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Right. a little bit of chemistry.
Firstly, combustion products (gasses) don't just stay in the cylinders, and go into the exhaust. They get by the cylinder walls, into the oil which is lubricating those walls, etc.
When you burn fuel, you get two primary products. Carbon dioxide (CO2) and water (H2O). My apologies, you can't do the 'subset' for the numbers for chemical formulae on here.
When an engine gets up to full working temperature, then those products in the oil get boiled off - literally. Which is why, if you take off the oil filler cap on a hot engine, you can often see a bit of steam. That's not oil at boiling temperature (oil boils at far higher temperatures, about 300 C), that is actually steam - boiling water vapour from combustion products.
If the engine doesn't get up to full temperature regularly, then that water will stay in the oil, and will end up looking like a classic case of HG failure, with 'mayo' under the oil filler cap.
I'm damn sure SLO has seen plenty of cases where an OAP's car which has been barely used has looked like it's got HGF - only for an oil change and some proper use to show that the car is actually perfectly fine.
That isn't some magical thing about oil degradation - it's combustion products (particularly water) not getting boiled off because the oil doesn't get past 100 C for long enough periods of time.
I suspect, John, in the case of your cars, you very rarely just run them for a mile or two - even though they do low annual mileages. If they are getting up to full working temperature then the problem just isn't going to happen.
It's a bit like the OAP who bought a modern, DPF-equipped diesel, and then used it for three or four trips to the shop each week - 2 mile round trips. Within a year the DPF was clogged up.
Another way of thinking of it is as if the exhaust isn't getting up to temperature. Eventually (though with modern stainless exhausts it's going to take a lot longer than with old mild steel ones) the exhaust will rust through from the inside out, from where water had condensed out due to the exhaust not being up to high enough temperature (think what happens if you vent steam onto cold metal, it condenses into water droplets). If the exhaust is at full temperature, however, then even when you switch the engine off the residual moisture will be boiled off the hot exhaust components and vented to the outside air.
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I suspect, John, in the case of your cars, you very rarely just run them for a mile or two - even though they do low annual mileages. If they are getting up to full working temperature then the problem just isn't going to happen..
Agree 100% - it does depend entirely on usage patterns. As another poster said above, if a car only does 1000 miles a year consisting of ten journeys of 100 open-road miles, then changing the oil annually is a waste of money because those are fairly ideal operating conditions, giving the oil time to lose its contaminants.
But if a car was doing 1000 track-day miles a year, regularly seeing peak-power rpm at full throttle, I would definitely change the oil every year because the more extreme stresses of racing conditions quickly degrade the oil and reduce its ability to maintain its film strength. In these applications, an oil change is cheap insurance when compared with the cost of an engine rebuild.
1000 miles a year made up of 300 journeys of just over 3 miles (presumably with a stop somewhere in each journey, too) will mean progrressive fuel & water contamination, plus all those cold starts with oil that is getting progressively contaminated. So again, an annual oil change is relatively cheap insurance - and would be paid for by the reduced expenditure in other areas such as tyre and brake pad replacements.
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If it does 5 journeys of 200 miles then yes
If it does 1000 journeys of 1 mile then no, it will probably look more like mayonaisse
Exactly, spot on.
Probably not. There might be some mayonnaise-like deposits around the filler cap and on the underside of the rocker cover, but I think the main body of oil would look a normal colour. All it would need is an enthusiastic journey of 100 miles or so for the water to evaporate. It takes a lot of water, e.g. from a failed CHG, to turn the oil creamy.
There is an alternative, why not change the oil. It will cost little more than driving 100 miles and will take less time.
But its wise to remove the rocker cover and check for deposits first, no point wasting money if its already goosed due to the lack of maintenance.
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Guys, can I just say, this is exactly how disagreements on this forum should be dealt with.
Thanks to RobJP and Skidpan who have avoided making personal and degrading comments to John F on this topic.
By the way, my twopenneth, short journeys where the engine and oil don't reach operating temperature are a sure way to reduce engine life and possibly bring on problems later in the car's life.
