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Sat 10 Jan 2015 14:20

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

Hi,

I am looking for some advice regarding a NIP for speeding.

I have received this NIP for a vehicle I do not recognise, never driven or owned. DVLA have confirmed the vehicle doesn't belong to me, but it seems either a colossal mistake has been made or someone is trying to game the system by nominating me as the driver at the time.

I've looked on Google maps to see where the incident took place and can confirm that it must have been a Gatso speed camera that takes a picture of the back of the vehicle, as it is the only speed camera on the road where this alleged offence took place.

Now obviously, I can not provide any details as to who owns the vehilce or who was driving the vehicle, because I know nothing about it. I am thinking about writing a cover letter to that affect, but I've noticed that not providing this information could leave me liable to the offence of failing to provide the information.

What is the best course of action to deal with this and do I have any defences for not being able to provide the information they require?

The law around this seems a little screwy when it comes to falsely alleged drivers who do not own the vehicle or know anything about it.

Thanks

Jimmy

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 14:35

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - Bromptonaut

Presumably the NIP has been issued by the relevant police force for the area where the camera is situated.

I would simply reply to the NIP with a summary of the circumstances as set out above. Stick to fact without diviating into conjecture about gaming the system.

AFAIK the obligation to name the driver rests with the registered keeper. If you can show you are not the RK of the Picasso you should be safe from any risk of proseution for failure to name.

May be worth telephoning the issuing office and seeking their advice.

Don't ignore anything and chase up if you don't get a timely reply.

Hope this helps and keep us posted.

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:06

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

Thanks for your reply. I've never had a NIP before. Everything I read makes it sound like I could be prosecuted for failure to provide information, but of course, how is this possible if you don't recognise the vehicle, have never owned it and even your friends and family don't recognise it.

How common is this? Is it likely a mistake?

To me, it looks like some has intentionally named me, which leads me to think that they have done it on purpose, but again, how do you prove this if you don't know anything about the vehicle or owner and DVLA won't release the information?

What will happen when I sent it back with the cover letter stating I know nothing about it? Will it go back to the registered keeper, or will they insist on chasing me?

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:13

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - SlidingPillar

Is there a number to ring on the letter? First NIP will go to registered keeper and somebody thinks that is you.

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:16

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

The offence took place over a month ago, so I assume that the registered keeper got the first NIP and nominated me otherwise it would be invalid?

There is a number but they are closed and the automated service says they cannot deal with offences over the phone

Edited by Jimbo2015 on 10/01/2015 at 15:17

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:34

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - Dwight Van Driver

Do as Bromptonnaught advises ^^^^^^^^

Whilst there is the offence of failing to name driver a defence is open to the Reg Keeper in that if he did not know and could not without due diligence ascertain who that person was.

However under the second part of the offence - requirement on any person to name driver (usually after Reg Keeper has nominated someone and NOIP sent to that person) this defence is not available.

BUT

it does state requirement to give any information which is in his power to give and may lead to the identification of the driver.

Clearly is the case of the poster he can prove he has no such information or involvement so does not commit the offence of failing to name.

so..write tat letter with all the evidence of non involvement.

dvd

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:50

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

Ok. Thanks DVD. I will do that. I think I had family round on the date/time the offence took place. Would it be worthwhile getting a written statement from them?

I forgot to ask, do I just send it recorded or will I have to have some certify that I have sent it? And do I need to look at the photographic evidence first to show that I have done my best (I don't see how it will help under these circumstances)?

Edited by Jimbo2015 on 10/01/2015 at 16:04

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:39

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - Bromptonaut

I got one in the Autumn for failure to stop at a red light in Leicester. It took about a week from offence to NIP arriving in my letterbox.

In that case it looked as though all the vehicle details and my name/address had been transferred automatically from DVLA. It's possible, with an element of manual input to the system, that somebody has miskeyed a reg number on making inquiry to DVLA and thus got wrong keeper details. Does the number of the Picasso have any similarity to that of any car you do own?

Presumably you've never hired a Picasso either or had one as a courtesy car.

DVD who's responded is (IIRC) ex plod and knows his stuff. There's also plenty of free legal resource on net.

Assuming you're being open and honest all you can do is reply stating the facts and see what happens.

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:45

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

The number plate is completely differently. I've never driven this kind of car or driven in the location where the offence took place.

I greatest worry is about the offence of failing to provide information. It's a catch 22 - I don't know the car, its keeper or anything and no authority will release that kind of information.

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:33

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - brighteyes

To cover all bases I sugest you reply to the NIP formally pleading "Not Guilty" and lay out your reasons for this, sticking strictly to the facts. Please don't try to be smart or include supposition as the CPS usually take a dim view. Once this has been done it is up to the CPS/police to sort out. One more thing, send the letter recorded delivery and photocopy everything you receive or send regarding this case.

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:38

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

Thanks. I will write a letter to that affect. Should I request in the letter that this be investigated because it is either a mistake or a false statement?

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:44

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - Bromptonaut

Personally, at this stage, I would stick to stating facts that you've no knowledge of vehicle or event.

If it's a clerical c ock up they'll explain and hopefully apologise

If somebody has named you to escape prosecution I'd guess Police will investigate off their own bat. They're usually pretty keen to make examples of folks who pull stunts to avoid prosecution. Perverting the course of justice is in serious offence territory with a custodial sentence a real possibility.

PLenty well publicised cases.

Edited by Bromptonaut on 10/01/2015 at 15:49

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 15:51

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

If it is a mistake, then hopefully it will be cleared up quickly. If someone has done it on purposes, I really hope the police pursue because it just isnt right.

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 20:17

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - JimmyLemon

I know I've posted this above, but I was wondering if I should include a statement from family who were with me on the day and also is it sufficient to send the notice back record delivery or do I need a professional to certify that I have sent it?

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Sat 10 Jan 2015 23:18

Citroen C3 Picasso - Notice of Intended Prosecution - Speeding - galileo

I know I've posted this above, but I was wondering if I should include a statement from family who were with me on the day and also is it sufficient to send the notice back record delivery or do I need a professional to certify that I have sent it?

Search for my post in legal matters on a similar problem in July last year - recorded delivery letters to DVLA and the relevant Court sorted the matter.

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