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A 1987 car with only %K miles has just sold at action for £596K Not a bad investment for a Sierra. I suppose the buyer will only store it and look at it. A lot earlier than this I had a test drive in a Cavalier GSI and had never driven a performance car before. Needless to say it scared the pants of me a bit after only driving a 998cc Austin A40. Has anyone else a memory of driving a quick car for the first time and what was it?
Apologies if I have posted this in the wrong section!!!
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Not at all, it's Motoring.
I had a go behind the wheel of a Renault 5 GT Turbo back in the early 90's and that scared the wotsit out of me. I think being flimsily-built didn't help (I was used to VW and Volvo quality at that time as that's either what I drove or parents had). The power-to-weight ratio must have been impressive, once the turbo kicked in I found it a bit too fast and wondered how it might cope in an accident.
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I had a go behind the wheel of a Renault 5 GT Turbo back in the early 90's and that scared the wotsit out of me. I think being flimsily-built didn't help (I was used to VW and Volvo quality at that time as that's either what I drove or parents had). The power-to-weight ratio must have been impressive, once the turbo kicked in I found it a bit too fast and wondered how it might cope in an accident.
Probably not very well. There were a lot of fatalities in those days before the introduction of strengthened body shells, but the cars were exciting, being so light in comparison to today.
I had a Montego Turbo, with modified boost. That car was such fun to drive, comfortable on long journeys and the acceleration was relentless at mid/higher speeds once the turbo was on song. Mine was a later model and they had sorted the torque steer of the earlier models. I remember an early plate example in front of me one day and it was all over the road as it accelerated.
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Mustang v8 (the new UK spec ones). Bit of a shock and reminded me of the fun to be had in motoring.
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Mk2 golf gti , 1986 model. Very quick and responsive and would easily do 35mpg . Only problem it was at the time when the VW badges were getting nicked on a regular basis .
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Jag XK150 Roadster. A fair bit of grunt and a chassis apparently made of wet paper.
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Subaru Impreza turbo mk 1. It belonged to my wife’s uncle. It was left hand drive and I remember pulling out to overtake a school bus on a main A road, Mixture of fear and adrenaline rush.
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Had a 1980 Mk 2 Escort 1600 and was looking to replace it. Fiesta XR2 or Escort XR3i were the 2 on the shortlist. Local dealer had neither to test drive but he did have a Turbo Technics modified XR3i which he claimed was a Ford approved conversion (long before the RS turbo). So I went out in it on a damp winters afternoon and it was truly horrifying. All they had done was add a turbo and boost it to a claimed 200 bhp, standard brakes, suspension and tyres. Touch the throttle only lightly and you needed to be fast with the steering since it had terrible torque steer, touch the brakes and they tended to lock up. Dreadful car.
Bought an XR3i the following month, just as dreadful but slower. Replaced that after 2 years with a Golf GTi, what a hot hatch should be.
But all are slow compared to the Caterham. When I was competing in the National Championship up to 1800cc class it had about 175 bhp and weighed about 500kg (no unnecessary fittings at all). 1/4 mile was timed as 12.9 seconds but top speed was only about 115 mph since it ran out of revs (8,000 rpm limit in top).
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It does confuse me a bit when people buy and sell XR3is for crazy money now. My recollection was that they were considered fairly bad in the 80s..
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It does confuse me a bit when people buy and sell XR3is for crazy money now. My recollection was that they were considered fairly bad in the 80s..
But what I remembered was the incredibly stable idle of the fuel injection after being used to carb fed engines.
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In 1990, having had my license for about a year, I got a job working at the SAAB dealership in Aberdeen. Immediately being let loose in models with up to 195bhp was a bit of an eye opener.
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Probably a Crosslé Formula Ford 1600 at Aintree race circuit when I was 18. It only had 100bhp but weighed just over 400kg.
I rallied for a few years in what would have been for the time a reasonably quick Mini (BL, not BMW).
Close on 20 years then instructing at various rally schools, race schools and driving experience days.
Oulton Park’s RWD rally Escort Cosworths were a hoot on a low friction surface, more often than not you’d spend as long looking out of the side windows as the windscreen to see where you were going.
Other highs and lows from the period -
Ferrari 360. Poised, delicate, fast, constantly felt like a dancer ‘on their toes’.
Lamborghini Gallardo. Clumsy, wooden, like a hippo in hobnail boots.