Changing the oil annually on a car covering low mileage will help to mitigate this, ask any mechanic.
Edited by 72 dudes on 25/09/2018 at 12:22
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Changing the oil annually on a car covering low mileage will help to mitigate this, ask any mechanic.
Dudes, I back up everything you say, with the qualification of 'low mileage made up of short trips'. Those of us who own elderly cars which see only occasional use try to get engine and exhaust fully warmed through on each excursion. IMHO there is then no need to change oil annually - it is the same as regular use over a longer time-span. Oil which gets fully warmed each time, and therefore stays largely free of volatiles, does not 'go bad' in the sump.
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When an engine gets up to full working temperature, then those products in the oil get boiled off - literally.
Been thinking about this and I see a few issues with this assumption.
Water boils at 100C. I have had 4 cars with oil temp gauges (5 if you include the Caterham but its not really applicable to a discussion about "normal road cars") so I will exclude it. The 3 Golfs ran for 99% of the time with an oil temp of 90 to 92 C. The only time I ever saw the temp go higher was on the M62 between Leeds and junction 22 which is the highest motorway in England. Its a steady climb (with a few downhills) for probably 25 miles and the oil temp would go as high as 110 C when towing the Caterham on the trailer (weighed about 1200kg). At this temp water would boil but at 90 C how much vapour would actually be released? The Leon never went above 95 C and that was after a 130 mile non stop motorway run (including the M62) at high ambient temps, within 2 miles of leaving the motorway it was back to 90 C.
Now to how fast the oil actually heats up. Cannot remember readings from the Golfs (they were owned continuously between 1984 and 2003) but on my 15 mile each way commute the Leon would just be reaching 90 degrees when I pulled onto the street. Most of that commute was on good A roads (dual and single carraigeway) with probably a mile before the office at lower speeds and the first 2 miles form home through town. Its surely doubtful that much, if indeed anything would evapourate from the oil in that period.
Next question is where does the water vapour go? It cannot go down the exhaust, gasses of combustion go out that way. The crankcase vents back ito the inlet via various pipes and valves to lower emmissions on modern cars so its not going to atmosphere. So it would seem that the only place for any water vapour to go is back into the engine via the inlet where some will no doubt get down the exhuast but some will end up back in the sump.
So to actually "dry" the oil out how long must you drive and how hot does the oil need to be?
Seems to me that its more proof that regular changes are essential to keep a healthy engine. But most of us know that without resorting to chemistry.
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When an engine gets up to full working temperature, then those products in the oil get boiled off - literally.
Water boils at 100C. It's a steady climb (with a few downhills) for probably 25 miles and the oil temp would go as high as 110 C when towing the Caterham on the trailer (weighed about 1200kg). At this temp water would boil but at 90 C how much vapour would actually be released?
But most of us know that without resorting to chemistry.
Skidpan, you seem to be under a misunderstanding. Water 'boils' when its vapour-pressure matches that of its surroundings, which happens to be at about 100C in a kettle at sea level. That doesn't mean it will not evaporate at lower temperatures: at 80C its vapour-pressure is about a quarter of its value at 100. It doesn't take long for wet roads to dry out after rain, and they will be nowhere near 100C, even in sunshine.
Water does not dissolve in oil, it only gets dispersed (unless there is enough impurity to make it emulsify (mayo)) and immediately 'boils off' again in a hot engine. It will escape via the breather and ultimately the exhaust.
Most of that is physics, not chemistry.
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oopsy... didn't read the full thread ..
Liam
Edited by liammcl on 29/09/2018 at 05:10
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Those of us who own elderly cars which see only occasional use try to get engine and exhaust fully warmed through on each excursion. IMHO there is then no need to change oil annually - it is the same as regular use over a longer time-span. Oil which gets fully warmed each time, and therefore stays largely free of volatiles, does not 'go bad' in the sump.
