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Toyota RAV4 - New Car - Swirl Marks - joegrundy

Following recent talk on rejecting cars, I noticed the 'Ask HJ' question from a chap who bought a new black RAV4, paid for ceramic paint treatment and 3 days later (first time in the sun) found it covered in very bad swirl marks and 'looks terrible'. He's a 'car polisher' and knows what a black car should look like. He's taken it back to the dealer and been told that they'll get 'some body shop person' to polish them out.

The advice is to let a bodywork specialist have a go at it, and if they can't remedy it satisfactorily 'you'll have strong grounds to reject the car or demand a sizeable discount'.

I was a bit disappointed with the answer TBH, on several grounds - not least the missed opportunities for good advice. My thoughts were:

1. Not a good idea to buy paint protection from the dealer. Often over priced. You don't know who's going to do it (the bloke who washes the cars on the forecourt?) or what they're going to use, or if they've done it before. Seriously? On your brand new £30,000+ car?

2. New paint takes time to harden properly. On a new car it's often recommended to gently wash and maybe use detailing spray only.

3. My understanding is that before a ceramic coat is applied the paintwork needs to be decontaminated and polished properly. Bet the dealer didn't do that.

4. It will probably need a two stage polish etc to correct. Likely to cost upwards of £600 including ceramic. Polishing will remove some clearcoat so your new car will have a thinner clearcoat (how much this matters depends on how much clearcoat is removed).

5. Any reasonable person would probably agree that a brand new car in this condition is not of satisfactory quality. There are grounds to reject it now. Letting anybody fiddle with it will only complicate things.

6. Practical advice should have been given. Take lots of photos highlighting swirls in whatever lighting best shows them up. Document everything. Give notice to the dealer that you are exercising your sort-term right to reject the car under CRA 2015.

7. (I know I always bang on about this, but it's important!). If you bought the car on HP/PCP the finance company not the dealer is liable. Give the finance company notice that you are rejecting the car and give them 7 days to say what they're going to do about it. It is up to them to refund you, or repair/replace if you're happy to accept that. Whether it's the dealer or the finance company, start with rejection -you can always compromise down to repair and partial refund if you wish.

Toyota RAV4 - New Car - Swirl Marks - joegrundy

Further to the above - a thought late in arriving -if the dealer has said he'll get some body shop person to polish it out he has accepted that the car is not of satisfactory quality as it stands (otherwise why offer to pay for remedial work?). Document that. Sufficient grounds for rejection - within the first 30 days you don't have to allow an attempt at repair.

Toyota RAV4 - New Car - Swirl Marks - Brit_in_Germany

I doubt any court would agree that swirl marks are an acceptable reason to reject a car. With the car being over the small claims court limit, do you want to risk having to pay the costs of the garage which would be tens of thousands of pounds?

Toyota RAV4 - New Car - Swirl Marks - Manatee

Comments:

The majority of customers either wouldn't have noticed, or wouldn't comment. Unfortunately this in a way sets the bar for what a reasonable person would expect.

However - chap demonstrated that the finish was of the essence by paying extra for paint treatment. This should if there's any justice give him/her a stronger position.

The dealer would probably argue that the offer to polish it is goodwill without admission of liability.

It's too late now, but I always assume that dealers can't be trusted to wash a car. One wash with a sponge or use of squeegee can be enough to cover a car in swirl marks. I let them wash our Outlander and Roomster after services (out in all weathers, rarely polished and frequently covered in pigeon droppings) but I forbid them to wash my MX-5 which I keep clean.

My own bias perhaps, but I think paint protection is a con. Buying it from a dealer will make it more expensive and as likely to do damage as prevent it.

There is already a lacquer coat. Paint thickness is typically not very thick at all these days, but thick paint just makes bigger chips. Paint protection's not a force field, it will still chip. It might be a bit easier to keep clean and shiny until the surface becomes less smooth, which will happen quite quickly.

Swirls are a fact of life and can happen even with careful cleaning. I use the two bucket method for washing the Mazda, with noodle mitts rather than sponges. It has a lot of light swirls because it was a dealer demo car. I haven't attempted to polish them out because I don't like to remove material - the paint is super thin. One or twice a year it gets a good wax - I clean the surface by claying, then use Snapseal followed by Naviwax. Until the wax wears off, the wax fills the tiny scratches and they are all but invisible. Because I keep it clean, I can wash it with a weak solution of Autoglym shampoo that doesn't seem to take the wax off, at least not all in one go.

I'm not a 'detailer', and I wouldn't go near it with a machine polisher - nor would I want anybody else to unless I knew for certain that they were competent. In this case, there's every chance that a machine polish by a randomly chosen 'specialist' will do more harm than good.

If it were me, I might try giving them the option of giving me £1000 to cover the refund of the treatment cost and rectification, or take the car back for a full refund. Accepting a 'fix' could be the start of a long and dispiriting saga.