I didnt expect this, i thought there was space for all 4 brands Audi - premium VW - mainstream Seat - Sport Skoda - budget Instead they have ended up Audi - premium VW - mainstream touching premium Skoda - mainstream Seat - mainstream
Many VW owners would disagree with your assessment - under Piech, VW had high ambitions to compete with Mercedes-Benz hence the introduction of Phaeton, Touareg and the Premium VW dealers but that all got watered down and decontented and some now see Skoda above VW !
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I would agree with you. Skoda design is less conservative than VW. My Golf Mk7 estate is very bland in styling compared to the Skoda Octavia. All that put me off the Skoda was that many reviews said the estate was noisier than the Golf. In hatch form I would favour the Octavia.
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The article I just read said that Seat would still exist, but in a completely different market (possibly expanding its electric scooters etc).
It's a bit of a shame, but they have just been making slightly worse Skodas for a while now. I am at my local Seat dealer on Friday (getting my Skoda serviced) so will see what their plan is. I'm not sure they're the Cupra type, so maybe they will go for something Japanese. Honda would probably do well.
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It's a bit of a shame, but they have just been making slightly worse Skodas for a while now.
Fair point.
The price of SEAT's and Skoda's are now so close to VW. It's tempting to go for the VW models, as they're nicer finished inside.
The reason for going for SEAT and Skoda in the past is that they were cheaper than VW.
Can't say I'm surprised by this news. Wonder if Skoda will head the same way, in a few years.
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A few years ago we attended the Geneva Motor Show.
We noticed that the staff on the VW stand were all wearing jeans, paired with blazers. The staff on the Seat stand were wearing ripped jeans. (Apparently that's a fashion thing)
My brother quipped that ironically it appeared that the Seat staff were wearing VW's hand-me-downs.
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A few years ago we attended the Geneva Motor Show.
We noticed that the staff on the VW stand were all wearing jeans, paired with blazers. The staff on the Seat stand were wearing ripped jeans. (Apparently that's a fashion thing)
My brother quipped that ironically it appeared that the Seat staff were wearing VW's hand-me-downs.
In reality the cars were Audi hand-me-downs, litterally by just changing the badge in one case.
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I didnt expect this, i thought there was space for all 4 brands Audi - premium VW - mainstream Seat - Sport Skoda - budget Instead they have ended up Audi - premium VW - mainstream touching premium Skoda - mainstream Seat - mainstream
5. Bentley - superlative.
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I didnt expect this, i thought there was space for all 4 brands Audi - premium VW - mainstream Seat - Sport Skoda - budget Instead they have ended up Audi - premium VW - mainstream touching premium Skoda - mainstream Seat - mainstream
5. Bentley - superlative.
6. Lamborghini - superlativer
7. Bugatti - superlativist
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.... are those VAG brands too ??
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But how do these brands fair in the second hand market?
I would expect Audi to hold their value best followed by VWc?
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.... are those VAG brands too ??
And Ducati.
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8. Porsche - supercilious? :-)
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I didnt expect this, i thought there was space for all 4 brands Audi - premium VW - mainstream Seat - Sport Skoda - budget Instead they have ended up Audi - premium VW - mainstream touching premium Skoda - mainstream Seat - mainstream
It seems that every make is now in the process of 'going up-market. Even Dacia are dropping many base spec models and the prices are vastly higher (not just because of the non-motoring events of the last 3 years) than they were (accounting for inflation) in the 2010s.
Similarly to the VAG sub-brands, you have to question the worth in many car firms having several brands offering nigh-on the same thing with different badges and interiors. I think many pretend to be different to placate the governments and peoples of the 'country of origin' of such brands, even though they are in reality materially very similar to other sub-brands, just made somewhere else.
Often two 'different' sub-branded cars are made at the same factory. A waste of money if you ask me, especially those where they literally just change the badges.
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My old SEAT Arosa was effectively a VW Lupo, judging by the numerous VW markings and logos I noticed in vehicle.