Aston Martin Vantage. Glorious to look at, scarily unpredictable when it lets go at the rear.
Dodge Viper. Continuing the current Roald Dahl theme, a Big Friendly Giant. Just don’t lean on the side exhaust as you get out. Convertible roof inflates like Billy Smart’s Big Top at north of 150mph.
Lotus Esprit V8 Turbo. Hateful in every respect.
Porsche 911. Quick but you can send Granny shopping in it.
Working for car manufacturers from 2007 to date has brought some quick stuff along - Audi RS6 was hugely impressive, as was a BMW 335d.
But, and I have to say it, nothing matches the punch and acceleration of a quick EV. I’ve been out this morning in a Polestar 2 Dual Motor With Performance Pack. So 350kW (470hp) gives an instantaneous kick unmatched by any ICE I’ve ever come across.
Tesla Model 3 Dual Motor and Genesis EGV70 have recently delivered similar performance.
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"""But, and I have to say it, nothing matches the punch and acceleration of a quick EV. I’ve been out this morning in a Polestar 2 Dual Motor With Performance Pack. So 350kW (470hp) gives an instantaneous kick unmatched by any ICE I’ve ever come across.
Tesla Model 3 Dual Motor and Genesis EGV70 have recently delivered similar performance."""
As I said before great to see your posts on actual EV experiences. Just a factual comment as I see it. Some EVs are ridiculously fast and to use this performance you must deplete the range fairly quickly as you would do with an ICE. You therefore have to charge the EV more often, so somewhere the pollution is increased if not on the road. You also increase the electric cost and tyre/brake wear. The performance aspect rather defeats the objective of where cars are heading with 70 50 and soon blanket 20 mphs and the need to conserve energy. What is the point of granny or any household saving energy if people are driving EVs at the limit. Perhaps the electric motor should be governed to a sensible limit which would conserve range? I am amazed that the authorities allow such quick cars when with the new technology they have a chance to scale back the acceleration of cars One of the latest concerns on vehicles in general is the pollution caused by tyre and brake wear and again silly performance greatly increases wear.
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Your points could be applied to any "high performance" car, whether EV or ICE.
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"""But, and I have to say it, nothing matches the punch and acceleration of a quick EV. I’ve been out this morning in a Polestar 2 Dual Motor With Performance Pack. So 350kW (470hp) gives an instantaneous kick unmatched by any ICE I’ve ever come across.
Tesla Model 3 Dual Motor and Genesis EGV70 have recently delivered similar performance."""
As I said before great to see your posts on actual EV experiences. Just a factual comment as I see it. Some EVs are ridiculously fast and to use this performance you must deplete the range fairly quickly as you would do with an ICE. You therefore have to charge the EV more often, so somewhere the pollution is increased if not on the road. You also increase the electric cost and tyre/brake wear. The performance aspect rather defeats the objective of where cars are heading with 70 50 and soon blanket 20 mphs and the need to conserve energy. What is the point of granny or any household saving energy if people are driving EVs at the limit. Perhaps the electric motor should be governed to a sensible limit which would conserve range? I am amazed that the authorities allow such quick cars when with the new technology they have a chance to scale back the acceleration of cars One of the latest concerns on vehicles in general is the pollution caused by tyre and brake wear and again silly performance greatly increases wear.
Would you want the same limits on petrol/diesel cars?
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What is the point of granny or any household saving energy if people are driving EVs at the limit.
This has roughly been my opinion of Formula-1 and the like for many years. Son-in-law and his dad were/are keen on it, occasionally going to Silverstone, but apart from the possible buzz of being there I am completely unattracted by regular glimpses of cars hurtling past every couple of minutes, with the accompanying din - and waste of fuel as they (most of them anyway) finish up just where they started :-)
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Many many years ago some friends took my father to a grand Prix. He said it was so boring he fell asleep.
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Many many years ago some friends took my father to a grand Prix. He said it was so boring he fell asleep.
Did he have ear plugs in?
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This would have been 1950s I think, so no
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This would have been 1950s I think, so no
Must have been deaf or suffered from hypersomnia then!
The noise would have been incredible and there would have been many different engine sounds because manufacturers didn't all use the same engine configuration. It would also have been a real spectacle (certainly if there were corners in view) because the tyres were so narrow the cars would have been drifting all the way round the corners.
Not to mention, back then there was a very real chance of a driver dying in a horrific fireball of twisted metal such was the lack of safety.