Well said. Also, most pensioners run cars with tiny engines with small oil capacity which heat up very quickly. And if anyone needs to learn about crank case ventilation, here is a useful link...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankcase_ventilation_system
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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crankcase_ventilation_system
The link is a bit old. The photo shows the valve in a V4 Taunus enigine in a Saab 96, a car of the 70's. Not had the type of PCV valve since a Mk 2 Escort. They were rubbish then and used to stop working, most ended up being removed. In the Caterham with the x-flow fitted the valve was removed and a hose vented into a suitably sized plastic container. The container was vented to allow and vapour toe escape but any liquids were collected. Still use the same system with the Zetec fitted, difference is the X-Flows tende to breath a bit even when heathy, the Zetec even when knackered does not.
Edited by skidpan on 25/09/2018 at 18:55
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Changing the oil annually on a car covering low mileage will help to mitigate this, ask any mechanic.
Dudes, I back up everything you say, with the qualification of 'low mileage made up of short trips'. Those of us who own elderly cars which see only occasional use try to get engine and exhaust fully warmed through on each excursion. IMHO there is then no need to change oil annually - it is the same as regular use over a longer time-span. Oil which gets fully warmed each time, and therefore stays largely free of volatiles, does not 'go bad' in the sump.
Indeed Andrew, I should have qualified that myself.
My SLK350 is a pampered third car which covers maybe 3000 miles per year, but it never does trips of less than 15 miles in one go. No need for an annual oil change, even my Merc indy specialist thinks that's too often.
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My SLK350 is a pampered third car which covers maybe 3000 miles per year, but it never does trips of less than 15 miles in one go. No need for an annual oil change, even my Merc indy specialist thinks that's too often.
I've rebuilt numerous engines an strongly disagree with the above. Short journeys generate condensation that may not have enough time to evaporate.- all sorts of issues follow:-
Blocked PCV(mayo) , oil contamination (water poor lubricant), fuel struggles to evaporate (if petrol - again poor lubricant), diesel never evaporates! (likewise poor lubricant.). Worst I saw was on a Ford Pinto where cam lubriation became blocked with what looked like toothpaste on a really low mileage Capri. What came out of the sump was something else.
Newer petrol direct injetion petrol cars hammer the oil even more - they are fuel effiiient but more petrol ends in the sump than with port inj.
Newer diesels also hammer oil during Active DPF regens - more as they age - and again diesel does not evaporate.
As for turbo pipes, gauzes et.......
You pays your money and takes your choice. Oil is cheap engines, gearboxes etc are not.
Edited by Big John on 25/09/2018 at 22:09
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Isn't that exactly why 72 dudes never does trips of less than 15 miles in his SLK?
I have a 2010 125i convertible in the same situation - my very good local BMW specialist (Eden Motors of Yeovil) are happy to advise me to go with the car's service indicator, as I don't do short trips in it. Fortunately in this area (North Dorset / Somerset / Wilts borders) it's still a pleasure to drive, and once you're out in it you don't want to do less than 20 miles.
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Oil is cheap engines, gearboxes etc are not.
Those were the words used over 30 years ago by my then boss, of without doubt the best maintained smallish (about 15) fleet of lorries in the county and one of the best in the country, i learned a lot there.
His policy, engine oils dropped at 15k miles, gearbox and diff at 45k, sold on usually after 7 years hard work at speeds far in excess of the easy running 55mph of todays vehicles, and generally trouble free in that time, sold to a queue of small hauliers and owner drivers eager to get their hands on them.
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My SLK350 is a pampered third car which covers maybe 3000 miles per year, but it never does trips of less than 15 miles in one go. No need for an annual oil change, even my Merc indy specialist thinks that's too often.
...........
I have a 2010 125i convertible in the same situation - my very good local BMW specialist (Eden Motors of Yeovil) are happy to advise me to go with the car's service indicator, as I don't do short trips in it.
Do I detect a glimmer of enlightenment.....folk not only coming round to my way of thinking but intelligently already practising it? I am ever hopeful for a revised encyclical from his HJness. (nice car Avant, if I ever disposed of the TR7 that sweet BMW 6cyl would be tempting).
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JohnF.
Not doing an annual oil change (presumably the owners are doing a change every 2 years using modern long life synthetic oils) is very different to only doing 3 (or is it 4 now) on your TR7 since 1980.
