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Mon 23 Jul 2018 23:02

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

im trying to find out what my rights are under the consumer rights act 2015.

ill try and bullet point rather than a huge storey.

bought the car in march (snow on the ground then) everything was fine. I commented at the time i couldnt test the aircon because it was so cold

independednt inspection dated 6 months previous says aircon was working (not including gassing)

weather warms up and i start using the aircon. notice there was a whiring sound when its turned on and revs drop suggesting compressor kicks in. within a week or so this stops so i take it to dealer for regassing

that lasted a couple of weeks so take it for diagnosing. condenser and receiever pipe is corroded

the car has a 15 month warranty but not covering corrosion

used car dealer says 'his legal team' this is classed as service parts so they are not liable.

from what i have read i have 6 months to get the dealer to repair faults that were there when i bought the car. i would argue that with that amount of corrosion it woukd have been there when i bought the car.

can anyone advise me on this?

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 00:11

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - elekie&a/c doctor

I think you have to consider what is reasonable for a 10 year old car. It is unlikely the dealer will pay for all the repair but he may make a contribution.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 00:18

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - SLO76

You need to use your air con at least once a week even through the winter or any number of problems will arise, from failed seals to a knackered compressor. Dealers really should tell buyers this when they buy a car with it fitted (I certainly did) but few know one end of a motor from the other so they don’t.

As for your rights, well age, mileage and price paid are all factors here. Being an FR-V it has to be 10yrs old or older so is it really reasonable to expect the air con to be the dealers responsiblity after almost 5mths? How much did the car cost, was it a £2k cheapie or a late model at top money? If the former then I’d say it was unrealistic and unreasonable to expect the dealer to pay if the latter then you have an argument but even at that it is an old car and likely working well in every other respect which is the best you can expect on a car over a decade old.

Few used car warranties, especially on cars of this age are actually worth the paper their printed on and it’s certainly not going to cover anything beyond the basics, even at that it’ll have a very limited claims limit. But then would you have been willing to pay substantially more upfront to have this cover? 99% of buyers at this end of the spectrum (sub £5k aren’t)

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 10:03

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - barney100

Buy the car, drive away, find a fault later and getting any recompense from a dealer large or small is very difficult. I've just had this from Mercedes and their customer service is carp. They have 'policies' which means you end up paying no matter what. Small dealers can be harder still. I've had a few altercations with dealers and haven't got very far.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 10:18

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - Steveieb

I love these cars Barny like you.

Where did you eventually find it ? What model and year etc and price ?

Are there any still at main dealers ?

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 11:21

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

The car only has to be of a standard a reasonable person would expect. I don't think a corroded condensor and/or pipe is particularly exceptional at this age (many go well before) and I think just one of those things with an old car.

All the dealer is obliged to do is provide a 10 year old car with all the issues, worn out bits, corroded bits or whatever a 10 year old car has. There is no obligation for it to be perfect or not need work.

If you have a specific warranty (which is not the same as your consumer rights) that may be different.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 16:19

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

if it is advertised as having air con should this not be fit fpr purpose under the consumer acr 2015?

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 18:15

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

if it is advertised as having air con should this not be fit fpr purpose under the consumer acr 2015?

Not really, no. Even then, it only has to be a 10 year old aircon system with all the caveats which go with it.

Frankly, on older cars, the CRA proetcts the seller from unreasonable expectations more than buyer unless it blows up 1 week after purchase.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 17:12

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - barney100

Lots around, main dealers, indies....best bought in winter when they may go down in price a bit.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 16:10

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

You need to use your air con at least once a week even through the winter or any number of problems will arise, from failed seals to a knackered compressor. Dealers really should tell buyers this when they buy a car with it fitted (I certainly did) but few know one end of a motor from the other so they don’t. As for your rights, well age, mileage and price paid are all factors here. Being an FR-V it has to be 10yrs old or older so is it really reasonable to expect the air con to be the dealers responsiblity after almost 5mths? How much did the car cost, was it a £2k cheapie or a late model at top money? If the former then I’d say it was unrealistic and unreasonable to expect the dealer to pay if the latter then you have an argument but even at that it is an old car and likely working well in every other respect which is the best you can expect on a car over a decade old. Few used car warranties, especially on cars of this age are actually worth the paper their printed on and it’s certainly not going to cover anything beyond the basics, even at that it’ll have a very limited claims limit. But then would you have been willing to pay substantially more upfront to have this cover? 99% of buyers at this end of the spectrum (sub £5k aren’t)

its a 2009 top spec model

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 16:24

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - Scirocco

It's hard to say but the fault could well be caused by you not using the air con - as others have said this should be used all year - it's not just for hot weather, aircon set to a warm temperature in winter will dehumidify your car. Once you've got it fixed don't turn it off

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 17:12

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - Bladerrw

My advice is fix it yourself. How much is it - a couple of hundred quid? Given the current temperatures, I fear for you driving around without AC.

I bet this forum is shaken to its very core that a Honda has gone wrong. If it's a petrol version as well then some forumites may have to be resuscitated. ;-)

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 18:16

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

My advice is fix it yourself. How much is it - a couple of hundred quid? Given the current temperatures, I fear for you driving around without AC.