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This would have been 1950s I think, so no
Should've gone to a horse race, slightly less boring than watching paint dry. Haven't changed much in seventy years either.
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This would have been 1950s I think, so no
Should've gone to a horse race, slightly less boring than watching paint dry. Haven't changed much in seventy years either.
That's my take on it too. It's ok watching on TV because you see more of the action but when you're stuck at one spot seeing the cars every 10 minutes or so....
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This would have been 1950s I think, so no
Should've gone to a horse race, slightly less boring than watching paint dry. Haven't changed much in seventy years either.
That's my take on it too. It's ok watching on TV because you see more of the action but when you're stuck at one spot seeing the cars every 10 minutes or so....
Only the Nurburgring has such a long lap as 10 minutes.
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And that hasn’t been used for F1 in its full, 14 mile form, since 1976.
IOM TT circuit is longer, but mitigated, slightly, by settling riders off at 10 second intervals. So, if they hold station with each other, you’ve a rider every 10 seconds for 2.5 minutes, then 37 miles worth of silence…
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IOM TT circuit is longer, but mitigated, slightly, by settling riders off at 10 second intervals. So, if they hold station with each other, you’ve a rider every 10 seconds for 2.5 minutes, then 37 miles worth of silence…
Well more like 32 miles of silence if the fastest riders are averaging over 130mph.
At his record breaking 2018 average lap speed, Hickman would cover about 5.6 miles in the 2.5 minutes between first and last rider..........
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No argument from me - if you want to make a body move more quickly across the ground, or accelerate more quickly, you need to put more energy in. Whether it be petrol, diesel or electrons.
I will quibble over brake use, however, in that I very seldom use the wheel brakes in an EV. The regen is too valuable not to use. If you’re having to use the brakes frequently in something with any degree of regen then you’re not paying attention.
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With an EV, it's possible (but by no means inevitable) to create 100% of the fuel from renewable sources. When we had ours, I got noticeably lazier as I knew I could drive to the shops round the corner without causing any pollution at all.
To get back to the original subject (sort of), my dad had a Ferrari 360 but then moved the Cotswolds and it became impossible to drive locally, so he went back to 'normal' cars but I think he still misses it.
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With an EV, it's possible (but by no means inevitable) to create 100% of the fuel from renewable sources. When we had ours, I got noticeably lazier as I knew I could drive to the shops round the corner without causing any pollution at all.
So your lungs got cleaner but your cholesterol level went up :-)
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‘Perhaps the electric motor should be governed to a sensible limit which would conserve range?’
I can’t see the power output of vastly more polluting ICE’s being capped any time soon.
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An Ariel Golden Arrow that had been 'breathed on' and then some more in the late '60s. Only 250cc and I haven't a clue about its horsepower, but at some unbelievably high RPM the power all came in at once and scared the life out of me. Totally unrideable around town. I was tempted to buy it, but it had a knock that sounded just like a piston hitting the head that sometimes happened if you skimmed too much off a two stroke head to raise the compression ratio.
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‘Perhaps the electric motor should be governed to a sensible limit which would conserve range?’ I can’t see the power output of vastly more polluting ICE’s being capped any time soon.
No but ICE are on the way out. The future is a different ball park I cannot see the roads we have now being able to sustain cars that are even quicker than the average ones that are whizzing around now. We are all to frequently reminded that there are are other road users to consider and the restrictions vehicles face now are going to get worse. It seems extremely easy to make an EV quick and in 10 years time where will EVs be, they are not going to stand still unless some restrictions are in place. The UK cannot rely on renewables long term. The cost of the Hinckley Point nuclear power station is rising faster than HS2 and there are mini nuclear options being considered The dream of cheap electric is just that and electric propulsion may be far dearer than one might imagine assuming the Grid can keep up with everything else.
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Disappointed but not surprised to find that Sammy has managed to turn his own thread of folks experiences in fast vehicles into yet another anti-ev rant.
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Disappointed but not surprised to find that Sammy has managed to turn his own thread of folks experiences in fast vehicles into yet another anti-ev rant.
On the contrary I am just concerned that the evolution of EV cars is moving faster than the infrastructure, not enough chargers and constant worries everywhere about the national grid falling over.. It seems that our electric grid will end up with more batteries to store renewables than will ever go in the vehicles so even more batteries and these are not green.
Consider any conflict in the future, take out the Grid and a country is dead, no transport other than horses and there are not that many of them.
