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N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - challie2
Hi everyone my apologies if this is the wrong section, (Admin please relocate if not the appropriate locations)

So I was hoping to gauge peoples understanding of the following event.

Driving on the A34 which is a dual carriageway in Oxfordshire. I am in the right hand lane in my car following a car and a small van in front of me which is overtaking an HGV, in the left hand lane. I then have cars behind me, a Luton Van starts undertaking all the traffic and stops short behind the HGV which I am next to overtake, the small van then returns to the left hand lane and then the car in front is slowly speeding up. I’m following the car in front of me, and the Luton Van which previously undertook everyone in left the left hand lane is ahead of me by about a foot and starts indicating and merging into my lane as im speeding up, he comes right over forcing me onto the central reservation. Im blowing my horn thinking he has not seen me, I have a car close behind me so I cannot brake. The Luton Van effectively overtakes the HGV by driving down the centre line between myself and the HGV. I’m not sure if the HGV had to go onto the Hard shoulder to avoid a collision. After we overtake the HGV he returns to the left hand lane and then swerves in front of the car behind me flashing his lights and the swerves to left back and forth, we now overtake another HGV with another van in front, all the while he is driving up to me pretending to ram me from behind, then undertakes by breaking the speed limit again, recording me on his phone not looking at where he is going and almost rear ends another Van had I not pointed to it.
In all honesty I knew he want to overtake me from the left hand lane and cut I front, but I couldn’t go anywhere and I was speeding up after following a slower vehicle overtaking a lorry. But it has me worried because I feel I should have allowed him to undertake dangerously but I am very assertive.

Thanks
N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - badbusdriver

How close the car behind you is not a valid excuse to 'not brake'. For example, if a child ran out in front of you, would you 'not brake' because the car behind was too close?. In your particular instance, you could see what was happening before it happened, all you needed to do was lift off the throttle slightly rather than brake.

I'm not saying you were at fault here, but in my experience, with a situation like that, it is far better to allow the aggressively driven van/vehicle past and on his way rather than keep him behind you or aggravate the situation by trying (in his mind) to box him in. The van driver could have been a complete nutter, forced you to stop, and assaulted you. It really isn't worth it to prove a point.

Put on Classic FM and relax.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - challie2
I thought this much, thank you for being honest, Ironically I was listening to Classic FM at the time Haha, Horn Concerto I believe it was.
N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - SLO76
When you encounter aggressive m****s like this on the road, the best thing you can do is to just let them go. You want them as far away from you as possible and as quickly as possible. Next time (and there will be a next time) just calm down, pull back and let them go. They’ll get their comeuppance at some point, it just won’t involve an accident or a punch up with you. Above all, remain calm.
N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - nellyjak

I agree with above...let him go...no point in creating risk/danger

Like the others, I want him/her as far away from me as possible, as soon as possible.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Chris M

Agree with what others above have said, but for me, the stand out phrase in the OP's post is "but I am very assertive". Perhaps have that on your gravestone. Just give way and let the i**** go on their way.

I'm familiar with the A34. It's an awful two lane dual carriageway, most of which is NSL. At busy times lane 1 is HGV and lane 2 is other traffic trying to do 70mph plus and getting frustrated should an HGV pull out into lane 2. A road I try to avoid.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - _

As others have said, get them away from you as easy/fast as is possible

If you are hit from behind when avoiding the other driver, then the one behind is too close and at fault .

It's no good having an epitaph "I didn't let him past" on your gravestone.

Did you have family members with you, were you driving to keep them safe?

And yes. I avoid the A34.., wish i could avoid the A12 more too.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - bathtub tom

And I thought it was just me that avoided the A34, but in my case because of 'elephant racing'. I prefer to use the A420 from Oxford to the M4.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - barney100

We need more traffic police coming down on minor offences then this in turn affects more serious offences.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - SLO76
As a bus driver and new driver trainer I encounter this sort of thing regularly. Sadly too many drivers let the red mist descend ruining a stable longterm career. Sit well back from the vehicle in front, be ready for poor impatient behaviour from those who lack intelligence and let the i****s go, give them room and forget all about them as soon as they’re out of sight.
N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Andrew-T

We need more traffic police coming down on minor offences then this in turn affects more serious offences.

