out of buying something their budget won’t reliably grant. I’ve seen a fair number of folks who went ahead anyway fall foul and left with crippling bills they couldn’t afford.

I’d keep it simple and go for something with a far less complex petrol motor, preferably Japanese but that said and if forced to pick from these three and assuming it’s in good condition with spot on history I’d go for the Kuga with the 2.0 PSA diesel and manual gearbox. It’s your best chance as your money will get a younger, lower mileage example than the Volvo which is still very much in demand. Just watch for the DPF having been removed and check carefully for any signs the DMF is on its way out and don’t touch a Powershift.

The Mazda is a total liability with a Diesel engine and best avoided. As a reminder there’s one sat outside my local Mazda dealer involved in a dispute after engine failure. They’ve punted it out onto the street now and it’s been sat looking sorry for itself on flat tyres for months now. Not a good advert for the firm.


SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

Again, appreciate the advice, but you seem to be flawed in thinking that my purchase budget is somehow all I can afford, and that I would be at the mercy of anyone else if any issues arose.

The reality is that a £10k example of what I'm after is (in this circumstance) in no better position, and will still be out of manufacturer's warranty, the same MY and the exact same car. Just a bit younger. I have no issues with high mileage,as with diesels it is, more often than not, a misnomer. Why spend twice the money on something that has had half the maintenance?

(an example here is the Volvo D5 - timing belt interval is 6y/108k. If you buy an example that is the wrong age/mileage, you'll have an extra £600+ to spend on essential maintenance)

The main thing I'm trying to avoid is a money pit. I had an R50 MINI after not enough research, and it was a constant battle to keep the thing roadworthy. The only thing I can find out so far about the Mazda 2.2 is related to the oil pickup strainer - something that can easily be prevented from causing an issue.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - SLO76
Best of luck, keep us informed on how you get on. Hopefully you don’t get stung with another money pit.
SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - pd

Volvo timing belt only books at 1.2 hours on the 5-cylinders so not a major issue. The auxiliary belt and tensioner is probably more important to keep on top of on those as there have been reports of early failures.

I'd forget the Mazda. Too much risk.

You don't say if you want manual or auto. Both the Ford/PSA 2.0 and Volvo 5-cylinder are well proven engines which don't have many inherent flaws. Neither are known for DPF issues although the pressure sensor pipes perish on the Ford (can be fixed with any 6mm silicon hose).

The DMF can be a weakness on the Ford but fairly easily checked.

Bear in mind the Kuga is based on the smaller, cheaper Focus platform and the XC60 on the Mondeo one so arguably sits in a class slightly below.

The autos on the Volvo can start to get a bit ragged after 100k miles.

The Volvo feels a more relaxed, comfort oriented expensive car to drive but the Kuga is possibly a bit more fun.

Both are decent cars, a lot is down to personal choice.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - madf

My experience of the technical advice on this forum is that there a few very experienced people who base their comments on real world experience..

And too many sob stories from people whose car buying techniques lead to all sorts of (expensive) issues.

..

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

madf - yes, I agree with the sentiments.

I'm finding it quite frustrating to actually get real life ownership experience of things I'm looking at, especially without people saying "buy a Rav4".

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - jthan

My "real life ownership experience" is that SLO's petrol RAV4 suggestion was spot on. I'll soon have had my example for 5 years, during which time it has been totally faultless (unless you count a trim squeak that annoyed me in the first year but which I tracked down and resolved myself) and I have every confidence it will give good service for many more years - more so than with any other car I've had after the first few years. My average mpg (albeit my driving is predominantly shortish runs in town) is 28.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

pd - Yes, the aux belt tensioner was a recall (or a 'service measure', to be exact), so any one that's been to a Volvo garage in the last 2 or 3 years would have had it done in fairness. Unless they went somewhere terrible.

I'd prefer auto, but not too fussed either way. I enjoy the simpler drive with an auto, but appreciate the economy a manual can offer.

I've had to rule out the Kuga, unfortunately, as it has a pretty awful boot capacity (that I found out about after far too much research/planning)

Edited by engine on 09/11/2018 at 21:25

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - jgrahampo

Take a look at the Honda CRV. I bought an 07 plate one this May 2.2 cdti (no DPF), 75000 miles now on about 83k. Very impressed with it.

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - concrete

I have a Volvo XC60 D4. It is diesel, but I do tow a caravan and prefer diesel for that purpose, although with the looming changes petrol will have to be considered eventually. Hybrid for towing is really not much of an option at present. Of the three models mentioned I would prefer the Volvo. Mine had been good with no trouble at all in 19 months. It also has heated seats, front windscreen and washers. My brother in law has a Kuga. he has had several niggles but no real disasters, but I don't think he will have another. If you don't tow and do less than about 18k miles per annum then petrol would be the way to go. Again the Volvo would win out for me.

Cheers Concrete

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - engine

The petrol XC60 offers little economy or reliability over the diesel - it's a turbo lump with combined average of low 20's mpg, plus £555 pa VED.

May well go and view one or two D5s this week

SUV choice: XC60/Kuga/CX-7 - Happy Blue!

Shame about that. I had a 2009 S-Max with the same engine and it was excellent despite the low miles I did. Checking the MoT history the car is still running with a decent mileage added on.

I know people who drove the CX7 without incident. The XC60 is clearly a popular car with probably lots of second hand choice.