Speed cameras on M25 and M1

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 08:22
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - daveyjp
I call it Fakebook.

The cameras are already live on the M1 and can be activated at any time for 'operational' reasons.
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Wed 9 Jan 2019 08:42
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - FP

Stuff like this has been appearing on Facebook and elsewhere since 2014.

As far as I know, there has been no recent change, though I'm sure that as time goes by more speed cameras are being deployed generally over the UK road network. I don't think there's any evidence they are "set" at 72 mph. A lot of the cameras on the M1 flash even when vehicles pass them going under the limit.

Edited by FP on 09/01/2019 at 08:47

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 09:08
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - V4 Heaven

To settle this, we just need a willing volunteer to drive through them at 80mph and report back to us two weeks later!

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 10:32
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - RickyBoy

... It's those pesky rectangular/yellow-painted one's* you've really got to watch out for, right?

*Although I ALWAYS 'obey' the overhead gantry one's too ...

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 11:00
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - craig-pd130

It would be surprising if the cameras were set to trigger at 72mph, as ACPO guidelines on speeding thresholds remain at 10% plus 2mph = 79mph

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 12:47
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - movilogo

I have already seen M1 gantry cameras flashing since a long time back.

They don't really flash unless you are going at high speed (> 80 MPH but not sure).

Since speedos overestimate speed, you are unlikely to be prosecuted unless over 80 MPH.

Edited by movilogo on 09/01/2019 at 12:53

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 14:12
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Mr Woo

I normally keep to 70 on motorways and am passed by most other vehicles so if 72 and above triggers the speed cameras they will be raking in a heck of a lot in fines.

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 17:17
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - concrete

I have witnessed the gantry cameras flashing. Difficult to know which vehicle triggered the camera when the motorway is busy. 72 mph is cruel. Speedometers are not that accurate so I would be surprised if they went to court with that evidence. On the M25 the gantry often shows limits of 40 or 50 or 60, which should automatically calibrate the cameras accordingly. The joke is of course that you are lucky to be travelling at 30mph on most of the M25 where the gantries are. Also the gantry messages are unreliable and often seem to have no basis at all. Makes it difficult to believe them when it is necessary!

Cheers Concrete

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Sat 12 Jan 2019 08:41
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - barney100

I try to stick at a real 70mph too which on mine equates to 75ish mph indicated on the speedo ..if I take the sat nav as accurate. It's like I'm sat still, vehicles fly past so if the post is accurate there will be speeding tickets in the post as fast as they can print them.

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Sat 12 Jan 2019 12:10
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Engineer Andy

What if your satnav isn't as accurate as you think it is? As I understand it, non-military satnav systems can only give your location to an accuracy of 5-10m on the ground, and double that in height (from the OS website). Other factors such as the surrounding trees, buildings, etc and actual orbital errors in the satellites themselves can lead to errors via bad reception/distortion of the GPS signal.

I've often noticed when using my satnav on holidays in the West Country that the indicated speed on the satnav varies as I so up and down a motorway incline or hill, whilst my actual speed on the speedo remains essentially constant.

As a result, I'm now far more wary of relying just on the GPS of my phone's satnav app, particularly if some police forces and their camera partnerships are going towards no tollerance enforcement: one enforced overtake or 1mph increase in speed when going down hill would result in 3 penalty points (every time, never mind the fine) and for what - getting to your destination a minute or two earlier. You could get banned in space of a few miles on some roads.

To me, just not worth the risk, especially as so many jobs depend access to a car/vehicle and I've seen colleagues get the sack for getting a driving ban (although that was for drink-driving).

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 17:38
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Engineer Andy

It would be surprising if the cameras were set to trigger at 72mph, as ACPO guidelines on speeding thresholds remain at 10% plus 2mph = 79mph

I was under the impression the trigger limit was whatever the local police authority set it to be, some seem to be, as you say, set at limit +10% +2mph (79 on the motorways), others only +5% +2mph (75-76mph). There was talk in the media not that long ago (last year?) about Plod being able to set all limits to 0.1mph above the actual limit.