Nice idea. How do you suggest it might be done ? Only way I can think of is by dozens of watchers at CCTV screens. A police state ?

If it worked we might have stamped out the use of mobiles while driving.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - challie2
Everyone thank you for being very honest it has given me food for thought. I think I lack wise judgement at times having ADHD certainly has not helped.

I used to really enjoy driving but now I try and avoid it where I can. Sometimes I cannot stop myself reacting to arrogant i****s, and thus become an i**** for reacting. Fortunately I am better than I used to be, many years ago I was not impartial to serious and dangerous road rage.

I’m still working on it every day. As you all say I do not want my tombstone to bare the words did not let him undertake me, rather more I would have “loving dad and grandad and great grandfather”…

By the way could someone explain what NSL means?

Thanks

Edited by challie2 on 06/02/2022 at 23:11

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Andrew-T
By the way could someone explain what NSL means? Thanks

NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - ExA35Owner

Always assume the other driver is a bigger fool than you are.

Always leave a defensive space round your vehicle.

Always assume the other driver has never opened a copy of the Highway Code.

Always be aware that you may be in the other driver's blind spot; and always assume the other driver won't use the mirrors.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Andrew-T

Always leave a defensive space round your vehicle..

Excellent idea - the trouble is that some twit often moves into it, just as the OP described.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - galileo

Always leave a defensive space round your vehicle..

Excellent idea - the trouble is that some twit often moves into it, just as the OP described.

I guarantee that whenever I use a motorway within minutes I will see a train of cars in lane three, none of which have the recommended 2 second gap to the one in front.

This is why there is an accident reported every day on the local M62 and / or M1.

I avoid them when possible, leave lots of space in front and keep watch all around for over/undertakers, lane changers and phone users.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - bathtub tom
By the way could someone explain what NSL means? Thanks

NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads

For cars, but may be lower for commercial vehicles.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - RT
By the way could someone explain what NSL means? Thanks

NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads

For cars, but may be lower for commercial vehicles.

and when towing trailers/caravans.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Andrew-T
By the way could someone explain what NSL means? Thanks

NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads

For cars, but may be lower for commercial vehicles.... and when towing trailers ...

I didn't think the OP wanted details, only what NSL stood for ....

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - badbusdriver

I guarantee that whenever I use a motorway within minutes I will see a train of cars in lane three, none of which have the recommended 2 second gap to the one in front.

Driving home today I observed three cars heading in the opposite direction at what appeared to be somewhere near the 60mph limit for that road. The distance between the front bumper of the first car and the back bumper of the last car would have been maybe 50'.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - bathtub tom

I didn't think the OP wanted details, only what NSL stood for ....

You quoted a definitive figure that wouldn't apply in all cases: "NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads".

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Andrew-T

I didn't think the OP wanted details, only what NSL stood for ....

You quoted a definitive figure that wouldn't apply in all cases: "NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads".

Perfectly and unarguably true ?

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Bromptonaut

You quoted a definitive figure that wouldn't apply in all cases: "NSL = National Speed Limit - 70 on motorways, less on most other roads".

Having recently been on a Speed Awareness Course I can confirm that saying NSL= 70 is 'nul points' territory. Different for me when I'm towing the caravan as well as on Single Carriageway roads for everybody.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Manatee

Lots of people, if they are honest, have had accidents that weren't their fault but which they could and should have avoided. I know I have.

Drive to the conditions, and use the 2 seconds rule, adding a bit more if you are being tailgated, Let aggressive drivers have their way. They will eventually meet someone more aggressive or stupid and get their.comeuppance.