But it still stuns me why owners would need to save the cost of an oil change (DIY costs under £25 including filter even on a BMW using correct oils/filter) when the assett is worth many thousands.
And how owners can suggest the car has been "pampered" when they have omitted an essential annual service item shows how the description of a car is often only as honest as the owner feels it needs to be.
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And how owners can suggest the car has been "pampered" when they have omitted an essential annual service item shows how the description of a car is often only as honest as the owner feels it needs to be.
Understand your opinion Skidpan, but the SLK standard service regime is once every two years or evey 12,500 miles, whichever comes first. Mine has had 3 proper services using the best MB approved longlife oil in 4.5 years and 11,000 miles. I'd say that was pampered.
I suspect Avant's 125i has had similar treatment.
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I have ‘99 Alfa GTV 3.0. Currently on 75k Miles.
I do approx 2k per year all journeys at least 30 miles.
I always get the oil changed every year - costs me £50 at my local specialist.
I certainly believe my it’s good for my car. Certainly won’t do it any harm! But as mentioned above I have a full service book and folder full of receipts.
If there were two cars for the same for sale parked side by side I know which I would choose.
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Understand your opinion Skidpan, but the SLK standard service regime is once every two years or evey 12,500 miles, whichever comes first. Mine has had 3 proper services using the best MB approved longlife oil in 4.5 years and 11,000 miles. I'd say that was pampered.
I suspect Avant's 125i has had similar treatment.
I can remember back to my early days on this forum, think it was when I had the 118D. To ensure I got a change of oil every year (did not like the 2 year interval) I bought a Pela oil extractor and was widely aplauded on this very forum for ignoring the daft 2 year interval being specified by an increasing number of manufacturers at the time. I was only doing about 6000 or 7000 miles a year but the consensus was it was worth the cost of the oil to prevent future issues.
But now it seems that there are an ever increasing number of posters who think its OK to go with loger intervals so what has changed.
For the record I am not including JohnF's servicing interval in this discussion, the intervals he expounds are simply not worth even considering.
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Anyone old enough to have seen the black gunge in Ford 2.0OHC engines in the 1980s largely as a result of engines not heating up properly and inadequate maintenance would have had the message delivered to their pocket if they owned the car..
In the 1960s, I drove mid 1930s /early 50s cars with thermosyphon cooling - no water pump - and huge water capacity - several gallons. They rarely got warm in winter. When I did oil changes at c 1,200 miles, the Duckhams Q20-50 oil came out in lumps in the winter..Scrapyards then (and now) were filled with cars whose engines had a black gelatinous mess around the camshafts and cam followers.. Still happens..(I don't give much chance to low capacity turbo engines lasting with a quarter of that neglect.)
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In the 1960s................Scrapyards then (and now) were filled with cars whose engines had a black gelatinous mess around the camshafts and cam followers.. Still happens..(I don't give much chance to low capacity turbo engines lasting with a quarter of that neglect.)
The engines might well have been OK as long as oil was still being pumped round. About 20yrs ago I took the rocker cover off my son's newly acquired ancient Pug 309 pushrod OHV engine (his older brother's Pug had the newer OHC TU engine) to adjust the clearances, as it was sounding like a bag of nails. There were thick deposits of gunge like stiff granular Marmite which was best removed with a desert spoon. Also at least one blocked feed to the rockers. Reset the clearances, and after several more years of abuse the engine was still fine when it was disposed of. But I doubt if such copious deposits could form these days with modern designs, more complete fuel combustion and better oils.
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I have ‘99 Alfa GTV 3.0. Currently on 75k Miles. I do approx 2k per year all journeys at least 30 miles. I always get the oil changed every year - costs me £50 at my local specialist. I certainly believe my it’s good for my car. Certainly won’t do it any harm!
Yes, of course it won't do it any harm. Changing oil every 3 months won't do any harm, but there is a point of diminishing returns. Various people on here have different opinions about where their returns start to diminish. There's little point arguing about when that is - it's just that a year or 6K miles (or whatever) is a sensible compromise.