As usual, we in the UK never do things rationally, e.g. a law states what can and cannot be done, rather leaving it to county councils' police authorities to decide and burying what has been in layers of red tape so very few people know what it is.

I would accept the +0.1mph if many of the camera locations (including mobile units) weren't used as revenue-raising exercises in artificially lower limit zones as opposed to a proven deterrant at accident blackspots where excess speed was the cause. I'd also be more sympathetic if the variable speed limits and those old speed limit matrix signs the small ones) actually worked properly and weren't about 15-30 mins out of date for their restriction/information.

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 22:58
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Andrew-T

<< I would accept the +0.1mph if many of the camera locations (including mobile units) weren't used as revenue-raising exercises in artificially lower limit zones >>

If you are saying that the penalty should be a custodial sentence, OK. If it's a fine, it becomes a 'revenue-raising exercise', which you dislike.

If it's a working deterrent I have no problem with it, either way. Drivers know the rules, some just don't see why they should be obeyed - or like getting caught.

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Thu 10 Jan 2019 12:14
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Engineer Andy

All I'm saying is that as long as speed limits are appropriate to the road/surroundings and the conditions, then I'd accept the consequences if the penalty was proportionate to the offence, whether a fine/pts or, in rare cases, a custodial or suspended sentence.

What I don't like are cameras set up where they don't reduce accidents (sometimes the opposite) by any meaningful amount and are there just to provide revenue. A fine won't be revenue if all it covers are costs in a case.

The problem is that is some areas, I've seen 60mph speed limits reduced to 40 (with cameras), supposedly to catch those going well over the old limit, but these people don't care and still will speed and drive dangerously. Many people slam on the anchors for the camera then floor it until the next one, making it far more dangerous a road than before.

One local case (near my parents' home) was like this and only enacted because a joyrider and some of their passengers were killed doing about 80mph (they lost control on a bend) at night on a 60mph single carriageway road. Exactly how reducing it to 40 would've stopped them doing so, given they were already 20 over the previous limit.

On many roads with reduced limits people actually now ignore them, except for the cameras, and I've seen several near misses as a result. Some people I've see driving now regularly keep their eye on the speedo rather than on the road and surroundings - FAR more dangerous than going a few mph over a limit but being aware of the road.

Less and less common sense these days.

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Thu 10 Jan 2019 18:16
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Davecp

There is still construction and use law that says speedos can be +10% so I think below 77 they will be difficult to make convictions stick if they are contested.

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 20:34
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Smileyman

Where on M1 and M25 .. it's highly unlikely all the motorways as different police authorities manage these motorways.

Whilst safety is obviously a major concern, traffic driving too slowly is as big a danger as too fast .. I've almost never heard of prosecutions for failing to make due progress, it's about time this selective enforcement was changed, let's see cameras flashing drivers who don't drive fast enough .. or stick to 50 in lane 2/3 forcing all the faster traffic to bunch (often dangerously) as they await their slots to pass.

And, ban the use of "reports of xyz" comments linked to lane speed reductions unless a maximum of 2 gantries from the offending item. Far too often the speed limit is reduced with no reason ever identified, justification attempted by a "cry wolf" comment

Edited by Smileyman on 09/01/2019 at 20:37

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 22:45
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - alan1302

Where on M1 and M25 .. it's highly unlikely all the motorways as different police authorities manage these motorways.

