Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear

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Tue 4 Apr 2023 16:25
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow

As above. Was green, now it isn't

Can't be good, and I'll replace it, but I'm unsure of the significance.

First thought was acidification, perhaps due to exposure to combustion gases, suggesting an integrity breach like HG failure, but the car hasn't been driven for a few months.

There doesn't seem to be a consistent story out there as to what, if anything, the colour indicates, and it could obviously vary with manufacturer, but "nothing" seems to be the most widespread opinion.

Its was Shell branded stuff so shouldn't have been complete junk, assuming it wasn't fake, which isn't VERY likely since it was bought from a big supermarket chain here (RT-MART).

Edited by edlithgow on 04/04/2023 at 16:28

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Tue 4 Apr 2023 19:36
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Metropolis.
Are you sure it was the same type of coolant that you added?

Colour loss can indicate a reaction between different types of coolant, I would do a thorough flush if I were you.
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Tue 4 Apr 2023 20:24
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - sammy1

Someone has stolen it and replaced it with H20! Do you really need coolant in your climate?

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Tue 4 Apr 2023 20:35
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - FP

Every liquid-cooled engine needs coolant, i.e. some kind of liquid; without it the engine would quickly overheat.

What we in cooler climes refer to as "anti-freeze" contains additives to control corrosion, raise the boiling point of engine coolant to prevent overheating and prevent scale from building up.

That is why you shouldn't use water as a coolant.

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 00:25
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow

Someone has stolen it and replaced it with H20! Do you really need coolant in your climate?

Since it gets spectacularly hot here (though it isn’t at the moment) I need it rather more than you do, rather bleedin obviously
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Wed 5 Apr 2023 14:17
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - sammy1

Someone has stolen it and replaced it with H20! Do you really need coolant in your climate?

Since it gets spectacularly hot here (though it isn’t at the moment) I need it rather more than you do, rather bleedin obviously

OK in your extreme heat do you have to use a stronger concentration than our normal 50% coolant?. Are you really telling me that cars will not run in your climate with water as the sole coolant with modern electric fan cooling

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 14:46
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - paul 1963

Someone has stolen it and replaced it with H20! Do you really need coolant in your climate?

Since it gets spectacularly hot here (though it isn’t at the moment) I need it rather more than you do, rather bleedin obviously

OK in your extreme heat do you have to use a stronger concentration than our normal 50% coolant?. Are you really telling me that cars will not run in your climate with water as the sole coolant with modern electric fan cooling

Mate, please read FP's comment a few posts up, he explains it perfectly...

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 17:00
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - sammy1

Someone has stolen it and replaced it with H20! Do you really need coolant in your climate?

Since it gets spectacularly hot here (though it isn’t at the moment) I need it rather more than you do, rather bleedin obviously

OK in your extreme heat do you have to use a stronger concentration than our normal 50% coolant?. Are you really telling me that cars will not run in your climate with water as the sole coolant with modern electric fan cooling

Mate, please read FP's comment a few posts up, he explains it perfectly...

I fully understand how coolant is supposed to work. All I am asking is do you up the concentration in very hot weather the same as in really cold. Someone with an old banger in non freezing conditions might not want the expense of coolant and not that worried about what might happen to the core of their engine. A bit of possible corrosion or scaling is hardly going to wreck it. At the came coolant can loose its properties over time but who regularly pays to change it just because garages say you should

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Thu 6 Apr 2023 05:18
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow
I believe water is a slightly better coolant than 50:50 mix, so no, you don’t have to up the concentration of antifreeze in hot climates.

As I said above, I believe there are coolants optimized for cooling and corrosion protection rather than freeze protection (“water wetter”?) and one might expect them to be popular here, but Taiwanese are pretty clueless so perhaps not. There is one in the supermarkets but I know nothing of it.

If I was using water, which I probably wouldn’t risk long term, I’d try adding half a teaspoon of washing powder to it. This should buffer acids and I believe it has some anticorrosion silicates in it to protect washing machines

Edited by edlithgow on 06/04/2023 at 05:28

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 17:28
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - RT

Someone has stolen it and replaced it with H20! Do you really need coolant in your climate?