End of.
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JohnF.
Not doing an annual oil change (presumably the owners are doing a change every 2 years using modern long life synthetic oils) is very different to only doing 3 (or is it 4 now) on your TR7 since 1980.
But it still stuns me why owners would need to save the cost of an oil change (DIY costs under £25 including filter even on a BMW using correct oils/filter) when the assett is worth many thousands.
Because it's the lease company's problem, and the next owners
The paint has been cleaned and the inside has been vacuumed = cherished.
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I had a bit of a shock only a few years ago when i called at my MB indy's workshops, there he had one of two V12 6 litre engines stripped out completely oil bound due in to black death, again people thinking £50 worth of engine oil a year was wasted money and a £20k engine virtually scrap was presumably better value.
I wouldn't mind but as Skidpan noted above, and especially if you buy the stuff when on offer and/or in bulk, its so cheap as simply to not be worth the risk.
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Still happens..(I don't give much chance to low capacity turbo engines lasting with a quarter of that neglect.)
And that is the whole point, surely only a total idiot would spend a large portion of their income buying a car and then neglect it to the point of destruction.
But it still happens, some owners think that passing an annual MOT is all a car needs to ensure reliability. There have been more than a few on here who have bought cars with a good MOT thinking that its a guarantee of a trouble free life and then been shocked to find its not.
We now have our 3rd VAG TSi and it will be maintained to the letter with fixed interval (annual or 10,000 miles) servicing. The flexible nonsense saves very little (if anything) since the cost of one intermediate variable service is approx the cost of an oil service and an intermediate service on the fixed system. Not sure how the cost of the intermediate + major fixed compared to a major intermediate, not done the research. The only advantage the variable give you is less time in the garage.
Our Superb came set on Fixed and had its first service at 12 months old with less than 10,000 miles on the clock. I discovered only last week (when looking for Android Auto settings) that they had changed it to Variable when they reset the computer and on Monday this week I went and had a discussion with the service manager. I bought a service plan when I bought the car and after a similar issue with the Seat I expected to be told the plan was invalid, sorry mate, you will have to pay again later (Seat eventually agreed the garage was wrong and compensated me to the tune of £200). But the Skoda dealer apologised and confirmed in an e-mail that I should ignore the display and take it for a service in February as per the plan.
The oil in the Seat and Skoda after 12 months has still been pretty golden, no different to a N/A petrol thus providing its changed regularly I would not expect owners to suffer any more issues than other engines.
Considering that 5 litres of VAG spec oil can be had for around £23 (Total) or less if you go to a supermarket why would anyone want to risk the consequences of reduced maintenance.
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JohnF.
Not doing an annual oil change (presumably the owners are doing a change every 2 years using modern long life synthetic oils) is very different to only doing 3 (or is it 4 now) on your TR7 since 1980.
Yet again misquoting me. Just for the record, changes plus new filter almost annually when used regularly till 1990 at 51,000m. Four changes since then, last change Apr 2013 at 66,666m. Never more than 6,000m between any change, often much less. Current mileage 70,400. Oil still oily. Engine still enginey.
It's not just the unnecessary cost for most low mileage drivers - who are often young poor or old poor (and I take the point that oil is cheap if you can do it yourself), it's also the hassle. If I had changed the oil every year of its 38yr life, I would have wasted not just hundreds of pounds but also a considerable time of my life.
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Yet again misquoting me. Just for the record, changes plus new filter almost annually when used regularly till 1990 at 51,000m. Four changes since then, last change Apr 2013 at 66,666m. Never more than 6,000m between any change, often much less. Current mileage 70,400.
OK I apologise for misquoting you. I got the 4 changes bit correct. Over the last 28 years an average of 7 year between changes if you change it again today. That is absolutely crackers.
Oil still oily.
Have you had it analysed to prove this or it it simply because it feels OK on the dipstck.
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<< Have you had it analysed to prove this or it it simply because it feels OK on the dipstick. >>
Sounds a bit like clutching at straws there, Skidpan ... I suspect you might not credit JohnF's results if he gave them. Middle name not Vladimir, is it ? :-)
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Have you had it analysed to prove this or it it simply because it feels OK on the dipstck.