No where - it's not a true thing

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Wed 9 Jan 2019 22:50
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Senexdriver
There’s a programme on tv at the moment about the M25. It might be a repeat as I’ve seen it, or something similar, before. Anyroad, among other matters, it shows control staff watching tv screens all day every day, observing everything happening on the carriageway and responding to events. When I find myself driving along at a temporarily controlled speed for apparently no reason, I think of the people in the programme supposedly keeping watch and wonder if perhaps they have fallen into a trance through staring at the screens for so long. On an almost deserted M25 very late at night - a journey I make every couple of weeks - it is not unusual to find temporary speed limits in operation for apparently no reason at all. I have looked on the Highways Agency website to see if there is a feedback or comments section, but I can find none.
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Thu 10 Jan 2019 12:17
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Engineer Andy
On an almost deserted M25 very late at night - a journey I make every couple of weeks - it is not unusual to find temporary speed limits in operation for apparently no reason at all. I have looked on the Highways Agency website to see if there is a feedback or comments section, but I can find none.

Exactly my point as well, which is so many people don't obey the variable speed limits, and IMHO is sometimes dangerous and intimidating, when you've got an HGV up behind you 'encouraging' you to go faster.

Their speedo may be more accurate than mine, but would you take the risk, especially if cameras in different Police force areas may be calibrated to work at different speeds?

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Thu 10 Jan 2019 12:37
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - crazy_timbo

Is this solicitor related to the "friendly copper" who apparently told "all the army boys and girls" about the same thing? Or the vehicle recovery driver who told someone in a motorway service station? As these posst have been circulating since 2014 an have just re-surfaced I smell a hoax!

Edited by crazy_timbo on 10/01/2019 at 12:38

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Thu 10 Jan 2019 12:43
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - FP

"As these posst have been circulating since 2014 an have just re-surfaced I smell a hoax!"

As I said above.

It's either a hoax (if the original intention was to deceive), or an urban myth (if it's just some fake story that has somehow taken root). I suspect the latter.

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Thu 10 Jan 2019 18:17
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Davecp

There is still construction and use law that says speedos can be +10% so I think below 77 they will be difficult to make convictions stick if they are contested.

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Thu 10 Jan 2019 18:40
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Senexdriver
A year or so ago the stretch of the M3 I use to access the M25 completed its upgrade to smart motorway status. This was the culmination of 3 years’ work during which time a 50 mph limit applied, enforced by average speed monitoring. It was such a relief when the roadworks finished and the temporary limit was lifted, but there were dire warnings (on Facebook, I believe) that the upgrade had included a new type of speed camera that would stand no nonsense and automatically issue fines for any thing over 73 mph or some similarly stringent leeway.

As a habitual 80 mph cruiser I took notice and kept my speed at the limit until I noticed that many others were carrying on as before. I asked a local taxi driver I’m friendly with if he knew anything about the new cameras. He does regular Heathrow runs along the M3 and is usually well informed about anything that might impinge on his work, but he knew nothing about it. I have inevitably crept back up to my usual cruising speed and have heard nothing. I think certain individuals must derive some form of pleasure from inventing these scare stories. As time goes on they will become increasingly less credible, like the scam emails that used to proliferate, promising a share of a fortune in exchange for your bank details.
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Thu 10 Jan 2019 18:49
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Andrew-T

There is still construction and use law that says speedos can be +10% so I think below 77 they will be difficult to make convictions stick if they are contested.

Speedos are allowed to over-read 10% but not under. If you do a true 77mph then a legal speedo could show 77 to 84, in which case your defence might look a bit thin.

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Fri 11 Jan 2019 08:09
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - castleking

Having been nabbed at 56mph when the gantry in Northampton was showing 50, I attended the "Re-Education course".

There were some interesting bits about how the system works and a load of bull about other bits. e.g. I do not believe they slowed traffic in Luton to allow a distressed plane to land as all planes approach Luton from the east. Similarly I do not believe they set the limit to 50 in Leeds to reduce pollution for a primary school.

However there is no latitude and they are set by a control room who have no idea of the local conditions. If the sign says 50 make sure you are doing 50 when you pass the camera - a pair of big yellow boxes on the side of the gantry.

If you breakdown they can detect withing 2-3 mins that there is a problem in your lane and they will turn on the RED X.