Since it gets spectacularly hot here (though it isn’t at the moment) I need it rather more than you do, rather bleedin obviously

OK in your extreme heat do you have to use a stronger concentration than our normal 50% coolant?. Are you really telling me that cars will not run in your climate with water as the sole coolant with modern electric fan cooling

The primary job of the liquid is as a corrosion-inhibitor with the secondary job of anti-freeze - 50:50 is the standard dilution around the world regardless of climate.

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Tue 4 Apr 2023 22:08
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Andrew-T

The colour of antifreeze serves two purposes : It shows what type it is, and (provided the owner looks occasionally) indicates whether it is deteriorating. It sounds as if your stuff has.

At least it is not rust-coloured soup, which can develop in engines with an iron block, but I guess yours may be light alloy ? I haven't come across green antifreeze, it's commonly red, blue or orange ?

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Tue 4 Apr 2023 23:07
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - sammy1

The colour of antifreeze serves two purposes : It shows what type it is, and (provided the owner looks occasionally) indicates whether it is deteriorating. It sounds as if your stuff has.

At least it is not rust-coloured soup, which can develop in engines with an iron block, but I guess yours may be light alloy ? I haven't come across green antifreeze, it's commonly red, blue or orange ?

If my memory serves me well the first anti-freeze I remember was green. Modern anti-freeze may be all singing and dancing but when I first started motoring engines boiling stuck thermostats and burst houses was a regular hazard. Indeed a lot of motorists frequently drained the system in winter if bad frosts were forecast or even put a blanket over the engine. Motoring was difficult in them olden days often having to revert to a starting handle because the batteries and starter motors were not that clever in winter. Many times reverted to a push start or bump on the near hill. It was budget motoring but you could understand everything about your car Modern motorists don't appreciate how lucky they are!

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 09:41
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Andrew-T

<< Indeed a lot of motorists frequently drained the system in winter if bad frosts were forecast or even put a blanket over the engine. Motoring was difficult in them olden days often having to revert to a starting handle because the batteries and starter motors were not that clever in winter. >>

You should try driving a British car in a Canadian prairie winter when it is -10°F (not °C) or colder. Coolant is 50/50 antifreeze/water, there has to be a block heater to start, and the steering gets so stiff all corners have to be taken at walking pace. And I had a permanent blanket over the engine (not in summer of course). Everyone talked about 'winterising' the car, which called for 'summerising' six months later.

Edited by Andrew-T on 05/04/2023 at 09:46

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 00:29
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow
WI used a local brand (also green) last time and it did go all chocolate. I think it might have iron cylinder liners.
AFAIK there is no easy way of finding out what is in the stuff, even known brands like Shell (this stuff) or Peak (maybe next stuff) if you could get the Chinese translated accurately it’s unlikely to say anything specific.
Might be worth getting the Toyota branded stuff.

Edited by edlithgow on 05/04/2023 at 00:38

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 01:42
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Crickleymal

Back when I owned a Lada Riva, it had a convenient engine block drain plug. I used to drain the coolant in May, replace it with distilled water then in the autumn repeat the process with the addition of antifreeze. The water was always crystal clear when I drained it.

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 02:03
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow

Back when I owned a Lada Riva, it had a convenient engine block drain plug. I used to drain the coolant in May, replace it with distilled water then in the autumn repeat the process with the addition of antifreeze. The water was always crystal clear when I drained it.

Seems like “work for risk”. Why did you do that? Doesn’t address the alleged need for corrosion inhibitors. IIRC the Lada (I had a Mk1) was an all alloy engine (block and head) Here of course I don’t need freeze protection and might better use a “pure” anti-corrosion package, but the only one readily available is an allegedly German brand I’ve never heard of, so I havnt used it.
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Wed 5 Apr 2023 16:25
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Crickleymal

Back when I owned a Lada Riva, it had a convenient engine block drain plug. I used to drain the coolant in May, replace it with distilled water then in the autumn repeat the process with the addition of antifreeze. The water was always crystal clear when I drained it.