Back in the early 90's a mate of mine was a very keen club racer and very good at it as well. Only last week I was watching the Goodwood Revival on the box and 2 of the chaps he had some real good races with back then (and beat) were out in cars that were worth more than our street, you don't get invited to drive those if you are a muppet.
Midway through a season he bought himself a nice new engine to ensure he would have a better shot at the championship. It cost him £6000 near enough and was as good as (theoretically) as the regs allowed. Unfortunately he listened to a bloke in the local pub who told him that using new oil would not allow the engine to run in correctly so since the engine was drysumped he simply left it in the oil tank.
In truth there was no need to run the engine in since it had been done by the builder on the dyno and was ready to race.
First race meeting and 10 minutes into practice he pulled off, no oil pressure. Removed oil filter and it was obviously clogged so borrowed a new one form another competitor and oil pressure was back. Went out and won the race.
Next meeting the engine went bang in a big way and as luck would have it (for the engine builder) he was there to "help". He took the car back to his workshops and discovered metal in the oil and when stripped the crank was in a bad way along with the cam and other parts. Luckilly pistons, rods and head were fine. As some will know you don't get much (if any) warranty on race car parts due to the environment they are used in but as part of his normal routine the builder sent the oil away for analysis. Basically it was goosed and was obviously older than it should have been in an engine that had probably done 1 part practice and a 10 lap race and another practice and pqart of a race, under 50 miles.
I appreciate its more extreme on the track than the road but it shows how using old oil can be costly, over £3000 in this case.
The best bit, the championship had Millers Oils as a supporter and top 3 finishers in each class were given free oil as part of the support. He had a garage full of their best (90's best that is) synthetic, he did not need to buy oil.
And good news, he won his championship class and the next year the title outright.
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Sounds a bit like clutching at straws there, Skidpan
The hypocracy on this site is unbelievable at times.
For many years the advice was to ignore such manufacturers as BMW and do an oil change every year, I was changing mine annually before joing this site.
Now it seems that its OK to leave oil in 2 years or more.
But I suspect its more to do with posters trolling than giving sensible advice.
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<< Now it seems that its OK to leave oil in 2 years or more. >>
It can be - in certain circumstances, which we have all heard in detail many times. Now can we let this one lie ??
By the way, what is hypocracy? Sounds like an unpleasant strain of government :-)
Edited by Andrew-T on 29/09/2018 at 19:00
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"The hypocracy on this site..."
Who is being hypocritical and how?
"... posters trolling..." This implies putting something online for its emotional effect, not because it's a sincere opinion. Again, what exactly are you talking about?
On the face of it, it just seems as if you're having a moment of general grumpiness, unless you're really just having another go at John F and anyone sympathetic to him. But what that has to do with posters of years ago saying something different I've no idea.
Edited by FP on 29/09/2018 at 20:42
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I have a theory that an unknown person has hijacked Skidpan's identity and is contributing posts just to discredit his good name ..... :-)
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What a lovely thought Andrew!
"By the way, what is hypocracy? Sounds like an unpleasant strain of government :-)"
Literally, from Greek, hypo = too little: cracy comes from kratos = power
So hypocracy could mean ineffective government...…. I wouldn't of course dream of making a political point.
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My fil has his oil/ filter changed every year regardless of mileage, usually around 80miles a year now he has retired, he has a Toyota Yaris 54 plate just hit 52k, 1.3, still runs like new and never had a breakdown.
But some people do not believe in servicing a car until it breaks down of which I know a few, but as they are so convinced its cheaper to do this I find its easier to let them get on with it.!
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I don't know about diesels with their propensity for diluting their oil with fuel and polluting it with carbon, but if a high mileage petrol engine in an almost worthless old car is so worn that it is approaching the tolerance level of 1000Km per litre of oil (VW), or even only burning a litre per 2000miles, I think there is a rational scientific and economic argument to made for just changing the filter every 10,000m and not bothering to change the oil at all unless it looks really black. I might do that if our old Focus engine gets that worn, and we still have it.