Thanks

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Fri 11 Jan 2019 09:32
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - FP

"...all planes approach Luton from the east."

No. When the wind is from the east, the planes' approach is from the west. Seen it many times.

On my speed awareness course we were told the frequent 60 mph limit around Junction 11 (M1) is to reduce pollution near the Luton and Dunstable Hospital, which stands close to the motorway. No idea if it's true.

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Fri 11 Jan 2019 10:05
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Manatee

Having been nabbed at 56mph when the gantry in Northampton was showing 50, I attended the "Re-Education course".

There were some interesting bits about how the system works and a load of bull about other bits. e.g. I do not believe they slowed traffic in Luton to allow a distressed plane to land as all planes approach Luton from the east.

I expect they do, predominantly, the prevailing winds being westerly and the runway being 80/260 degrees. But there are frequent days when approaching aircraft pass over my house at 4000', 14 miles west of the runway and almost on the centreline.

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Fri 11 Jan 2019 10:14
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Bolt

www.express.co.uk/life-style/cars/1070488/motorway...n

I was reading about the cameras that detect those on the phone and take a picture to fine you but lost the connection/page so it looks like they are coming with speed cameras

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Fri 11 Jan 2019 10:58
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - movilogo

On my speed awareness course we were told the frequent 60 mph limit around Junction 11 (M1) is to reduce pollution near the Luton and Dunstable Hospital, which stands close to the motorway. No idea if it's true.

In that case why not put an information board on motorway. People are more likely to stick with limit then if they know the reason. It has been proven by researchers when an explanation is provided with a request, people are more likely to comply.

Unless this is just a money making exercise....

Emission is not directly linked to speed but more to engine RPM. If you do 50 MPH in 3rd gear, you will be releasing more harmful particles compared to doing it in 6th gear. Fuel economy will also suffer though.

Edited by movilogo on 11/01/2019 at 11:01

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Sat 12 Jan 2019 14:01
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Glaikit Wee Scunner {P}

M1 around Sheffield, 4 lanes, often has the limit clearly reduced at times to 60mph to control pollution levels. Traffic séems to slow down then.This is obviously better than the proposed permanent 60mph limit. When on the 70mph limit, the overhead signs state that pollution levels are being monitored. Many drivers still seem to drive cautiously for fear of triggering the 60mph limit.

Just my opinion.

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Sat 12 Jan 2019 15:46
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Engineer Andy

When I've driven round the M25 via the variable speed limit section, many drivers just seem to drive at whatever the indicated limit is plus 10% + 2mph shown on their speedo, sometimes more, seemingly getting away with it as well. That to me is taking rather a big risk. Even more so if such reports are to be believed.

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Sat 12 Jan 2019 16:15
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Bromptonaut

There were some interesting bits about how the system works and a load of bull about other bits. e.g. I do not believe they slowed traffic in Luton to allow a distressed plane to land as all planes approach Luton from the east.

I suppose it's possible when Luton is using 08 but the motorway is well over a mile from the runway threshold and if a crash short of runway is a possibility slowing traffic won't help.

They have though occasionally closed the M1 by East Midlands Airport while an emergency or precautionary landing takes place. There though the motorway is only a few hundred yards from the runway. There are approach lights on the embankment and the Kegworth crash 30 years ago is a clear warning of what can happen if it all goes wrong,

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Sun 13 Jan 2019 19:43
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - retgwte

The "yellow vests" in France have destroyed over 60 percent of French speed cameras. Wouldn't take much for similar to happen here.

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Mon 14 Jan 2019 07:55
Speed cameras on M25 and M1 - Chris Lockwood

I do a lot of motorway miles and have done so for many years. I have always set my cruise control to 79, even through the cameras and have never had a ticket. They are set to 10% + 2 and your speedo is usually off a little so if I set it to 79 I am probably doing more like 76-77.

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