Just before I retired our organisation put telematics in all our pool cars. The reason given was that they needed to know where they were in case someone had an accident in a remote area. The next thing was that managers started getting monthly reports showing who had been speeding and where. The managers were expected to discipline the drivers for this. One manager commented to me that she didn't care if they were speeding. It was up to the police to enforce that. Her concern was whether people were doing their work ok.
Yes we had this, they also monitored your driving, ie harsh cornering/braking, none of us had any problems with a camera being used as a dashcam even judging how you drove, the problem arose with the microphone, as I said, some used it privately so in theory,their conversations could be listed to at anytime the vehicle was in use, afaik, there was no parking mode as it switched off five minutes after the ignition was off.
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From the other end of the telescope (so to speak) - any company using camera as evidence to dismiss or reprimand drivers would be open to all kinds of employment tribunal claims (unfair or constructive dismissal) unless the evidence was unambiguos and compelling.
Making personal comments about managers etc may not do your career a lot of good - but equally you would probably have the good sense not to do so if you were both in the same room either!
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<< afaik, there was no parking mode as it switched off five minutes after the ignition was off. >>
So it was no use at all if the vehicle was stolen ?
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I think he was referring to the microphone which switched off after 5 minutes of turning the engine off
The more you think about the ‘if you have got nothing to hide what’s the issue?’ statement, the more you realise it’s a completely nonsensical argument.
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<< afaik, there was no parking mode as it switched off five minutes after the ignition was off. >>
So it was no use at all if the vehicle was stolen ?
No, if the vehicle was stolen, the on board tracker would activate and should be able to be traced, the camera went off after 5 minutes of the ignition off,
Edited by primus 1 on 21/03/2021 at 14:28
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<< afaik, there was no parking mode as it switched off five minutes after the ignition was off. >>
So it was no use at all if the vehicle was stolen ?
No, if the vehicle was stolen, the on board tracker would activate and should be able to be traced, the camera went off after 5 minutes of the ignition off,
Yes, but just imagine what might be done with that audio + video evidence - but I guess the camera starts up again ?
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To all those happily acquiescing in a major invasion of privacy and evident lack of trust and respect on the part of security-obsessed and somewhat paranoid employers, I would like to ask the following:
Would you be happy for an employee of the company (possibly someone you don't know) to be sitting in the car, beside or behind you, with a camcorder, recording every minute of your journey, and then taking the recorded evidence to store it "somewhere" for a "certain" length of time, and only showing it to "people who need to see it", confident that nothing on that recording will ever resurface in a legal (or illegal) context, showing your face and bodily movements and revealing your voice, possibly many years from now.
What about the same level of surveillance in the workplace? Are we all okay about every single conversation, every single tic, gesture, cough, sneeze or belch being captured digitally and retained for evermore?
If so, then fine, let's go for it!
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Are we all okay about every single conversation, every single tic, gesture, cough, sneeze or belch being captured digitally and retained for evermore?
What makes you believe such material would be "retained for evermore"? Under DP legislation it must only be retained for as long as is reasonably necessary.
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(I meant to say "potentially retained for evermore".) There is a huge issue of trust involved in recording and storage of personal data, and with the best will in the world, mistakes can happen, systems can be hacked and files can end up where they shouldn't. I was made redundant from a management post in 2016 just as the company was beginning to gather and use data from phone and tollbooth transponder details, as well as phoning clients to check whether sales visits had in fact been made. None of this was done with consent or negotiation or any prior warning, which understandably caused ill feeling.
I always find it curious that attitudes to surveillance are so different from one country to another. Countries with a history of invasion, dictatorship or civil war see it as an oppressive measure of a creeping totalitarianism, yet in those same countries there is little opposiiton to ID cards. Britain is the other way round!
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I presume the thinking is that if everyone behaved 'in private' exactly as they would 'in public' transgression would cease - and there would be no need for surveillance. Sadly we all know human nature is different, more so in some than in others.
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I have had to explore CCTV footage for clues to incidents on site. Believe me it is the most boring, banal way to spend an unproductive few hours ever invented. If anyone wants to follow me around with a camera and record my antics then crack on. When looking for specific information on footage it requires some level of concentration and somebody swearing or f***ing does not really come into the equation. We kept vehicle camera footage for 1 year and site footage until 1 year after hand over. It was deleted after that. No use to man nor beast.
Cheers Concrete
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To all those happily acquiescing in a major invasion of privacy and evident lack of trust and respect on the part of security-obsessed and somewhat paranoid employers, I would like to ask the following:
Would you be happy for an employee of the company (possibly someone you don't know) to be sitting in the car, beside or behind you, with a camcorder, recording every minute of your journey, and then taking the recorded evidence to store it "somewhere" for a "certain" length of time, and only showing it to "people who need to see it", confident that nothing on that recording will ever resurface in a legal (or illegal) context, showing your face and bodily movements and revealing your voice, possibly many years from now.
What about the same level of surveillance in the workplace? Are we all okay about every single conversation, every single tic, gesture, cough, sneeze or belch being captured digitally and retained for evermore?
If so, then fine, let's go for it!
I see a tv programme in the making...??
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Its the lefties and union brigade who stir up this civil liberties. If you do your job diligently and don't abuse your employer's trust then you have nothing to worry about. I'm retired now but I ran my own company for over 25 years. Ended up with 16 employees. We had four cameras in the open plan office, arranged so that all computer displays were visible. When you haul someone into your office and show them a recording where they are spending an hour of company time on eBay and holiday websites there is no argument. They pack their stuff and then out onto the street!
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I found if you don’t trust people you don’t get employee loyalty
If you don’t trust them and they are loyal, they are not worth having
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I saw too many cases of people in the dealerships I worked in fiddling, nicking, etc, wish we had had video and microphones a few years back.
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Update -
A few drivers joined in protest and by 11am a meeting was hastily arranged where the company apologised for not consulting staff and had the tracker company return at the weekend to turn off the in vehicle cameras and microphones within the pool cars and pick ups.
The company will now look at the value of the in vehicle camera and microphone and committed to consult with staff
Looks like a good compromise for all concerned, he is happy they have come to their senses.
It’s amazing what you can achieve when you talk
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