Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life

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Tue 28 May 2013 21:44
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Trilogy

It can't be easy selling the best loved models for each of these marques. The rivalry on the racetrack has been intense for the last 50 years. This is set to end in 2016. Ford's favourite was selling over 70,000 a year in 2003. Now that figure has dipped to under 20,000 cars. GM's favourite fares a little better. In 2002 sales were around 90,000, but are now down to 30,000. A reluctance to move with market demands.............

Edited by Trilogy on 28/05/2013 at 21:45

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Tue 28 May 2013 23:11
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Avant

Do you mean the Mondeo and Insignia, Trilogy? Isn;t it more a matter of downsizing than of fleets deserting Ford and Vauxhall? The current Mondeo (particularly) and Insignia are bigger than their predecessors, and bigger than many people want or need. They can spend less and drive perfectly adequate Focuses and Astras.

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Wed 29 May 2013 13:33
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Snakey

Didn't plod used to use a lot of Ford and Vauxhalls? Now (in my area anyway) they all seem to be BMW/Subaru or other 'less value for money' brands!

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Wed 29 May 2013 15:40
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - galileo

Didn't plod used to use a lot of Ford and Vauxhalls? Now (in my area anyway) they all seem to be BMW/Subaru or other 'less value for money' brands!

Your plod must have plenty of money. Hereabouts Yorkshire thrift applies, Astras for for Mcommon use, BMW/Volvo only for Motorway patrols and ARVs (Armed response vehicles)

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Wed 29 May 2013 15:53
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - RT

There's a list of preferred suppliers :-

Suppliers and categories

High performance (Metropolitan Police Service only): BMW, Jaguar, Land Rover, Mercedes Benz, VW Group, Colt and Volvo.

Intermediate performance (Metropolitan Police Service only): BMW, Ford, GM, Hyundai, Land Rover, Nissan, Peugeot, VW Group, Colt and Volvo.

Low performance (Metropolitan Police Service only): Ford, GM, Hyundai, Nissan, Peugeot, VW Group, Colt and Volvo.

High performance (all other authorities): BMW, VW Group and Volvo.

Intermediate performance (all other authorities): Ford, GM and VW Group.

Low performance (all other authorities): Ford, GM, Hyundai and Peugeot.

4x4: BMW, Ford, GM, Hyundai, Nissan, Land Rover, Honda, Peugeot, VW Group, Colt, Toyota and Volvo.

Car derived van, up to 3,500kg: Citroen, Fiat, Ford, GM, Land Rover, Nissan, Peugeot and VW Group.

Panel van, up to 3,500kg: Citroen, Fiat, Ford, GM, Land Rover, Mercedes Benz, Peugeot, VW Group and Iveco.

Light commercial vehicle, 3,500kg to 7,500kg: Fiat, Ford, GM, Iveco, Mercedes Benz, Peugeot and VW Group.

Police protected support unit vehicle and general personnel carrier: Ford, GM, Hyundai, Mercedes Benz, Peugeot and VW Group.

Large goods vehicle: Iveco.

Scooters and road-going motorcycles, up to 800cc: BMW, Honda Motorcycles, Kawasaki, Piaggio and Yamaha.

Low performance off-road motorcycles, up to 450cc: Honda Motorcycles, Kawasaki, Piaggio and Yamaha.

High performance motorcycles: BMW, Honda Motorcycles, Kawasaki, Piaggio and Yamaha.

Marked patrol high performance motorcycles: BMW, Kawasaki and Yamaha.

Discreetly armoured saloon/4x4 vehicle: BMW, GM, Jaguar and Land Rover.

Standard vehicles: BMW, Citroen, Fiat, Ford, GM, Hyundai, Nissan, Honda, Honda Motorcycles, Jaguar, Land Rover, Mazda, Mercedes Benz, Piaggio, Proton, Peugeot, VW Group, Subaru, Suzuki, Colt, Toyota, Volvo and Yamaha.

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Wed 29 May 2013 16:09
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Ed V

Are there any others - I can't see RR & Bentley, but that's about it!

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Wed 29 May 2013 13:38
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - unthrottled

Isn;t it more a matter of downsizing than of fleets deserting Ford and Vauxhall?

I think this is the case. Both Ford and GM used to have completely separate European and North American models. Now both companies have adopted the 'world car' format. The Mondeo and Insignia are not really designed with UK sales in mind. Focus and Astra sales are still fairly strong.

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Wed 29 May 2013 16:14
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Ed V

I feel sure that the Mondeo is larger than the Granada of the 80s, which then sat above the Cortina, Escort etc.

At long last, I think the "make 'em larger, then drop one off the top" approach may be done for.

There are so many mid-range variants such as SUV's large and small, estates, coupes etc, that conventional sizing (length / legroom is only part of the choice.

Whenever a 30 year old car is seen, the first dramatic thing I notice is how small it looks, and how small and deep its tyres are too. The 911 is a good example!

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Wed 29 May 2013 17:10
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - RT

Yes the Mondeo grew bigger than the Granada/Scorpio in the same way the Vectra grew bigger than the Omega, particularly the LWB Vectra estate.

It was, probably still is, policy from both Ford Europe and GM Europe that model names gradually migrate up the range and Escort/Focus and Astra have both had two models introduced below them as they've moved upscale while top model name have been shed.