I bet this forum is shaken to its very core that a Honda has gone wrong. If it's a petrol version as well then some forumites may have to be resuscitated. ;-)

Honda aircon system actually go wrong a lot. Accords, Cibics, CR-Vs all common. The condensors are prone to rot quite early and also the compressors are prone to siezing.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 22:30

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

My advice is fix it yourself. How much is it - a couple of hundred quid? Given the current temperatures, I fear for you driving around without AC.

I bet this forum is shaken to its very core that a Honda has gone wrong. If it's a petrol version as well then some forumites may have to be resuscitated. ;-)

no its a 2.2 diesel. great car other than this. im tempted to fix it if i can get my mechanic mates to help.

as an update the dealer has sent (without talking to me 1st) a condenser as a good will gesture.

my thoughts were either a) hes been generous because he doesnt have to do anything

or b) hes been crafty by trying to keep me sweet because the dealer should have it repaired :-)

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Wed 25 Jul 2018 06:05

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - SLO76

“my thoughts were either a) hes been generous because he doesnt have to do anything”

He’s been quite decent. Better than 90% of dealers with regard to a near decade old car.

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Tue 24 Jul 2018 22:26

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

It's hard to say but the fault could well be caused by you not using the air con - as others have said this should be used all year - it's not just for hot weather, aircon set to a warm temperature in winter will dehumidify your car. Once you've got it fixed don't turn it off

it had been on constantly even during the cold weather. i just couldnt tell if it was blowing cold air because of the outside temp

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Wed 25 Jul 2018 14:10

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - alan1302

It's hard to say but the fault could well be caused by you not using the air con - as others have said this should be used all year - it's not just for hot weather, aircon set to a warm temperature in winter will dehumidify your car. Once you've got it fixed don't turn it off

it had been on constantly even during the cold weather. i just couldnt tell if it was blowing cold air because of the outside temp

You could have put it on for 30 seconds to test it

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Wed 25 Jul 2018 16:52

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

as an update-

i spoke to citizens advice who transferred me to consumer advice.

They told me I do have the legal right to a repair or replacement within the 1st 6 months.

They advised me on a letter to write and give them 7-14 days to repsond. If they do not comply then i have the right to some money back. if this fails the last stage is the car being returned for a full refund

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Thu 26 Jul 2018 00:42

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

as an update-

i spoke to citizens advice who transferred me to consumer advice.

They told me I do have the legal right to a repair or replacement within the 1st 6 months.

They advised me on a letter to write and give them 7-14 days to repsond. If they do not comply then i have the right to some money back. if this fails the last stage is the car being returned for a full refund

Be careful with CA on this. They tend to give out d***** advice on used cars over a few years old. They trot out the same stuff whether a 6 month old car or a 16 year old one. You have no legal right to repair or replacement for 6 months.

It simply isn't in the act. If the product (whatever it is) is to a standard a reasonable person would deem satisfactory then the product is satisfactory. Simple as that. Many would deem a 9-10 year old car 3-4 years from the average age of scrapping to simply be satisfactory by starting. It is quite acceptable for older cars to need mainenance and replacements during the firtst 6 months unless an exceptional item.

I reckon if this ultimately went to court you'd really struggle. The dealer may cave in to get rid of you but if they dig their heels in not sure you've got much of a case. Sorry.

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Thu 26 Jul 2018 00:44

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

Incidentally, you have no right to a full refund if it's over 30 days. You simply don't. If CA told you this they should be shot.

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Thu 26 Jul 2018 13:57

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

i did ask the question on the phone "is that my legal right to have the dealer repair the problem within 6 months" he said yes. how can CA offer legal advise on this if it is false?

im confussed now to be honest. ive got official advise telling me one thing but all of the general population telling me something else

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Sat 28 Jul 2018 16:05

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

i did ask the question on the phone "is that my legal right to have the dealer repair the problem within 6 months" he said yes. how can CA offer legal advise on this if it is false?

im confussed now to be honest. ive got official advise telling me one thing but all of the general population telling me something else

I'm not sure I'd call Citizens Advice "official". It's basically a charity with volunteers ususually wokring for free who are generally well meaning lay people.

The problem is Consumer Legislation is written to apply to a new Airbus and a M&S pair of socks in the same way so once you start applying it to a used car it is a minefield.

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Thu 26 Jul 2018 13:59

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - scfc_151

Incidentally, you have no right to a full refund if it's over 30 days. You simply don't. If CA told you this they should be shot.

he said this would be the final stage. i asked if that is the case after 30 days. he said yes

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Sat 28 Jul 2018 16:02

honda frv - air con fault 3 months after purchase - pd

Incidentally, you have no right to a full refund if it's over 30 days. You simply don't. If CA told you this they should be shot.

he said this would be the final stage. i asked if that is the case after 30 days. he said yes

He's simply wrong. After 30 days you do not have the right of a full refund. It is in fact the only single line in the whole Act specific to cars.

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