What is life like with your car? Let us know and win £500 in John Lewis vouchers | No thanks
Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Sulphur Man

Damned if you do, damned if you dont

www.honestjohn.co.uk/news/legal--motoring-advice/2.../

Might be burgeoning market for 'dummy' DPFs.....

Edited by Honestjohn on 05/01/2014 at 10:47

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - elekie&a/c doctor

Interestingly the mot is a visual inspection only.So the dpf could be present with no guts internally.Also,the current mot emission equipt is unable to identify the presence of a dpf or not by the smoke test.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - daveyjp
I overheard a mechanic saying they 'remove' a DPF by using a cold chisel and lump hammer on the filter, tip the bits out, refit and reprogramme the ECU.
Missing DPF? MOT Fail - coopshere
A step in the right direction but still woefully short of being able to measure the emission figure against original output. Bit of a fudge really.
Missing DPF? MOT Fail - artill

Excellent news. Of course i can see people still removing the things, and re fitting just for the test.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - skidpan

About time, lets hope the MOT garages do their jobs properly.

Its going to cost people on the Seat site a fortune.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - RT

There will of course be a market for empty DPF canisters to fit in place of a working DPF !!

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - madf

An enpty DPF will fail the hammer noise test...

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Gibbo_Wirral
Its not like swapping the CAT with a straight-through pipe - to remove the DPF it often involves re-programming the ECU otherwise you'll have a differential pressure fault and the car will be in limp mode, as well as disable the additive components, if the car uses a DPF cleaning additive.

Plus there's no straight-through pipe for many cars, so the guts of the DPF are usually core drilled out.

Edited by Gibbo_Wirral on 06/12/2013 at 13:30

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Hamsafar

There's going to be an awful lot of bankrupt bus companies if this is enforced.
Thankfully, the MOT Testers handbook says: if in doubt, assume that the DPF is present.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - dan86

Buses use the sane system as lorries witch uses adblue. Our trucks have adblue and like buses are always on the road and never have a problem with warning lights related to emissions. But I have no idea how the system works.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - fluffycontractor
So the testers will simply look for a bulge in the pipe and mark the car as having a sufficient functioning DPF filter with no further checks?

Are these guys really that stupid?

"It is an offence under the Road vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations
(Regulation 61a(3))1 to use a vehicle which has been modified in such a way that it
no longer complies with the air pollutant emissions standards it was designed to
meet. Removal of a DPF will almost invariably contravene these requirements,
making the vehicle illegal for road use."


www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attac...f

Edited by fluffycontractor on 04/01/2014 at 09:28

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - RT
So the testers will simply look for a bulge in the pipe and mark the car as having a sufficient functioning DPF filter with no further checks? Are these guys really that stupid? "It is an offence under the Road vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations (Regulation 61a(3))1 to use a vehicle which has been modified in such a way that it no longer complies with the air pollutant emissions standards it was designed to meet. Removal of a DPF will almost invariably contravene these requirements, making the vehicle illegal for road use." www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attac...f

Law-making and methods of enforcement are often completely independent.

The MoT test instruction has to be proportionate to the cost of the test.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - mss1tw

There's going to be an awful lot of bankrupt bus companies if this is enforced.
Thankfully, the MOT Testers handbook says: if in doubt, assume that the DPF is present.

Excellent :-D

I wonder, what are the energy and pollution costs are of manufacturing DPF's (And the new cars in which they are fitted).

Do the DPF manufacturing plants have DPF's on their chimneys?

If so, does the manufacturer of the DPF plant DPF, have a DPF?

If you want to be 'green' run a well-serviced engine of a size sufficient to your needs, for as long as viable. And I don't mean throwing it away when the Magic Tree needs changing.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - RT
If you want to be 'green' run a well-serviced engine of a size sufficient to your needs, for as long as viable. And I don't mean throwing it away when the Magic Tree needs changing.

And diesels run in those ideal conditions without a DPF still produces fine soot particles which cause cancer.