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I think there is a rational scientific and economic argument to made for just changing the filter every 10,000m and not bothering to change the oil
But perhaps not an environmental argument?
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I think there is a rational scientific and economic argument to made for just changing the filter every 10,000m and not bothering to change the oil at all unless it looks really black
Wouldn`t be the first time anyone has done that, and used to be common practice in the 80s, certain garages I worked for (car hire firms) around that time would only change oil if it was black, but changed filters every service
we did notice during the year tappet and cam wear was worse on those cars, management weren't interested...
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So hypocracy could mean ineffective government...…. I wouldn't of course dream of making a political point.
Avant, I thought that by now we might have received a hypocratic oath, but it seems that one is not forthcoming ....
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When I was an apprentice a friend of the family managed a fleet of Mk3 Cortinas for a large company which had its own car maintenance facilities. He took part in a project where he was offered free oil in exchange for regular reports on the vehicles. For each vehicle they required a log of miles covered and type of usage plus regular testing of samples from the dipstick taken with a wipe of paper strip which was supplied. The agreement was that when the wipes showed a colour change the oil was drained and a small sample retained for the oil company to analyse. The cars used for long runs were drained around 25K miles and the local hacks confirmed Fords standard time or mileage recommendations. Since his company did all routine maintenance there was no incentive to switch to the more expensive oil when the project ended.
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I think there is a rational scientific and economic argument to made for just changing the filter every 10,000m and not bothering to change the oil at all unless it looks really black
I honestly did not think it possible to another poster to submit an idea as dumb as those submitted by JohnF.
Bit here it is, proof there is another idiot, what a total muppet.
Avant, considering you told me in a private message you were monitoring JohnF's posts for dangerous suggestion I would ask you to edit comments like the one above as well.
Whilst its not actually dangerous I cannot honestly see why any person with as little as 1/2 a brain cell would think it a good idea and would in any way contribute to trouble free motoring.
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You're the only muppet on this site pal and you come across as rude with it. No need to "out" a PM sent to you by the moderator either.
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<< I honestly did not think it possible to another poster to submit an idea as dumb as those submitted by JohnF. But here it is, proof there is another idiot, what a total muppet. >>
I was thinking of responding to this garbage, but there clearly is no point. We have all been round this loop of cheap insults many times, so I will leave it at that.
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I must remember not to share anything in confidence with you, skidpan. Admittedly it's not very likely.
You do love to rake it up and create a bit of aggro wherever possible. I see you've not made too many mates on the Skoda forum either. Same sort of approach there as here. Same reference to your 44 years of experience .... etc etc ....
I'd have thought this topic has run it's course. No-one's gonna change JohnF's mind and I suspect most others will do as was was suggested a short time ago - it gets done as and when necessary .... and if that means sticking to the recommended schedule then so be it - and if others want to leave it for ages (for whatever reason) then let them also carry on carrying on.
EDIT. On reflection it might be that some of the comments are best off culled. [ and before anyone else says it ... mine could well be included :-) ]
Edited by KB. on 01/10/2018 at 18:37
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A private message is exactly that, on other forums a poster who revealed the contents or part thereof would be an ex poster in short order.
I imagine this thread will now be locked.
As a general comment, this place was always one where some restraint was to be found, making it a better experience than some others where nasty aggressive remarks were regular, it would be a shame if this continued here because i for one would like to continue enjoying coming here waffling about cars or general stuff.
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I see you've not made too many mates on the Skoda forum either
There are idiots on there as well, one last week took exception to my comments regarding the reliability of the 7 speed DSG but another poster quickly agreed with my posts and he appears to have gone.
The score in the panel at the side of your post give an indication about your reputation, mine is a pretty good 3.3 so far. Not trying to get points but if people like what I say its nice to be appreciated.
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Some like to blow their own trumpet. Others have a euphonium.
Time for me to withdraw ... I'll leave skidpan to have the last word.
(the Skoda site has an "ignore" button - I don't contribute there all that often but it's a handy facility).
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