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Your concerns may prove true, only time will tell but we've been down this road before and the thread was supposed to be experiences of fast cars. Let's get back to that please as it's far more interesting and hopefully a thread people can enjoy without anything too contentious being discussed. Live in hopes anyway...
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Disappointed but not surprised to find that Sammy has managed to turn his own thread of folks experiences in fast vehicles into yet another anti-ev rant.
I don't see it as a rant at all. EVs have the attraction of novelty and cleanliness - as marketed. But here I think Sammy may not be wearing the rose-tints that the enthusiasts may need. Nearly every historically major innovation has presented societal problems, once past a certain stage of growth. As an example, how about e-scooters - and they have only just started.
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Just to give you some idea of a powerful EV’s performance, I was in a Dual Motor Tesla Model 3 late last year, doing some filming at Millbrook Proving Ground on their mile straight.
We sent a couple of C segment SUV’s from a standing start to a flying finish at half a mile. They were pretty evenly matched at an indicated 101/102mph. The Tesla, by contrast, crossed the line at 135 and pulling like a train…From memory, it used 2% of the battery per run.
It’s on YouTube somewhere, with me trying to read the speedo from the centre display and simultaneously look ahead.
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All cracking cars! Had some fun Xr3i's and Fiesta XR2i's.
First quick car I drove (More handling) was a Pug 205 1.9 GTi, really enjoyed driving it, was some 26 years ago on some back roads in Kent. Miss the old 'Hot Hatches'. I had a Renault Clio Williams for a short time as well, that was great fun to drive, crazy looking gold alloys I believe.
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First fast car for me was a borrowed 2.8i capri, I've only driven a couple of ev's but as mcb has mentioned the pulling power is startling the first time you experience it and highly addictive!
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I have never owned Fords mainly sticking to VW group so Passat 1.8T Golf gti and S3. Nissin Primera EGT was also quick for the earlier era. Early days also had a Singer chamois that was quick but for some reason was always breaking throttle cables But the one that sticks out for me is the Subaru Impreza WRX .more than enough performance and the steering was really planted. One of my sons had a Nissan Skyline which he imported from Japan quick but thirsty and rear tyres did not last long. Wife has always had MINIS. When you see the first ones today and how small they are you wonder how on earth you got 4 adults in one. They were always nippy though and fun to drive. That said never driven any of my cars any where near their limits just enjoyed the extra torque when needed and the extra MPG.
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Back in the sixties, after passing my test in my mother's Messerschmitt bubble car, I drove my father's Jaguar 2.4 Mk 1 - a bit like going from the ridiculous to the sublime.
The lovely straight-six engine (a freer-revving version of the larger 3.4) seemed to me at the time to have vast amounts of poke and the car was great to drive. One summer I did get pulled by the police on our journey home from a holiday in Scotland, with my parents in the car, for exceeding the speed limit in one of those short stretches of 40 mph on the A1 that still trap the unwary. In those pre-radar days, the officer kindly pointed out that he had followed me to check my speed for too short a distance to allow a prosecution, and let me off with a warning.
Probably the Jaguar 2.4 Mk 1 would seem pretty tame by today's standards.
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About 20 years ago I test drove a Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo, IIRC the fastest FWD car when it was launched. The performance didn't scare me, it enthralled me. The car, with its wacky Chris Bangle design, yes it was him, not Pininfarina who designed it, has had me coveting one for years. So much so that I bought one last summer, not needing the performance of the turbo I found a N/A 20V in my local market town. Can't wait for March 1st to enjoy it again!
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About 20 years ago I test drove a Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo, IIRC the fastest FWD car when it was launched. The performance didn't scare me, it enthralled me. The car, with its wacky Chris Bangle design, yes it was him, not Pininfarina who designed it, has had me coveting one for years. So much so that I bought one last summer, not needing the performance of the turbo I found a N/A 20V in my local market town. Can't wait for March 1st to enjoy it again!
Chris Bangle has a lot to answer for! Apparently, the original Pininfarina design ended up as a Peugeot 406 coupe.
Anyway, as long as you like it, that's all that matters. I've never driven one, but understand they're fantastic. They had a reputation for very expensive cambelt replacements, but that seems to have gone now .
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Yeah, cambelt these days is relatively straightforward, and not expensive.
The 406 coupe is absolutely gorgeous, pity it had the saloon's dashboard.
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