So it hasn't actually failed an MOT, your mechanic though has checked the fluid and deemed it contaminated, possibly water content?
We'll assume you trust your mechanic and for good reason, so why not get the fluid changed anyway, if there is moisture present it won't do any part of the braking system any good, though two years does seem rather soon for it to be showing up, so who changed it last time?
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......if there is moisture present it won't do any part of the braking system any good, though two years does seem rather soon for it to be showing up, so who changed it last time?
You'd need a large amount of 'moisture' to reduce the boiling point down to anywhere near 110C, and the heat dissipating design of ventilated discs, brake shoes, pistons and calipers is such that heat transfer from the hot bits to the fluid is now minimal. You would have to brake hard and long to get the fluid to boil even if it was pure water!
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I've had total brake failure almost certainly due to wet brake fluid, so it can happen, but even if it couldn't, it causes corosion, so it wouldn't be an argument for not changing the fluid.
Admittedly I didn't have ventilated disks, but then I wouldn't want them.
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I've had total brake failure almost certainly due to wet brake fluid, so it can happen, but even if it couldn't, it causes corosion, so it wouldn't be an argument for not changing the fluid.
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So have i, total brake failure not realised until i was on a downhill slip road coming off the A1M at either Stevenage North or more likely Welwyn junctions, luckily i have never been one to leave braking till the last second so approach such junctions at sensible speeds, yes even in my younger days when i had my foolish moments too, thankfully the parking brake on Wartburg Knight was one of the best i've known and brought the car to a safe controlled stop, the brakes resumed normal working after a few minutes and i changed the fluid which saw no repeat.
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You had a Wartburg? The East German 2-stroke estate car?
As a fan of un-loved Sovs I rather liked the look of them, but probably wouldn't have fancied the 2-stroke engine much.
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You had a Wartburg? The East German 2-stroke estate car?
As a fan of un-loved Sovs I rather liked the look of them, but probably wouldn't have fancied the 2-stroke engine much.
Actually it was my sister's car and the saloon version, the later squared off body style in a rather nice dark red, i have an idea i'd borrowed it during the time after we'd just had the first child, my wife of the time obviously given up work, so we went for a while without a car, until i spotted a good old Landcrab up for sale for £80 needing a new clutch, which i duly fitted on our drive, and hand painted it with that dreadful Re-Paint to cover up the rust, was an excellent car.
The Wartburg was a better car than people might think, that 3 pot two stroke could really shift and a smooth runner benefiting from the free wheel device, give a Jag of the day a run for its money, i really liked it.
Edited by gordonbennet on 21/09/2019 at 15:34
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The Wartburg was a better car than people might think, that 3 pot two stroke could really shift and a smooth runner benefiting from the free wheel device, give a Jag of the day a run for its money, i really liked it.
That DKW egine was a good 'un, and I particularly approve of the economical coasting device;-)
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the day a run for its money, i really liked it. egine was a good 'un, and I particularly approve of the economical coasting device;-)
I loved the sound of the 3-pot 2-T in those and Saabs. Curiously, I had a set of new, Skoda front disc pads, that were also applicable to Wartburgs. Went to California I understand, still waiting for my pint in return!
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GF's neighbour had a 4-stroke SAAB that I coveted, wihich retained the freewheel.
Said it scared him so he didn't use it.
Waste of machinery, but he was probably brought up on engine braking.
Handbrake failed so he scrapped it. I had split up with GF by then so didn't hear about it in time. All vey sad.
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Yes it has failed the mot due to contaminated brake fluid. The mot guy took some out, tested it and failed the car.
My point is I didn’t realise that taking a sample of brake fluid from the reservoir and testing it was how they did it these days.
Edited by RobertT on 21/09/2019 at 11:17
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I would suggest you ask the tester where in the Mot test manual does it show that he is able to remove the reservoir cap and put in an electronic fluid tester . This is a Visual test only of the brake fluid.
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I would suggest you ask the tester where in the Mot test manual does it show that he is able to remove the reservoir cap and put in an electronic fluid tester . This is a Visual test only of the brake fluid.
Have they started following the rules lately? Clearly a lot has changed.
When Morris Marina's roamed the Earth I had an MOT tester hit my welds with a BFH for quite a long time before he got tired. (*So tired in fact that he didn't notice a shiny nail sticking out of one of the tyres until I pointed it out to him. I was afraid it was going to blow out and go into his skull.)
Don't think he was supposed to do that either.
OTOH, assuming the fluid tester is accurate (which might be quite a large assumption) where's the harm?
It'd be more objective than most of the stuff they do.
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The MOT Testers Manual specifically states that the master reservoir cap cannot be removed during a test.
Carrying out the test in any other way, including using a testing instrument, is not permitted. Anyone failing a test because it was carried out in this way would have perfect grounds for an appeal.
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OP, seems you have a cast iron case. Let us know how it turns out.
I'd say only bring your cast iron case if you dont plan to use that testing centre, or any of its friends and family ever again.
Cast iron cracks easily and is quite difficult to weld.
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On the other hand, many thanks to the observant mechanic who might just have saved you not only money in the long term by helping keep your brake system corrosion free, but reduced the possibility, remote as that may be, of reduced braking reliability in the future.
What i'm not clear about is was this simply a straight MOT test, or was this a check over followed by MOT test, or what? the OP states in one post "And mechanic nothing to with mot station", so unless it was at the same garage it seems an odd coincidence the tester was so concerned, unless of course the brakes were not up standard and the car not up to performance on the rollers.
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Just to confirm.
Mechanic has serviced the car for me and taken it to separate MOT test centre for me for last six years as part of the deal. I trust him implicitly. MOT test centre is nothing to do with him so he is independent from it..
This year he took it to the MOT test centre, as he always has done, and they failed it on contaminated brake fluid, which they tested as part of the test.
As I said before, my point is, I didn't realise that they could take a sample of your brake fluid and test it as part of the MOT.
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They can't. Also there is no approved Mot test tool to do this. On many modern cars the brake reservoir is buried behind loads of plastic covers .The tester is not allowed to remove these .
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I have a feeling there's more to this than maybe the OP knows, did the car fail on the roller brake test or did the tester feel there was too much brake travel i wonder, and OP's mechanic consulted with the tester in a professional colleague/courtesy way about possible issues?
I simply can't see an MOT tester going to such time consuming lengths unless there was a good reason, and seeing the chap who works on the car was in the front line, and not a general member of the public, whether some discussion and an agreed look see took place that would not have been the case if the OP himself had taken the car in.
Wonder what was submitted as the official failure warning?
Edited by gordonbennet on 22/09/2019 at 11:05
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Brake fluid contaminated [1.8(a)] on the Refusal Certificate.
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1.8 Brake fluid
The check of hydraulic brake fluid is confined to transparent reservoirs; reservoir caps should not be
removed.
Defect
Category
(a) Brake fluid contaminated
Major.
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So something must have been visible inside the 'transparent reservoir'. I wonder what ? Did the report say?
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The reservoir is about 200ml - syphon or suck the fluid out, replace it, and re-submit it. It's not worth getting bothered about - although I would report them to VOSA afterwards! If your mechanic has a good relationship with the garage, then he could ask them why they thought it was contaminated?
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My brake fluid reservoiur has some sort of gauze filter in the top of it, so you can't remove any.
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