Other people care about cancer.

Edited by Avant on 04/01/2014 at 20:28

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - mss1tw

"Other people care about cancer."

I'm an electrician (asbestos risk) who's grandfather died of lung cancer. So that quite laughable, 'Think of the children' style retort is not worth my while debating further.

My point of view doesn't make me immune from cancer either. I might get it from one of these particles.

Doesn't change my opinion already stated.

Life has a 100% mortality rate.

Edited by Avant on 04/01/2014 at 20:28

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Ordovices

Population at 2011 census =63.2 million

Removing all particulate matter (not just car generated) will add 36.5 million years of life over the next 100 years. That is 36,500 life years added, each year, to the UK population.

According to the government frightener, that will add six months life expectancy to all new births. However if you work it out on the whole population, then it adds 16 days each (if you live to be 80). But that assumes that there is no population increase for the next 100 years.

Over 80 years of life, if you got up 1.2 minutes earlier each day, your effective living and doing stuff time would be the same as if we hadn't bothered removing all particulates.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Hamsafar

Look out of your window at all the chimneys.

Most older houses have around six pots, most long since capped off with a short vent. Add to that all the tall industrial chimneys that you could see before the 1980s and the fact that all cars ran rich and chugged and smoked and had lead in the fuel, you realise that the air is much cleaner than it has been for >500 years.

Industrial-Revolution.jpg

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - mss1tw

Look out of your window at all the chimneys.

Most older houses have around six pots, most long since capped off with a short vent. Add to that all the tall industrial chimneys that you could see before the 1980s and the fact that all cars ran rich and chugged and smoked and had lead in the fuel, you realise that the air is much cleaner than it has been for >500 years.

Industrial-Revolution.jpg

You are right, (Although, most of our pollution has simply been out sourced to China. Out of sight, out of mind.) but I think we are chasing ever smaller gains in cleanliness at the expense of increased cost (Energy used and finacial) and less robust vehicles.

Wasn't there even some controversy about catalytic convertors vs. lean burn engines?

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - madf

"Other people care about cancer."

I'm an electrician (asbestos risk) who's grandfather died of lung cancer. So that quite laughable, 'Think of the children' style retort is not worth my while debating further.

My point of view doesn't make me immune from cancer either. I might get it from one of these particles.

Doesn't change my opinion already stated.

Life has a 100% mortality rate.

Well that's great for you.. but frankly if that is your attitude to environmental issues, then I despair..And if others had the same attitude a century ago , we would still have mothers dying in childbirth from puerperal fever.

Edited by Avant on 04/01/2014 at 20:29

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Ordovices

There still are women dying post partum from puerperal fever, but mainly overseas, so I suppose that's OK then?

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Avant

Please be careful what you say on this thread, where the discussion has broadened. No harm in that, but bear in mind that some people reading this may have had cancer themselves or have members of their family who have.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - RT

Please be careful what you say on this thread, where the discussion has broadened. No harm in that, but bear in mind that some people reading this may have had cancer themselves or have members of their family who have.

I'm one of those, in long-term remission - that's why reducing particulates is important to me.

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - Collos25

Please be careful what you say on this thread, where the discussion has broadened. No harm in that, but bear in mind that some people reading this may have had cancer themselves or have members of their family who have.

I'm one of those, in long-term remission - that's why reducing particulates is important to me.

I am glad we have something in common although my cancer was probably caused by cigarette smoke I personally do not smoke ,anything that reduces any form of cancer is welcome I would not want anybody to go through the treatment of this disease.

Edited by Avant on 04/01/2014 at 23:59

Missing DPF? MOT Fail - madf

Please be careful what you say on this thread, where the discussion has broadened. No harm in that, but bear in mind that some people reading this may have had cancer themselves or have members of their family who have.

My mother died painfully of Hodgkinson's disease, my sister in law and her daughter both from cancer in the past two years.My brother in law has just been treated for prostate cancer.

Avant

Thanks for your concern ..but not needed in my case..