Seems like “work for risk”. Why did you do that? Doesn’t address the alleged need for corrosion inhibitors. IIRC the Lada (I had a Mk1) was an all alloy engine (block and head) Here of course I don’t need freeze protection and might better use a “pure” anti-corrosion package, but the only one readily available is an allegedly German brand I’ve never heard of, so I havnt used it.

Well at the time I had access to unlimited quantities of distilled water and as Haynes recommended changing the coolant every couple of years or so I thought I'd adopt a more frequent strategy. I wasn't aware at the time of the inhibitive qualities of antifreeze. As the operation only took a few minutes it wasn't a major hassle. I thought the Lada had a steel engine block but I could be wrong.

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 02:12
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow
Actually this Shellzone stuff has English packaging but still isn’t very specific directly, though it refers to some met standards I suppose I could look up (ASTM 03306, D4985, probably secret/paywalled like most ASTM, 3 GM, a Ford and a Chrysler. Doubt they specify iungreening criteria though
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Wed 5 Apr 2023 09:44
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Andrew-T
WI used a local brand (also green) last time and it did go all chocolate. I think it might have iron cylinder liners.

My daughter had a Clio about 30 years ago which ran with brown Windsor soup in the cooling system. The Renault handbook said nothing about changing coolant, so people didn't. It seemed to do the job, but there had to be a point where something needed doing.

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Wed 5 Apr 2023 13:11
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Metropolis.
Yes would go for the Toyota or Daihatsu branded coolant if you can source the correct one. At least your cooling system is getting a good refresh!
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Wed 5 Apr 2023 16:59
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - bathtub tom
Yes would go for the Toyota or Daihatsu branded coolant if you can source the correct one. At least your cooling system is getting a good refresh!

And the coolant will last decades longer than the rest of the car!

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Thu 6 Apr 2023 05:32
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow
Yes would go for the Toyota or Daihatsu branded coolant if you can source the correct one. At least your cooling system is getting a good refresh!

And the coolant will last decades longer than the rest of the car!

Well this stuff is about 3 years old and has lost its colour, so the evidence, such as it is, is against your ( in any case unlikely to be tested) statement
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Thu 6 Apr 2023 08:59
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - bathtub tom
Well this stuff is about 3 years old and has lost its colour, so the evidence, such as it is, is against your ( in any case unlikely to be tested) statement

Modern OAT (Organic Acid Technology) anti-freeze seems to have a ten year life before manufacturers recommend changing, so it would probably be OK for at least twenty in a certain contributor's car.

Anti-freeze has developed over the years, from the methanol based stuff that would only last about a year, through ethanol/glycol.

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Thu 6 Apr 2023 09:26
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - Andrew-T

<< Anti-freeze has developed over the years, from the methanol based stuff that would only last about a year, through ethanol/glycol. >>

My experience with antifreeze goes back a long way and I can only remember using glycol during the last century :-) but no doubt use has been made of methanol. It was probably stopped to prevent winos drinking it, and because it is more volatile than water.

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Fri 7 Apr 2023 03:41
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow
I was referring to stuff I bought, because referring to stuff I didn’t buy, might not be able to buy, and might not be able to find out I,d bought it if I could buy it, seems fairly irrelevant in context.

I’d guess methanol might also be contra-indicated in many engines because it corrodes aluminium
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Fri 7 Apr 2023 11:38
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - galileo

Ed, given the problems of availability of what are everyday products here, and the local culture being against DIY repairs, I have nothing but admiration for your ingenuity and perseverance.

Meaning no offence, I follow your exploits as avidly as my wife follows her favourite soap operas, but I wish you well for the day you acquire a 100% operative car.

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Sat 8 Apr 2023 13:26
Any liquid cooled engine - Coolant has Gone Clear - edlithgow

Well thanks, but recently cross-threading at least one spark plug wasn't very admirable, and might trigger "a series of unfortunate events" if/when I take the head off, perhaps tomorrow.

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