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To confuse matters further, the Ford Transit connect and Ford Tourneo Connect are 99% VW Caddys re-badged.
So much so that Ford dealership told one owner to ask the VW dealer if they could get a new wing mirror as Ford had a long lead time for the item.
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Often two 'different' sub-branded cars are made at the same factory. A waste of money if you ask me, especially those where they literally just change the badges.
Some VW Group sibling groups change much more than the badges - the Porsche Cayenne is the basis for their bigger SUVs - the Audi Q7 & Q8 have different wheelbase, different bodyshell, different interior trim, differently tune powertrains and suspension - the VW Touareg shares the Cayennes wheelbase but equally different to the Cayenne and Q7/Q8 - all built in the same Skoda factory in Slovakia albeit finally fettled in Germany in the Porsches case - then of course there's the Bentley Bentayga and Lamborghini Urus which use the same platform, driveline and body systems.
[blocked word put in - Mod]
Edited by Xileno on 05/09/2023 at 21:15
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The UK ditched brand engineering decades ago, but at one time real value was judged in retaining multiple brands selling largely identical vehicles through separate dealer networks.
Some car markets (France in particular) still value the legacy of domestic brands probably with long established dealer networks.
We should not judge the VW group strategy by reference to domestic UK experiences.
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Similarly to the VAG sub-brands, you have to question the worth in many car firms having several brands offering nigh-on the same thing with different badges and interiors. I think many pretend to be different to placate the governments and peoples of the 'country of origin' of such brands, even though they are in reality materially very similar to other sub-brands, just made somewhere else.
Often two 'different' sub-branded cars are made at the same factory. A waste of money if you ask me, especially those where they literally just change the badges.
If someone does not want a VW but buys an Audi/Skoda/SEAT/Skoda etc instead they still get the money - they give more choice to the customer and ensure they get more sales rather than losing a sale to a rival brand. It's worth it to them as they make money from it, they would not do it otherwise.
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<< A waste of money if you ask me, especially those where they literally just change the badges. >>
Yes, but just changing the badges can't waste very much money, can it ? :-)
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<< A waste of money if you ask me, especially those where they literally just change the badges. >>
Yes, but just changing the badges can't waste very much money, can it ? :-)
It is more than just changing the badges.
They run separate dealer networks, different interior trim, different paint colours, different body panels (even if they share a floor pan), different suspension components etc.
Clearly there are economic benefits through sharing some development costs, common components etc. The real question is whether deleting a brand will cause a loss of sales beyond the cost saving - eg: if Seat goes will folk buy a Skoda or go outside the VW group.
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<< A waste of money if you ask me, especially those where they literally just change the badges. >>
Yes, but just changing the badges can't waste very much money, can it ? :-)
It is more than just changing the badges.
They run separate dealer networks, different interior trim, different paint colours, different body panels (even if they share a floor pan), different suspension components etc.
Clearly there are economic benefits through sharing some development costs, common components etc. The real question is whether deleting a brand will cause a loss of sales beyond the cost saving - eg: if Seat goes will folk buy a Skoda or go outside the VW group.
They're only really getting rid of the Seat brand to replace it with the Cupra brand. Having decided that Seat was 'the sporty one' then set up a 'sporty' sub-brand, I suppose it was inevitable.
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<< They're only really getting rid of the Seat brand to replace it with the Cupra brand. Having decided that Seat was 'the sporty one' then set up a 'sporty' sub-brand, I suppose it was inevitable. >>
Are SEATs still built in Spain ? Might there be an idea to close a plant there ?
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<< They're only really getting rid of the Seat brand to replace it with the Cupra brand. Having decided that Seat was 'the sporty one' then set up a 'sporty' sub-brand, I suppose it was inevitable. >>
Are SEATs still built in Spain ? Might there be an idea to close a plant there ?
They are still built in Spain but reading one article about the change they will still be building the Cupra cars there so there won't be closing any of the plants.
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