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Thu 30 May 2013 23:19
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Avant

It's quite recent phenomenon I think. Taking Ford as an example the smallest Ford, from the 30s till the Fiesta in 1976, took the form of:

Ford 8....Anglia / Popular....100E Anglia....105E Anglia....Escort - all much the same size. The the Fiesta comes in below the Escort, which gets bigger with each new model, as does the Focus, as does the Fiesta with the Ka in below it.

Most Fords sell well so presumably they know what they're doing. Maybe trying to follow the average family with growing children?

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Fri 31 May 2013 14:03
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - LikedDrivingOnce
Most Fords sell well so presumably they know what they're doing. Maybe trying to follow the average family with growing children?

I think that you've got the answer there!

I applaud the fact that cars are more family-friendly than ever. It's great that what consumers wants/needs are catered for in this way.

The only fly in the ointment for me personally is that I (as someone who has previously owned and liked Fords & Vauxhalls) now find that there is nothing that they offer for me personally. The Mondeo and Insignia have gotten too big AFAIAK, and the Focus & Astra are the right size but leave me cold.

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Fri 31 May 2013 18:34
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - wrangler_rover

My local ford dealer had an easy job when I renewed my company car 2 months ago. I didn't even waste his or my time by visiting the dealership.

I had driven Toyota Avensis, 2006 and 2009 2 litre diesels for the past 5 years. The car went back early in november 2010 as it had reached its contracted mileage and I was give the 2007 pool mondeo 1.8 diesel hatch for 4 months. I noticed that every time it rained, when I opened the boot, water cascaded into the boot. Also the engine was gutledd and thirsty. Both points had been addressed by ford in 2008 with a seal retrofit and a software upgrade (according to honest john car reviews on the mondeo). The car had a full service history at a main ford dealer chain near the office which is 100 miles from where I livebut these mods hadn't been done. In december, I contacted my local ford dealer, who is in the same group as the dealer who serviced the car and they said "We don't know the car," I replied "Your sister garage 100 miles away has done all the servicing on the car," they replied "We don't know the car and we will look at it provided you pay us £55 to look at it." I replied "I really missed all this hassle when I drove a Toyota for 5 years, my company car is up for renewal soon and guess what, with this attitude, I will not choose a ford."

I didn't consider a ford when choosing my new car, my local ford dealer service dept had seen to that with them wanting £55 to look at the car, I chose another Avensis diesel tourer.

You don't ask a builder to give you a quote and he charges you £55 to quote you for the job.

I wonder how many marques have future cuctomers turned against them by their (lack of) customer service.

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Mon 3 Jun 2013 16:31
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Ed V

I'd guess that a huge number of privately owned (i.e. not company) cars are bought from the local dealer. Most people don't follow cars like this site's users. If you live near a Ford garage, a Focus is probably what you'll drive; if near Vauxhall, an Astra!

We've probably lost local loyalty, Fords in Essex, MGs in Oxford etc, and national ones too, especially in the UK. The French still buy French makes I notice so they obviously don't read or don't care about the Brits' views on French makes' reliability.

If you live near a decent used car merchant who you trust, most will take his best offering at their price, whatever the model.

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Mon 3 Jun 2013 17:56
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - daveyjp
I was in a Ford main dealer today, happily not buying as the display models were dire. The showroom had two Fiestas, a Ka and an ST. Very poor considering the current Ford range. I would at least expect to see one of their current range of 5 MPVs.
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Mon 3 Jun 2013 20:08
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Engineer Andy

I'd guess that a huge number of privately owned (i.e. not company) cars are bought from the local dealer. Most people don't follow cars like this site's users. If you live near a Ford garage, a Focus is probably what you'll drive; if near Vauxhall, an Astra!

We've probably lost local loyalty, Fords in Essex, MGs in Oxford etc, and national ones too, especially in the UK. The French still buy French makes I notice so they obviously don't read or don't care about the Brits' views on French makes' reliability.

If you live near a decent used car merchant who you trust, most will take his best offering at their price, whatever the model.

I think the car supermarkets (I bought my Mazda3 with only delivery mileage on it from one back in 2006) and brokers destroyed all local brand loyalty, and to be honest, things needed a shake-up, especially amongst the British makes which until recently were known much more for poor reliability and customer service (the former has improved greatly, the latter less so IMO) than anything thing else.

I think though that the "UK" makes still need to put a lot more work into both pre and especially post-sales customer care, as I've found (through talking to friends, family and work colleagues) that despite recent concerns over reliability and quality, Japanese and Korean (to a less extent) makes still lead the way in that regard. The more (IMO) honest approach to pricing, servicing and warranties makes the whole ownership experience much more satisfying and less stressful, especially in the current hard economic times.

Jaguar and Skoda are very good examples of makes that have turned both around, often having better reputations generally than their parent companies (more talking about Ford when they owned Jaguar-Land Rover).

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Mon 3 Jun 2013 22:12
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - Avant

"The French still buy French makes I notice so they obviously don't read or don't care about the Brits' views on French makes' reliability."

A factor in this - apart from French patriotism - is that many French people buy the basic models, often in beige, and don't specify all the extra electronic gadgets which Brits love, and which go wrong.

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Mon 3 Jun 2013 22:23
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - jamie745

More's the point...the British still buy plenty of French cars therefore still don't care about our own dislike of them.

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Tue 4 Jun 2013 11:14
Ford/GM Salesmen/women - the hard life - daveyK_UK
The French have also fell in love with Dacia.

Which further backs up the idea a distinct number of French buyers want practicality, simplicity and value - over alloys, gadgets and percieved street cred.

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