Anger doesn't help. I've tried it.

That van BTW would have been limited to 60 on the A34. When I'm doing a true 70 on a dual carriageway, I somewhat resent moving out of the way of 'Transits' (I'm including all makes) whose drivers seem not to know their own limit and want to break mine, but I do it. A loaded van up the chuff is no good to me.

If the police wanted to bank a lot of speeding tickets in a short time, they could do worse than trawl for vans doing 70+ on dual carriageways - some days it seems like most of them. I was once on a speed awareness course with a chap who had been driving a van for 20 years and swore he had no idea that his van was limited to 50 and 60 rather than 60 and 70 on single/dual carriageways.

Assertive can be good BTW. But it necessitates anticipating the conflict, not fighting it out when it happens.

Edited by Manatee on 07/02/2022 at 18:04

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - badbusdriver

Let aggressive drivers have their way. They will eventually meet someone more aggressive or stupid and get their.comeuppance.

When I'm doing a true 70 on a dual carriageway, I somewhat resent moving out of the way of 'Transits' (I'm including all makes) whose drivers seem not to know their own limit and want to break mine

Surely a contradiction here?.

Also, if you can get out of their way, surely you don't need to be in the overtaking lane?.

I was once on a speed awareness course with a chap who had been driving a van for 20 years and swore he had no idea that his van was limited to 50 and 60 rather than 60 and 70 on single/dual carriageways.

This doesn't surprise me. When I first started cleaning windows, I looked into the speed limits for vans. It seemed pretty vague unless you were driving a van with a GVW of more than 2 tonnes. Now that everything is lumped into the LCV category, it is clearer, though not if you are driving a pickup. Where you may be subject to LCV speed limits, or you may be subject to the same limits as a car. Can't remember exactly what determines the category a pickup falls into, but this is surely an unnecessary confusion?.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - Manatee

Let aggressive drivers have their way. They will eventually meet someone more aggressive or stupid and get their.comeuppance.

When I'm doing a true 70 on a dual carriageway, I somewhat resent moving out of the way of 'Transits' (I'm including all makes) whose drivers seem not to know their own limit and want to break mine

Surely a contradiction here?.

Also, if you can get out of their way, surely you don't need to be in the overtaking lane?.

I was once on a speed awareness course with a chap who had been driving a van for 20 years and swore he had no idea that his van was limited to 50 and 60 rather than 60 and 70 on single/dual carriageways.

This doesn't surprise me. When I first started cleaning windows, I looked into the speed limits for vans. It seemed pretty vague unless you were driving a van with a GVW of more than 2 tonnes. Now that everything is lumped into the LCV category, it is clearer, though not if you are driving a pickup. Where you may be subject to LCV speed limits, or you may be subject to the same limits as a car. Can't remember exactly what determines the category a pickup falls into, but this is surely an unnecessary confusion?.

No contradiction, and your reasoning is faulty. I move when reasonably able to do so, but I do feel some frustration that very little seems to happen either in enforcement or education about the enormous number of such vehicles doing well over 70mph every day. I'm often on the A421 between MK and the A1 when it happens, a busy road where one can spend a lot of time in lane 2 passing lorries. Often (and I mean often - I can be overtaken by half a dozen or more on a single journey) a van will close up behind me, so I extract myself at the earliest opportunity, even if it requires dropping my speed to join slower traffic in lane 1.

My resentment is mainly directed at the lack of any visible attempts to deal with them. This road is in Bedfordshire, where the Chief Constable notoriously wanted to remove all speed limit tolerance a while back. If he wants to dish out tickets he should start with vans that are limited to 60, tailgating at 80 and not infrequently driven by people with a phone clapped to their lughole.

We can't necessarily help being irritated by these people but we can control our response, is the point.

N/A - Luton Van Road Rage - _

Manatee..

An excellent response, given that a visible enforcement works.

I only wish there was more of it, especially on athe A12, another truck heavy road.